TROMBONE-L Digest 1553 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) RE: Euph info needed by richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL 2) RE: Euph info needed - valves by richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL 3) RE: Euph info needed by Stephen Troy 4) For Sale: Doug Elliott LT99 Rims by Chris Waage 5) Re: Rimsky-korsakov by "Moran, Doug - Denison" 6) END OF YEAR ISSUES by Listmonitor Trombone-L 7) Great music source (was Rimsky-korsakov) by Mike 8) now, now Adrian by Charles 9) Re: now, now Adrian by Mike 10) RE: Euph info needed - valves by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 11) Y2K compliance by Mike 12) Screw Bells by Chris Waage 13) Re: Screw Bells by Steve Butterworth 14) Y2K Trombone Compliance by Steve Butterworth 15) Re: Screw Bells by Chris Waage 16) Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance by Chris Waage 17) Re: Screw Bells by Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur 18) Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance by "Dynamic Music Publications" 19) Re Euph info by Scott Moore 20) RE: Screw Bells by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 21) no more by Charles 22) Re:Y2K Compliance by Yoda505@aol.com 23) Lessons by REOnofreyJ@aol.com 24) Re: no more by Steve Butterworth 25) Re: no more by REOnofreyJ@aol.com 26) Re: Screw Bells by "David Carter" 27) Re: Screw Bells by David Buckley 28) Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance by "Adrian Drover" 29) Re: Screw Bells by "Adrian Drover" 30) Re: Screw Bells by Mike Coyle 31) AFM Airline Baggage Project Info by Randy Campora 32) Back on tthe list by eanogmus@netvision.net.il (Eliezer Aharoni) 33) Trombone playing tips by FOpal@aol.com 34) Re: Trombone playing tips by NHSGrizzly16@aol.com 35) fixhappy by Eric Burger 36) Music store in London by "Peter Jarnebrant" From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 07:38:00 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL To: sctroy@erols.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Euph info needed Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082E40@LEE2> It is theoretically possible to play the G in tune, also. However, I have never heard anyone do it, either by lipping or choice of valves. One of the joys of the euphonium world. I'm with Ken, put a 2G in a 42-B or 88-H and the only way they can tell the difference, is that you play F# and G in tune. yours, tim richardson > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephen Troy [SMTP:sctroy@erols.com] > Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 6:29 PM > To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu > Subject: Re: Euph info needed > > At 05:00 PM 12/27/99 -0000, Adrian Drover wrote: > > > >Besson Sovereign > >Because it's the best. > > > >Adrian > > > Arian is correct, as usual. > > I've played them all - Yamahas have great intonation, Willsons are good > but > way overpriced. But the one that has the sound you will fall in love with > is the Besson 967GS (and the 968GS). A classic euphonium sound that is > just plain wonderful. Even with me playing it. All you have to do is > learn to lip down the upper F's to get them in tune. > > > Steve Troy > From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 07:45:29 -0500 From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL To: sctroy@erols.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Euph info needed - valves Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082E41@LEE2> Okay, serious answer this time. I played a Besson for a while and really liked it. Everything but the valves, I never got them really working right. Of course it was an older horn and had had some student treatment, but I came to think much of the problem might be my fingers. Due to playing a number of sports with more enthusiasm than skill, my finger joints aren't exactly parallel. I theorize the side load on the pistons makes them wear and stick, and that people like me would be much better off with rotary valves. Anybody else run into this? yours, tim richardson > -----Original Message----- > From: Stephen Troy [SMTP:sctroy@erols.com] > Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 6:29 PM > To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu > Subject: Re: Euph info needed > > At 05:00 PM 12/27/99 -0000, Adrian Drover wrote: > > > >Besson Sovereign > >Because it's the best. > > > >Adrian > > > Arian is correct, as usual. > > I've played them all - Yamahas have great intonation, Willsons are good > but > way overpriced. But the one that has the sound you will fall in love with > is the Besson 967GS (and the 968GS). A classic euphonium sound that is > just plain wonderful. Even with me playing it. All you have to do is > learn to lip down the upper F's to get them in tune. > > > Steve Troy > From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 08:06:38 -0500 From: Stephen Troy To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Euph info needed Message-ID: <3.0.2.32.19991228080638.0092cd50@pop.erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Tony Clements said: "Ya know, I HATE having to screw with intonation on OPEN notes. I have played MANY compensation euphoniums that have SHARP (!) 6th partials. I am NOT going to spend upwards of 4 grand on a horn that has intonation THAT bad." and "My cheapie little 321 has great pitch and I'm not going to trade the Besson sound for lousy pitch." Tim Richardson said: "It is theoretically possible to play the G in tune, also." Adrian Drover said: "I seem to remember a local euph expert telling me he plays this note on the 4th valve instead of open." On my Besson 967GS, the upper "F" is 10 cents sharp (I guess I should state this in shillings, since it's a British product, but I don't have my currency translation chart handy). It isn't that much work to lip it down when needed. On sustained notes, I do play it with the 4th valve. However, the high G is dead-on on my Besson. Anyone ever check their 6th partial F on their trombone on a tuner? It's sharp on almost all trombones to some degree, yet I never see anyone play it in a slightly flat first position. So most trombonists must be "lipping" it into tune. Yes, the Yamaha 321 (and the 621 and 641 and all the others) does have great pitch. But I made the decision to go with the sound of the Besson over the pitch of the Yamaha. Once I "learned to play the horn" the Besson pitch problems became quite controllable and I had that great Besson sound I was looking for. I had a Willson before the Besson, and I think the Besson has a far richer sound than the Willson I had. But that's only why I play a Besson. Tony, just play some of each and make your own decision. If you find the horn you really like, who cares what brand it is? Tim Richardson said: "I'm with Ken, put a 2G in a 42-B or 88-H and the only way they can tell the difference, is that you play F# and G in tune." On my Edwards, a 2G makes me sound like a trombonist with an unfocused sound rather than a euph. It does take work to make the euph and the trombone sound like different instruments - to me, it's a "concept of sound" thing. And I certainly don't want to play the baritone part of "Barnum & Bailey's Favorite" on a trombone with a 2G . Steve Troy From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 08:25:36 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L Subject: For Sale: Doug Elliott LT99 Rims Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I have ended up with two Doug Elliott LT Series rims. One is silver, and the other is lexan. They are both in mint condition. $25 each, or $45 for both. I'll pay shipping anywhere in the US. Outside the US, e-mail for shipping price. Chris _________________________________________ Chris Waage chris@trombone.org Associate Webmaster The Online Trombone Journal http://www.trombone.org From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:31:26 -0400 (EDT) From: "Moran, Doug - Denison" To: "SOB 3:16" Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Rimsky-korsakov Message-ID: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Try to find: "Trombone Concepts" Carsten Svanberg Danish Concert Band Label: Rondo Grammofon, RCD 8349 There are a total of 10 tracks on this CD. The R-K is the Davis Shuman version (edited solo part). Some arrangements follow this notation of which octave are used, some do not. Hickeys has both the solo part and band parts that match this recording. Other seletions: - Atlantic Zephyrs - Simons - Morceau Symphonique - Guilmant - Trombone Concepts - McDunn/Christensen - Monologue #8 for solo trombone - von Kock - Concertino - Jacob (premiere recording) - Thoughts of Love - Pryor - Ballade for Trombone Op. 62 - Bozza - Bavarian Polka - Lohmann (personal favorite) - Cavatine for Trombone & Piano Op. 144 - Saint-Saens (premiere recording for concert band) This album was recorded in 1994. Great liner notes about the compositions/composers. Program notes by Thomas G. Everett. I probably got mine at http://www.cdworld.com. They still list it for $15.77 I loan mine to students all of the time. Good luck, Doug Moran On Sun, 26 Dec 1999, SOB 3:16 wrote: > Are there any other recordings out for Rimsky-Korsakov : Concerto for > Trombone... I am trying to see if I can find one in the nearest CD store From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 09:32:16 -0600 From: Listmonitor Trombone-L To: Trombone-L Subject: END OF YEAR ISSUES Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" With the approach of the end of 1999 and the potential for problems with the change to 2000, there have been many educational institutions which have shut down (or will be shutting down) their e-mail servers, web servers, or entire electronic networks. Because of this, there are two things to be aware of: 1. On 31 December 1999, the trombone-l will be stopped at 12:00 noon CST. It will be off line until Monday, 3 January 2000. 2. If messages sent from the list processor to your mailbox are returned, your subscription will not be deleted, which is the usual policy. The listproc has been instructed to move the subscription from "ack" (each individual message is sent) to "postpone" (no messages are sent, but you are still subscribed). If you have been receiving trombone-l mail and it suddenly stops, send an e-mail to LISTPROC@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU with QUERY TROMBONE-L in the body of the message. The listproc software will respond with your current settings. If it shows your mail status as "postpone", send a message to LISTPROC@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU with SET TROMBONE-L MAIL ACK (to receive each individual message) or SET TROMBONE-L MAIL DIGEST (to receive the daily digest of trombone-l messages). 3. The trombone-l will continue to operate as always: Unmoderated, unlimited daily postings and a free and open list. There have been several messages directed to the list monitor with concerns about censorship and/or complaints about individual list members. First, there is no list censorship - messages sent to the list are not reviewed by anyone other than the sender before being sent to the list. There is, however, oversight provided by the list monitor. If the topic wanders too far, a message may be posted to guide the list back to trombones and related issues. As for concerns about individual list members, please contact the list monitor at any point you have a concern. My entire purpose is to insure that the list stays trouble-free. That DOES NOT MEAN that disagreements will not take place. Any open forum in which people post their opinions will have disagreements. My purpose is to keep the disagreements civil and polite. Profanity and personal insults will not be tolerated, and will be grounds for warnings and/or removal from the list. Again, if you experience any problems with your subscription or have list-related questions, please feel free to contact me by e-mail at tsks@cjnetworks.com. LM From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 09:56:49 -0600 From: Mike To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Great music source (was Rimsky-korsakov) Message-ID: <199912281602.KAA06868@ties.k12.mn.us> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; types="text/plain,text/html"; boundary="=====================_1961394==_.ALT" Dear Listers,

This recording and many other recordings are available through a great company called Tap Music http://www.tapmusic.com

I have ordered a lot of stuff from Tap and think it is the best source of classical and jazz CDs for brass.  I very rarely endorse any commercial endeavor, but Tap is really a great company and it is owned by a trombone player! (who is also a very nice guy - how often do you see THAT combination?  :)   Order with confidence and tell 'em Mike sent ya!

Mike Coyle
ps - I don't get kickbacks from Tap  :)



At 10:31 AM 12/28/99 -0400, you wrote:
>Try to find:
>
>"Trombone Concepts"
>Carsten Svanberg
>Danish Concert Band
>Label:  Rondo Grammofon, RCD 8349
>
>There are a total of 10 tracks on this CD.  The R-K is the Davis Shuman
>version (edited solo part).  Some arrangements follow this notation of
>which octave are used, some do not.  Hickeys has both the solo part and
>band parts that match this recording.
>
>Other seletions:
>- Atlantic Zephyrs - Simons
>- Morceau Symphonique - Guilmant
>- Trombone Concepts - McDunn/Christensen
>- Monologue #8 for solo trombone - von Kock
>- Concertino - Jacob (premiere recording)
>- Thoughts of Love - Pryor
>- Ballade for Trombone Op. 62 - Bozza
>- Bavarian Polka - Lohmann (personal favorite)
>- Cavatine for Trombone & Piano Op. 144 - Saint-Saens (premiere recording
>for concert band)
>
>This album was recorded in 1994.  Great liner notes about the
>compositions/composers.  Program notes by Thomas G. Everett.
>
>I probably got mine at http://www.cdworld.com.  They still list it for
>$15.77
>
>I loan mine to students all of the time.
>
>Good luck,
>
>Doug Moran
>
>
>On Sun, 26 Dec 1999, SOB 3:16 wrote:
>
>> Are there any other recordings out for Rimsky-Korsakov : Concerto for
>> Trombone... I am trying to see if I can find one in the nearest CD store
>
From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:06:49 -0500 From: Charles To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: now, now Adrian Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19991228150649.0067d024@totcon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Adrian,,,,,I believe you are becoming too euphamistic! From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:04:29 -0600 From: Mike To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: now, now Adrian Message-ID: <199912281610.KAA07390@ties.k12.mn.us> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" EU GUYS!!!!!!! ;-) At 10:06 AM 12/28/99 -0500, you wrote: >Adrian,,,,,I believe you are becoming too euphamistic! > From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:16:04 -0600 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Euph info needed - valves Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Okay, Okay! I'll be serious, too. I hate to discuss the tubby little tenor tuba on the trombone list, but I, too, spent some time with the euphonium both in high school and later as an adult. I really like the sound of the Besson, and you will never get any trombone to sound like it. Also, when playing the conical bored instruments such as the euphonium and the cornet, please try the Denis Wick mouthpieces. I have more experience with the DW on the cornet than the euphonium, but I have found that the DW can make a big difference in tone. Don't ask me why, it is just my observation. I believe that the Besson's come with DW mouthpieces, but if you have your eye on a Yamaha or a Wilson, try a DW and see what it does for your tone. Ken Dowdy BTW, a euphonium is about the only thing that I have found a 6 1/2AL truly useful for, but that is another topic :-) > -----Original Message----- > From: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL [SMTP:richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL] > Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 6:45 AM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: RE: Euph info needed - valves > > Okay, serious answer this time. > I played a Besson for a while and really liked it. Everything but the > valves, I never got them really working right. Of course it was an older > horn and had had some student treatment, but I came to think much of the > problem might be my fingers. Due to playing a number of sports with more > enthusiasm than skill, my finger joints aren't exactly parallel. > I > theorize the side load on the pistons makes them wear and stick, and that > people like me would be much better off with rotary valves. Anybody else > run into this? > yours, > tim richardson > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Stephen Troy [SMTP:sctroy@erols.com] > > Sent: Monday, December 27, 1999 6:29 PM > > To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu > > Subject: Re: Euph info needed > > > > At 05:00 PM 12/27/99 -0000, Adrian Drover wrote: > > > > > >Besson Sovereign > > >Because it's the best. > > > > > >Adrian > > > > > > Arian is correct, as usual. > > > > I've played them all - Yamahas have great intonation, Willsons are good > > but > > way overpriced. But the one that has the sound you will fall in love > with > > is the Besson 967GS (and the 968GS). A classic euphonium sound that is > > just plain wonderful. Even with me playing it. All you have to do is > > learn to lip down the upper F's to get them in tune. > > > > > > Steve Troy > > From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:15:47 -0600 From: Mike To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Y2K compliance Message-ID: <199912281621.KAA08244@ties.k12.mn.us> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I'm wondering if by Bach 42B is Y2K compliant. If the date flips back to 1900 will I sound like Arthur Pryor? Do you think I should stockpile a surplus of slide lube and water in case of shortages? Surely I don't have to worry about any terrorist activity directed at my trombone, right? Ugh, what world we live in :) Signed, Worried in Minneapolis From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 10:46:39 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L Subject: Screw Bells Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would require a custom case. Chris _____________________________________________ Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com http://www.waageworks.com "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement." _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 12:02:06 -0500 From: Steve Butterworth To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <3868ED0D.F16A5C48@istar.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Our top repair guy here in Toronto is busier than ever cutting horn bells for travelling/auditioning players. He has also done a couple of trombones recently. Ted Griffith in the Montreal Symphony played on a "cut" Holton for years. If done by a skilled craftsman, it should work well for you. Has anyone seen a case for a cut-bell trombone? A cut job with the parts and labour(Canadian Spelling,eh!) will run you about $500.00CDN(Thats $150 US! :)) Horn players often comment that the bell ring helps establish a solid core sound that is well focussed. My 2 Cents(CDN). Steve Chris Waage wrote: > Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton > tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. > > It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would > require a custom case. > > Chris > _____________________________________________ > Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com > http://www.waageworks.com > > "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. > Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. > Good Judgement comes from Experience. > Experience comes from Bad Judgement." > _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 12:06:14 -0500 From: Steve Butterworth To: Trombone-List Subject: Y2K Trombone Compliance Message-ID: <3868EE05.282EA03B@istar.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have heard a rumour that Yamaha will change their model numbers to comply witht the "Y to K" computer problem. I heard that from now on model numbers will as follows: YSL changes to KSL(Trombone) YBL changes to KBL(Bass Trombone) YEP changes to KEP(Euph) and YBB,YCB,YEB, & YFB change to KBB, KCB, KEB, & KFB. Can anyone confirm or deny this? STEVE ;-) From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 11:09:24 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Holton used to offer a large tenor and a bass with a screw bell - the cases were flat, and just a bit longer than the slide. It would be much easier for airline traveling, but then again, finding the case would be the tough part. Chris >Our top repair guy here in Toronto is busier than ever cutting horn bells for >travelling/auditioning players. He has also done a couple of trombones >recently. Ted Griffith in the Montreal Symphony played on a "cut" Holton for >years. If done by a skilled craftsman, it should work well for you. Has anyone >seen a case for a cut-bell trombone? A cut job with the parts and >labour(Canadian Spelling,eh!) will run you about $500.00CDN(Thats $150 US! :)) > >Horn players often comment that the bell ring helps establish a solid core >sound that is well focussed. > >My 2 Cents(CDN). > >Steve > >Chris Waage wrote: > >> Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton >> tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. >> >> It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would >> require a custom case. >> >> Chris >> _____________________________________________ >> Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com >> http://www.waageworks.com >> >> "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. >> Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. >> Good Judgement comes from Experience. >> Experience comes from Bad Judgement." >> _____________________________________________ _____________________________________________ Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com http://www.waageworks.com "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement." _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 11:11:02 -0600 From: Chris Waage To: Trombone-L Subject: Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Wouldn't the brand be "Kamaha"? >I have heard a rumour that Yamaha will change their model numbers to >comply witht the "Y to K" computer problem. I heard that from now on >model numbers will as follows: > >YSL changes to KSL(Trombone) >YBL changes to KBL(Bass Trombone) >YEP changes to KEP(Euph) >and YBB,YCB,YEB, & YFB change to KBB, KCB, KEB, & KFB. > >Can anyone confirm or deny this? > >STEVE ;-) _____________________________________________ Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com http://www.waageworks.com "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. Good Judgement comes from Experience. Experience comes from Bad Judgement." _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 12:27:25 -0500 From: Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur To: stevenb@istar.ca Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <3868F2FD.C5E07D67@total.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey Steve and List, I know the horn that you are talking about, Steve, and it is not that bad a horn. Jeff Hall (Toronto Symphony Orchestra, bass trombone) has the horn now, I think mostly as a spare, he normally plays an Edwards. I played the horn for a little bit and it was good but with some flaws not at all related to the screw bell. I have thought about having a screw bell put on my horn for fun, but I think it is not reversible. So...what to do if I don't like it? As far as a custom case, you would only need it if you wanted to transport the horn with the screw bell off. The holton that Jeff has has a case that looks only slightly larger than a bassoon case and completely flat. It looks like a great design, although Jeff would tell you otherwise--He some problems with the slide on the lid and the flexing thereof. Just an aside: Ted did play the Holton in the Symphony and then switched to a Bach 50 with double dependant rotors. I bought that one from him after he retired from the symphony. That was the one with the silver plated bell that was mentioned a little while ago on the list. He had another Holton that was made for him by the company with his initials nicely engraved on the bell. It had a funky open wrap design that was sort of mushroom shaped. I would be curious to know what happened to this horn after he passed away earlier this year. Anybody know? Hope you are all having a good holiday. Cheers Peter Collins Steve Butterworth wrote: > > Our top repair guy here in Toronto is busier than ever cutting horn bells for > travelling/auditioning players. He has also done a couple of trombones > recently. Ted Griffith in the Montreal Symphony played on a "cut" Holton for > years. If done by a skilled craftsman, it should work well for you. Has anyone > seen a case for a cut-bell trombone? A cut job with the parts and > labour(Canadian Spelling,eh!) will run you about $500.00CDN(Thats $150 US! :)) > > Horn players often comment that the bell ring helps establish a solid core > sound that is well focussed. > > My 2 Cents(CDN). > > Steve > > Chris Waage wrote: > > > Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton > > tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. > > > > It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would > > require a custom case. > > > > Chris > > _____________________________________________ > > Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com > > http://www.waageworks.com > > > > "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. > > Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. > > Good Judgement comes from Experience. > > Experience comes from Bad Judgement." > > _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 17:29:03 -0000 From: "Dynamic Music Publications" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance Message-ID: <001101bf5159$208094a0$ac3bac3e@p8d3q> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > >I have heard a rumour that Yamaha will change their model numbers to > >comply witht the "Y to K" computer problem. I heard that from now on > >model numbers will as follows: > >YSL changes to KSL(Trombone) > >YBL changes to KBL(Bass Trombone) > >YEP changes to KEP(Euph) > >and YBB,YCB,YEB, & YFB change to KBB, KCB, KEB, & KFB. > >Can anyone confirm or deny this? > Wouldn't the brand be "Kamaha"? Kup, I thiny kou're makbe onto something there! Cheers, Dave Dave Hankin, Hamilton, Scotland - DYNAMIC MUSIC PUBLICATIONS Specialists in Trombone Ensemble Music - www.btinternet.com/~dynamicmusic Adrian Drover/Dave Hankin Big Band - www.btinternet.com/~dynamicmusic/bigband From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 11:41:39 -0600 From: Scott Moore To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re Euph info Message-ID: <3868F651.9D4CE62B@gustavus.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Tony: The Besson is a wise choice, but if money were not an object I would go for the Wilson... great workmanship, terrific comp system, lovely sound. The difference in price from a Besson doesn't justify the slight advantage, however. Scott > Ok guys (+ gals), > > I have been playing a Yamaha YEP-321S euph for years. I'm ready to step up > into a top-of-the-line euph. If money was no object, what euphonium would you > buy? And why? Thanks in advance for your recomendation. > > Tony Clements > D. Scott Moore Music Department, Gustavus Adolphus College St. Peter, MN 56082 dmoore@gustavus.edu (507) 933-6260 Gustavus Fax: (507) 933-7641 e-Fax: (425) 984-1647 http://www.gac.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 11:31:23 -0600 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Screw Bells Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > -----Original Message----- > From: Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur [SMTP:sarapete@total.net] > Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 11:27 AM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: Re: Screw Bells > > Hey Steve and List, > > I have thought about having a screw > bell put on my horn for fun, but I think it is not reversible. So...what > to do if I don't like it? > A possible solution would be to procure another bell flare and have that one "cut" to the screw thread. That way, if you do not like the result, you could have your original bell flare reinstalled. Ken Dowdy From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 12:22:27 -0500 From: Charles To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: no more Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.19991228172227.006ac6e4@totcon.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" There Will Never Be Another Eu From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:21 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 13:22:34 EST From: Yoda505@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re:Y2K Compliance Message-ID: <0.f1c03d35.259a59ea@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Maybe aliens are trying to stop distribution of trombones by changing names of ditriutors. It is a secret plot to rid the world of it's most intelligent people... Trombone Players (*hehe*) +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ | David Getsfrid | | 1st Chair Trombone | |Jazz and Advanced Bands | | Covington Middle School | +~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~+ "Your life is your own composition; Only you control when you get out of those minor parts."- Me "Music is not just notes on a page, and machine quality playing; It must involve feeling, emotion, and all of your heart."-Me "If you cross a drummer and an ape, you get a really dumb ape"-Drummer Joke From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 13:48:02 EST From: REOnofreyJ@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Lessons Message-ID: <0.474fdba4.259a5fe2@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit (I sent this message a few minutes ago, but my computer imploded, and I wasn't sure if the message went out or not, so . . .) I've been playing a trombone for about 16 years (converted accordion player to get into a marching band), but have never taken a lesson. I've been considering starting taking lessons, but don't know what to look for in a teacher. I would appreciate any advice, questions to ask, or answers to look for. Thank you all in advance, Rick Onofrey From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:18:23 -0500 From: Steve Butterworth To: chardy@totcon.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: no more Message-ID: <38690CFE.5AB58F9E@istar.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Difference between the Rolling Stones and a Trombonist who doubles on Euph? The 'Stones sing "Hey, Eu, Get offa' my cloud" Trombonist sings "Hey, McLoed, Get offa' my Eu" eu, that's bad. ;~) Steve Charles wrote: > There Will Never Be Another Eu From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:24:28 EST From: REOnofreyJ@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: no more Message-ID: <0.da776d2a.259a686c@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Enough of this Euph-ful enthusiasm! From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 14:53:05 -0600 From: "David Carter" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <005201bf5175$8dccdca0$02000003@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Chris, Holton used to make both tenor and bass screw bells, and even though I never owned one I recall that the opinion at the time was that the screw bells played a little better in the louds than the regular ones. I once had a chance to play a Bach 50 bell both before and after it was made into a screw bell. Eric Swanson had a spare 50 bell. As I recall it was nothing special, a little thin in the metal, and played ok. Eric wanted to have a bell that would be easier to carry on plane flights and he was interested in using french horn screw bell fittings to do the job. Eric's work turned out very well, and when he let me try the horn it seemed to me to play more solidly after the conversion. David Carter -----Original Message----- From: Chris Waage To: Trombones and related issues forum. Date: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 10:48 AM Subject: Screw Bells >Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton >tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. > >It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would >require a custom case. > >Chris >_____________________________________________ >Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com > http://www.waageworks.com > >"Wisdom comes from Knowledge. > Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. > Good Judgement comes from Experience. > Experience comes from Bad Judgement." >_____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 17:00:25 -0500 From: David Buckley To: sarapete@total.net Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <386932F9.13068448@sympatico.ca> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Doug Hall who has played both bass trom and tuba with us at Weston has a screw bell bass bone and a flat case for it. Anyone wanting info from him can contact him at I think. That may be an old address since he has recently changed jobs. He is not on the list so if this address doesn't work, I'm sorry. That's the only one I have. It certainly sounded good when Doug played it. Dave Buckley. Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur wrote: > Hey Steve and List, > > I know the horn that you are talking about, Steve, and it is not that > bad a horn. Jeff Hall (Toronto Symphony Orchestra, bass trombone) has > the horn now, I think mostly as a spare, he normally plays an Edwards. I > played the horn for a little bit and it was good but with some flaws not > at all related to the screw bell. I have thought about having a screw > bell put on my horn for fun, but I think it is not reversible. So...what > to do if I don't like it? As far as a custom case, you would only need > it if you wanted to transport the horn with the screw bell off. The > holton that Jeff has has a case that looks only slightly larger than a > bassoon case and completely flat. It looks like a great design, although > Jeff would tell you otherwise--He some problems with the slide on the > lid and the flexing thereof. > > Just an aside: Ted did play the Holton in the Symphony and then switched > to a Bach 50 with double dependant rotors. I bought that one from him > after he retired from the symphony. That was the one with the silver > plated bell that was mentioned a little while ago on the list. He had > another Holton that was made for him by the company with his initials > nicely engraved on the bell. It had a funky open wrap design that was > sort of mushroom shaped. I would be curious to know what happened to > this horn after he passed away earlier this year. Anybody know? > > Hope you are all having a good holiday. > > Cheers > > Peter Collins > > Steve Butterworth wrote: > > > > Our top repair guy here in Toronto is busier than ever cutting horn bells for > > travelling/auditioning players. He has also done a couple of trombones > > recently. Ted Griffith in the Montreal Symphony played on a "cut" Holton for > > years. If done by a skilled craftsman, it should work well for you. Has anyone > > seen a case for a cut-bell trombone? A cut job with the parts and > > labour(Canadian Spelling,eh!) will run you about $500.00CDN(Thats $150 US! :)) > > > > Horn players often comment that the bell ring helps establish a solid core > > sound that is well focussed. > > > > My 2 Cents(CDN). > > > > Steve > > > > Chris Waage wrote: > > > > > Has anyone ever tried using a screw bell on a trombone? I played a Holton > > > tenor once which had one, but the instrument itself was a dog. > > > > > > It seems like it would be a handy thing for travel, although it would > > > require a custom case. > > > > > > Chris > > > _____________________________________________ > > > Chris Waage basstbn@waageworks.com > > > http://www.waageworks.com > > > > > > "Wisdom comes from Knowledge. > > > Knowledge comes from Good Judgement. > > > Good Judgement comes from Experience. > > > Experience comes from Bad Judgement." > > > _____________________________________________ From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 23:34:55 -0000 From: "Adrian Drover" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Y2K Trombone Compliance Message-ID: <008b01bf518c$5c6298a0$e5618cd4@v4v3j2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Steve Butterworth To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:06 PM Subject: Y2K Trombone Compliance > I have heard a rumour that Yamaha will change their model numbers to > comply witht the "Y to K" computer problem. I heard that from now on > model numbers will as follows: > > YSL changes to KSL(Trombone) > YBL changes to KBL(Bass Trombone) > YEP changes to KEP(Euph) > and YBB,YCB,YEB, & YFB change to KBB, KCB, KEB, & KFB. > > Can anyone confirm or deny this? Not unless they are changing their name from Yamaha to King. Adrian Adrian Drover (ADIOS) Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk Business: studio@adios.co.uk www.adios.co.uk From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 23:34:19 -0000 From: "Adrian Drover" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <008a01bf518c$5b46c860$e5618cd4@v4v3j2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: DOWDY, KENNETH S To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Tuesday, December 28, 1999 5:31 PM Subject: RE: Screw Bells > A possible solution would be to procure another bell flare and have > that one "cut" to the screw thread. That way, if you do not like the > result, you could have your original bell flare reinstalled. Once knew a guy who had his bass 'bone bell removed and a french horn bell transplanted. It looked ridiculous and sounded dreadful. Adrian Adrian Drover (ADIOS) Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk Business: studio@adios.co.uk www.adios.co.uk From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 17:46:27 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: slide.rule@adios.co.uk Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Screw Bells Message-ID: <199912282347.RAA08200@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Once knew a guy who had his bass 'bone bell removed and a french horn bell >transplanted. It looked ridiculous and sounded dreadful. > >Adrian > How on earth did he have room for the slide, Adrian? What a terrible idea! Gee, sometimes I feel like a total dullard when I hear what people are doing to their horns. I have a stock Bach 42B and haven't done a thing to it except lube the slide and I like it just fine I don't feel compelled to do anything exotic to my horns, is something wrong with me? (other than being a composer, that is) ;-) Mike From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 22:05:11 -0500 From: Randy Campora To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: AFM Airline Baggage Project Info Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.19991228220413.00953980@mail.telephonet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Alfonso Pollard, Director of the AFM's Legislative Office, is currently compiling statistics of standard instrument case sizes (length, width, height or depth) for the following instruments: electric bass, guitar, horn, saxophone, trombone, trumpet, viola and violin. Alfonso will be using this information as he prepares to meet with the flight attendant's union to discuss regulations for acceptable carry-on baggage. In addition, any and all anecdotal evidence is welcome -- such as a story where you attempted to place your instrument in the overhead compartment only to be told you would have to check it as baggage beneath the plane, or perhaps a story where you attempted to "sneak" your instrument under a seat. Please send measurements or stories to Alfonso Pollard at apollard@afm.org or (202) 628-5460 or to Sara Honen, Research Assistant for the Symphonic Services Division at shonen@afm.org or (212) 869-1330 ext. 226. Your help is greatly appreciated. Sara Honen shonen@afm.org -Randy From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 07:58:02 +0200 From: eanogmus@netvision.net.il (Eliezer Aharoni) To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Back on tthe list Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi listers After I was away from the list due to some communication problem, I'm back - feels good to be re-instated... The technical solution was that the list people re-subscribed me on their own initiative, which worked fast and fine. Many thanks for those who answered privately to my "are you there" messages. Feels good to see people out there that care. Happy New Year & Millenium to you all - I hope the trombone will flourish as a major instrument in this millenium and will become a sobject of general public interest, like the piano, violin,cello etc. in the current millenium. .. Eliezer Aharoni, Bass Trombonist, Jerusalem Symphony POB 1066 Mevaseret Zion ISRAEL 90805 Phone 972-2-5341333 From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 00:37:01 EST From: FOpal@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Trombone playing tips Message-ID: <0.7550f4f8.259af7fd@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I hate to bother all of you again but I was wondering if anyone could tell me some ways to improve range in general, more specifically high range. I was told low range would help my high range so I have worked my range down to a peddletone D or Db about 5 ledger below bass clef. My high range extends to a D ( 5th line above staff) sometimes I can squeak out a little higher. I was told Free Buzzing might be helpful but I dont know much about this... I play 2-3 octave scales to help my range some more, I play harmonics, arpeggios, and I feel pretty confortable with those. I play quite often. I play a Professional Olds Superstar trombone with an F attachment. Sorry for almost repeating an EMail but I thought some other opinions would be good. I looked in the archives and they were helpful. Any other insights? Thanx a bunch High School Trombonist, Frank Opal From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 01:45:13 EST From: NHSGrizzly16@aol.com To: FOpal@aol.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Trombone playing tips Message-ID: <0.bcbc023d.259b07f9@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit when you warm up, start on a 4th line F and play four quarter notes then a whole note and go down the chromatic scale as far as you can. then, start back on F and go up the chromatic scale as high as you can. don't pinch or apply a lot of pressure in the higher octave. make this a part of your daily routine. also, practice a lot of slurs in the upper octave (as well as lower). not only will that increase range, but it will improve your technique. here's a buzzing excercise that i picked up from a trombone player (Ron Wilkins) who can play a range of 7 octaves: 1. Start buzzing high and go as low as possible. 2. Start as low as you can and buzz as high as possible. 3. Start low, go high as you can, then back low as you can. 4. Start high, go as low as you can, then back high as you can. 5. Start on an F and buzz up as high as you can, then go as low as you can. 6. Start on an F and buzz down as low as you can, then go as high as you can. Tips for the exercises: Do each exercise 4-5 times. Always work higher and go from your extreme on the last time. Do not start the buzz by tonguing. Blow the lip open by starting with a "who" attack. Do not buzz too loudly. It is better to buzz soft as soft and high are very similar. Do not let your corners move as you work through these exercises. Make one embouchure setting do all the work. Rest as much as you buzz. (Ex. buzz, rest, buzz, rest) When you get as high as you can go with the mouthpiece open, close off the end to develop back pressure and work the exercise with the end partially closed. This works for extended range. This exercise should be practiced in front of a mirror. Watch yourself and look for problems. You may lose three days of progress for each day you don't work. Remember, rest as much as you work, always play a low note for every high note, and play soft as much as you play loud. You can't teach a tired lip something new as the lips work best in their relaxed state. A warm up should relax the lip and establish good blood flow. Hope this helps. I know it did me. I increased my range almost a whole octave. Kristina Northside High Symphonic Band(Euphonium) Jazz (Trombone, Sax) Pianist From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:22 1999 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 12:20:03 +-100 From: Eric Burger To: "'Roland Hoffman'" , "'Tom Abrahamsen'" Subject: fixhappy Message-ID: <01BF51F7.D0494D20@fra-pci-laj-vty3.as.wcom.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="---- =_NextPart_000_01BF51F7.D06ADEE0" Please run this program to remove any possible worm virus I or someone else may have sent you. Eric Attachment converted: Macintosh HD:fixhappy.exe 1 (bina/mdos) (0001F9C0) From ???@??? Wed Dec 29 07:31:23 1999 Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 10:54:50 +0100 From: "Peter Jarnebrant" To: Subject: Music store in London Message-ID: <001501bf51e2$c01c4480$0b9dc6c3@telia.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Hi all, Are there any Londoners out there who could recommend a good source of instruments, accessories, scores etc in London? I f there are, I would be grateful for a quick response as I am going there to celebrate Y2K, and IĞm leaving tomorrow. Happy Y2K to you all and good luck to those who have gigs! Peter Jarnebrant