Subject: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 36, Issue 9 Date: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 12:00 PM From: trombone-l-request@samford.edu Reply-To: trombone-l@samford.edu To: Conversation: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 36, Issue 9 Send Trombone-l mailing list submissions to trombone-l@samford.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to trombone-l-request@samford.edu You can reach the person managing the list at trombone-l-owner@samford.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Trombone-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. mouthpiece changes (Tom Ervin) 2. Re: Stand Part Needed (bonemstr@america.net) 3. Re: Stand Part Needed (Gabriel Langfur) 4. Mouthpieces Wanted (bonemstr@america.net) 5. Re: Stand Part Needed (Gabriel Langfur) 6. Rich Man's Frug (Josh Kane) 7. Re: Stand Part Needed (Walter Barrett) 8. Re: Stand Part Needed (Gabriel Langfur) 9. Re: Stand Part Needed (Bruce Guttman) 10. Jazz-type Substances in MN (Daryl Burch) 11. Re: Stand Part Needed (Eric & Candice Swanson) 12. Re: Assessing mouthpieces (Richardson, Timothy A Mr CIV USA IMCOM-Europe) 13. Re: Assessing mouthpieces (Wayne Dyess) 14. Re: Assessing mouthpieces (Mark Mohwinkel) 15. Bach 50 w/Greenhoe valves for sale (Jeff Albert) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 13:55:02 -0700 From: Tom Ervin Subject: [Trombone-l] mouthpiece changes To: Trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <62791FF7-6915-4B58-A4BC-FB7641BD92D5@u.arizona.edu> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed What great advice so far. May I ramble on? 2 stories, either of which MAY be relevant to the wonderful discussion on changing equipment: 1) A fine clarinetist friend of mine chose to start (again) practicing 4-5 hours a day for an upcoming international appearance. He told me, "You know how we reed players always complain about reeds? Buying a whole box only to find 2 that will work? Ever since I started practicing superlong hours like this, I've found that Darn Near Any Reed will do!" 2) Some fine clinician, I've forgotten who, maybe a trumpet guy, said, "Getting a new mouthpiece is kinda like getting a new girlfriend." (I don't mean this to be dirty, really!) "The ADVANTAGES are immediately apparent; the DARK SIDE shows up a few weeks later." The downside of a new mouthpiece may not appear in your playing for awhile. What a stinker of a problem! So, yes, there are a lot of different mouthpieces out there. Several (or several dozen) are widely accepted for providing most of us with a good balance of power, range, comfort, a standard sound, flexibility, a good feel and no endurance problems, etc. And there are surely some mouthpieces being sold that NOBODY should probably use, and hardly anyone does use. Maybe we can get used to anything, but I do think there are some models out there that were made by the Devil. Some few players can switch mouthpieces frequently with good success ("This one I like for the Bolero"), but many other players switch frequently with bad results, and wonder why. It's worth shopping around, absolutely, if your present equipment is not working. But it might also be the guy behind the mouthpiece; be sure you're doing your part. Tom Ervin ervint@u.arizona.edu Prof of Trombone, Univ Arizona (Emeritus) ...now a recovering trombone player.... ; >} (520)241-4411 (cell) website: tom-ervin.com ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2008 18:29:09 -0500 From: bonemstr@america.net Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <20080108182909.v9garqo12ao0840k@pop.america.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Fellow Listers, Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, never to be found. UMI does not have any parts for these stands. Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at bonemstr@america.net. Bob Devine Roswell/Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 15:44:02 -0800 (PST) From: Gabriel Langfur Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: bonemstr@america.net, trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <941644.44631.qm@web31807.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Bob, UMI gets these stands made by K&M in Germany. Parts are probably available, and you might have better luck with either K&M directly or through Harris-Teller: http://www.harristeller.com/ Good luck, Gabe ----- Original Message ---- From: "bonemstr@america.net" To: trombone-l@samford.edu Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2008 6:29:09 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed Fellow Listers, Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, never to be found. UMI does not have any parts for these stands. Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at bonemstr@america.net. Bob Devine Roswell/Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2008 18:44:41 -0500 From: bonemstr@america.net Subject: [Trombone-l] Mouthpieces Wanted To: trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <20080108184441.nrb8qwkpsydc00co@pop.america.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; DelSp="Yes"; format="flowed" Fellow Listers, I'm still looking for Doug Elliott parts. Several OTJ ads failed to resppond to my inquiries. I'm looking for: LB 110, 111 &/or 112 rims in silver as well as K &/or L cups and 8 & 9 shanks. PLease email me offline if you have anything in great working condition (exterior bruises, dings and blemishes are okay); LT 101 (silver) G &/or H cups with 8 &/or 9 shanks and An ST97 'stock' (unmodified) silver rim and a 4 shank. Please respond to me offline at bonemstr@america.net. Thanks, Bob Devine Roswell/Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 15:45:30 -0800 (PST) From: Gabriel Langfur Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: bonemstr@america.net, trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <74253.73440.qm@web31803.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Small correction - you'll need to get a retailer to order for you from Harris-Teller, but that shouldn't be too difficult. Gabe ----- Original Message ---- From: "bonemstr@america.net" To: trombone-l@samford.edu Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2008 6:29:09 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed Fellow Listers, Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, never to be found. UMI does not have any parts for these stands. Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at bonemstr@america.net. Bob Devine Roswell/Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 18:49:59 -0500 From: Josh Kane Subject: [Trombone-l] Rich Man's Frug To: Trombone-L Mailing List - Message-ID: <7025FAB9-8A73-4153-AE27-DF7285C2CEE2@cox.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Hey Everyone, I was wondering if anyone happened to have a copy of the trumpet trombone and reed books for Sweet Charity and if they could possibly get in touch with me if so. I kind of desperetely need to get a hold of them for a benefit drag show I am orchestrating in Providence. This tune was just added and we have dress rehearsal for a Friday and Saturday show on thursday (all of this week). If anyone has them and could send them to me that would be great. If not, then i'll just have to try to transcribe it. Thanks, Josh Kane ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2008 19:25:13 -0500 From: Walter Barrett Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: Bonemaster , Bone Trombone-L Message-ID: <9ACA7867-FAA8-4F45-81D4-26B1EA1D1DF7@optonline.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed; delsp=yes On Jan 8, 2008, at 6:29 PM, bonemstr@america.net wrote: > Fellow Listers, > > Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree > of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original > design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part > with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, > adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the > loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, > never to be found. > > UMI does not have any parts for these stands. > > Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell > cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at > bonemstr@america.net. > > Bob Devine > Roswell/Atlanta, GA > An 'All Shires' family > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l It used to be that Gorg International was the US distributor for K&M. I know that some friends have gotten parts from them in the past. Their website lists their own brand now, and no mention of K&M, but it doesn't hurt to ask. http://gorginternational.com/ It may be that Gabe's link to Harris Teller is more current than my info. Walter Barrett "so does the sound exist somewhere in your head and you try to find a brass funnel that fits ??? OR do you fit your head into the brass funnel ????????????? " -DJ Kennedy Alto, tenor, bass trombones Bass trumpet, euphonium, tuba Yamaha Artist/Clinician http://www.walterbarrett.com ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 17:09:06 -0800 (PST) From: Gabriel Langfur Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: Bone Trombone-L Message-ID: <641718.60642.qm@web31805.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Both the trumpet and trombone stands look like K&M stands to me.. Probably made under contract like the UMI ones. Gabe ----- Original Message ---- From: Walter Barrett To: Bonemaster ; Bone Trombone-L Sent: Tuesday, January 8, 2008 7:25:13 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed On Jan 8, 2008, at 6:29 PM, bonemstr@america.net wrote: > Fellow Listers, > > Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree > of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original > design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part > with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, > adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the > loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, > never to be found. > > UMI does not have any parts for these stands. > > Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell > cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at > bonemstr@america.net. > > Bob Devine > Roswell/Atlanta, GA > An 'All Shires' family > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l It used to be that Gorg International was the US distributor for K&M. I know that some friends have gotten parts from them in the past. Their website lists their own brand now, and no mention of K&M, but it doesn't hurt to ask. http://gorginternational.com/ It may be that Gabe's link to Harris Teller is more current than my info. Walter Barrett "so does the sound exist somewhere in your head and you try to find a brass funnel that fits ??? OR do you fit your head into the brass funnel ????????????? " -DJ Kennedy Alto, tenor, bass trombones Bass trumpet, euphonium, tuba Yamaha Artist/Clinician http://www.walterbarrett.com _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 20:17:31 -0500 From: Bruce Guttman Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: Trombone-L Message-ID: <200801082017_MC3-1-F918-10C2@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Message text written by INTERNET:bonemstr@america.net > Fellow Listers, Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, never to be found. UMI does not have any parts for these stands. Does anyone have salvaged parts or an old/broken stand to sell cheaply? Thanks in advance for your efforts. Contact me offline at bonemstr@america.net. Bob Devine Roswell/Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family < Bob: You can make your own parts. I have fixed a Hamilton and a Jupiter stand this way. 1. Find a Gem Box cover with a 1/2" or so round hole that just fits the shaft of the stand. If you can't find a cover with a hole, get a solid one and drill it. 2. Get a toilet plunger, preferably using one of your old, dried-out mute ones. Cut a 1/2" hole in the center. 3. Go to the Pharmacy and get a cane tip for a 1/2" cane. They usually come in packages of 2 so you will have a spare. Now for the assembly. There is a collar that fits under the dome that you lost. It should still be there. Slide the Gem Box cover down so it rests on the collar. Now slide the plunger over the Gem Box cover. Finish up by putting the cane tip on the end of the stand shaft. It attracts a lot of attention and some snide remarks, but it really works well. Bruce Guttman Principal, Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orchestra Moderator, The Trombone Forum ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2008 17:41:05 -0800 From: Daryl Burch Subject: [Trombone-l] Jazz-type Substances in MN To: Bone Trombone-L Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=WINDOWS-1252; delsp=yes; format=flowed Hey, all! I'm travelling to Minneapolis for an extended weekend from 1/17 ? 1/21. Do any of y'all know anything about the bustling MN jazz scene? Any suggestions for clubs/venues/coffee houses that might have live jazz-type substances? Or does anybody know of any such blog or online forum for the area that might lead me to such info? Any suggestions appreciated. Food suggestions welcome, too. (As that seems to be our sporting activity.) Thanks for the tips! Cheers! -D- www.radionoise.com <- Rock star by night www.burchinteractive.com <- Tech-nerd by day #;-) ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Tue, 08 Jan 2008 22:44:15 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Stand Part Needed To: trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <4784511F.5070208@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed bonemstr@america.net wrote: >Fellow Listers, > >Did a gig over the holidays and somehow, using an extraordinary degree >of skill, managed to loose the 'bell rest' portion of my [original >design] UMI horn stand. This would be the plastic, dome-shaped part >with collar and adjustment screw that fits over the smaller, >adjustable shaft. Somehow the rubber cap came off and allowed the >loose 'bell rest' to fall off into some leaves in a dark parking area, >never to be found. > >UMI does not have any parts for these stands. > > Bob, Others had good suggestions to try K&M, etc. UMI does not exist anymore, it is called Conn-Selmer now. You could have your local dealer call and see if the parts are available. If all that fails, I have a slightly better fix than using a plunger. You can get a replacement part for a Hamilton trombone stand. Harris-Teller does carry them, you will need your local music store to order it for you (if they have an account with Harris-Teller). Hamilton calls the rubber part the "cup" and the part number in the Harris-Teller catalog is KBCUP. I tried one on my K&M stand and the hole is the right size. The price is only $5.25. The one I got is white, but it looks better than a red plunger (on the other hand, I have seen some black plungers so that might not look too bad). You will need something to keep the cup up on the shaft where you want it since there is no screw involved on this cup. A hose clamp should work. Then as somebody said get a new rubber tip. Lowe's or Home Depot have all manner of chair leg and table leg tips, or cane tips will work. Just measure the diameter and buy the right size. Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 07:54:33 +0100 From: "Richardson, Timothy A Mr CIV USA IMCOM-Europe" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Assessing mouthpieces To: "Wayne Dyess" , "Daniel Pliskin" Cc: trombone-l Message-ID: <461766D8F1473C49B52754F636B6D0371118D3@GRAF0308APCS081.EUR.DS.ARMY.MIL> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Ah, shoot, did you have to go and do that? I've just got to the point where I've stopped changing mouthpieces and intend never to think about it again. Ever. For any reason. And now I've got to go clock them. And after a year or so of 45 degree changes maybe 22.5 would be better. And what about comparing my 6.5 at 271.364 degrees to a 5G at 118.92 degrees? And maybe............ Life's too short. No, seriously, I haven't enough time left at my age to try all the combinations. -----Original Message----- From: Wayne Dyess [mailto:texastbone@gt.rr.com] Sent: Tuesday, January 08, 2008 5:19 AM To: Daniel Pliskin Cc: trombone-l Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Assessing mouthpieces On Jan 7, 2008, at 5:23 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > I've said this before and I'll say it again. Try an experiment. > Try clocking your mouthpiece. Set it in the receiver with the logo > facing out, as a reference point. Play it for a while. Then turn > the mouthpiece about 45 degrees and try it again. Most mouthpieces > are out of round, to the point where there is a preferred rotation > of the mouthpiece, where you like the tone the best. You might > want to mark your mouthpiece, so that you always insert it with > that best rotation. > > But also, this points out how the tiniest change in a mouthpiece > makes a world of difference. So if you take the next size lettered > drill and take out some of the back-bore, you may well have gone > past that sweet spot, you were looking for. Numbered drills are a > better bet, because there are more sizes. This is a good idea, I agree. We all strive to get the best mouthpiece, the best instrument, even the best slide lubricant. By "clocking" your mouthpiece, you have just added that much more stability to your playing. It'll be the same every time. I've been doing this since talking to a friend of mine about what I saw him doing in his warm-up... he was turning the mouthpiece just so. Dennis Dotson (formerly with Woody Herman), who had "stolen" the idea from the principal player of the Houston Symphony. I've been "clocking" myself ever since. Or maybe I've been clogging. Whatever it is... I'm more consistent. :-) Wayne ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 02:20:05 -0600 From: Wayne Dyess Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Assessing mouthpieces To: "Richardson, Timothy A Mr CIV USA IMCOM-Europe" Cc: Trombone List Message-ID: <3388F204-0E6E-41A5-AA05-A22C706974C4@gt.rr.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed On Jan 9, 2008, at 12:54 AM, Richardson, Timothy A Mr CIV USA IMCOM- Europe wrote: > And now I've got to go clock them. And after a year or so of 45 > degree > changes maybe 22.5 would be better. And what about comparing my > 6.5 at > 271.364 degrees to a 5G at 118.92 degrees? And maybe............ > > Life's too short. No, seriously, I haven't enough time left at my age > to try all the combinations. HA! I'm just gonna get myself a magnetic mouthpiece with a built-in compass and always play toward the North pole. (would that work? I doubt it) I can't afford one of those steel jobs. :-) Wayne ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 07:01:01 -0800 (PST) From: Mark Mohwinkel Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Assessing mouthpieces To: Trombone List Message-ID: <875399.56635.qm@web52308.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Of course there's the method that I heard many, many years ago at a clinic by Rich Matteson. He attributed it to Stan Freeze, I think. Someone asked him what kind of tuba mouthpiece he used. Stan replied, "I use a gold one - because it looks cool!" Regards, Mark Mohwinkel Wayne Dyess wrote: On Jan 9, 2008, at 12:54 AM, Richardson, Timothy A Mr CIV USA IMCOM- Europe wrote: > And now I've got to go clock them. And after a year or so of 45 > degree > changes maybe 22.5 would be better. And what about comparing my > 6.5 at > 271.364 degrees to a 5G at 118.92 degrees? And maybe............ > > Life's too short. No, seriously, I haven't enough time left at my age > to try all the combinations. HA! I'm just gonna get myself a magnetic mouthpiece with a built-in compass and always play toward the North pole. (would that work? I doubt it) I can't afford one of those steel jobs. :-) Wayne _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l --------------------------------- Never miss a thing. Make Yahoo your homepage. ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 11:23:52 -0600 From: "Jeff Albert" Subject: [Trombone-l] Bach 50 w/Greenhoe valves for sale To: trombone-l Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 I am selling a Bach 50 with Greenhoe valves. The bell and slide are gold plated, the valve section is lacquered. There is some engraving on the bell that is not standard to Bach. There is plating wear at the contact points, and on the bell where the conversion was done. There is a small dent in the bell. I have tried to show all of these things in the pictures that are posted here: http://www.jeffalbert.com/for_sale/ It comes with a ProTec case. It is my understanding that this is one of the earlier Greenhoe conversions, although I don't really have any documentation of that other than what I have been told. The bell is pretty light for a Bach bell. The leadpipe has been converted to interchangeable and Shires threaded pipes fit in it. It has a Shires B2 pipe in it now. This horn was the first bass trombone that I owned that I actually liked to play. I have gone to a different setup now and can't afford to keep two basses, which is why it is for sale. I am asking $2500 US and that includes shipping and insurance in the continental US. That is about half of what it would cost to get something similar new. Again, pics are here: http://www.jeffalbert.com/for_sale/ Thanks, Jeff jeff@jeffalbert.com 985-966-6093 -- www.jeffalbert.com www.scratchmybrain.com www.openearsmusic.org ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l End of Trombone-l Digest, Vol 36, Issue 9 *****************************************