Subject: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 25, Issue 12 Date: Monday, February 12, 2007 12:00 PM From: trombone-l-request@maillists.samford.edu Reply-To: trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu To: Conversation: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 25, Issue 12 Send Trombone-l mailing list submissions to trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to trombone-l-request@maillists.samford.edu You can reach the person managing the list at trombone-l-owner@maillists.samford.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Trombone-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Booo!! (james meador) 2. Re: Booo!! (emrose79) 3. Boos (Bill Dinwiddie) 4. Re: Boos (Bill Dinwiddie) 5. Re: Boos (Daniel Pliskin) 6. @ Penn State with NOJO (Jeff Albert) 7. Re: Boos (Daryl Burch) 8. OTJ Classifieds Update - 2/12/07 (Chris Waage) 9. Re: Booo!! (Matmutt@aol.com) 10. Re: Booo!! (BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com) 11. Re: Boos (Chris Tune) 12. Re: Boos (Steve Gamble) 13. Re: Boos (Jason Smith) 14. Re: Boos (Steve Gamble) 15. Re: Boos (Daryl Burch) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 03:17:54 +0000 From: "james meador" Subject: [Trombone-l] Booo!! To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Well, I had an interesting experience today. The guest conductor of our orchestra was booed at the end of the program. The program was decent, at least the second half was. We opened with a very fun and energetic piece called La Boda de Luis Alonso-Intermezzo by Giminez, then a Spanish guitar concerto by Castelnovo which I thought was terribly boring. We started the second half with Jules Massenet's Le Cid Overture and ended with Le Cid Suite, both of which I thought were fine pieces. I recorded the concert and I thought we played well, technically at least. Musically, the performance left a little to be desired. Despite the boos, we played the last movement of the suite as an encore (and we did on Friday night as well). Interestingly, they did not boo the encore (they had probably already left). I'm fairly certain the boos were directed at the conductor because the two or three people doing the booing would only do so when the conductor walked out to bow. I can't determine if they were booing because of the musical interpretation or because of the programming, or what, but it shocked everyone in the orchestra and the audience. At least a riot didn't break out!! James ====================== James N. Meador, Bass Trombone Orquesta Sinf—nica de Yucat‡n +52-999-221-5845 cell +52-999-195-1144 home jamesmeador@hotmail.com ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 19:35:56 -0800 From: emrose79 Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Booo!! To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <45CFE09C.4060706@sonic.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed The San Francisco Bay Bones did a piece for the American Guild of Organists several years ago, and it was a horrible piece. It was so bad, that they not only booed it, but a couple of them actually walked up to the conductor (the composer) and threw their programs at him! Ed james meador wrote: > Well, I had an interesting experience today. The guest conductor of > our orchestra was booed at the end of the program. The program was > decent, at least the second half was. We opened with a very fun and > energetic piece called La Boda de Luis Alonso-Intermezzo by Giminez, > then a Spanish guitar concerto by Castelnovo which I thought was > terribly boring. We started the second half with Jules Massenet's Le > Cid Overture and ended with Le Cid Suite, both of which I thought were > fine pieces. I recorded the concert and I thought we played well, > technically at least. Musically, the performance left a little to be > desired. > > Despite the boos, we played the last movement of the suite as an > encore (and we did on Friday night as well). Interestingly, they did > not boo the encore (they had probably already left). I'm fairly > certain the boos were directed at the conductor because the two or > three people doing the booing would only do so when the conductor > walked out to bow. I can't determine if they were booing because of > the musical interpretation or because of the programming, or what, but > it shocked everyone in the orchestra and the audience. At least a > riot didn't break out!! > > James > > ====================== > James N. Meador, Bass Trombone > Orquesta Sinf?nica de Yucat?n > +52-999-221-5845 cell > +52-999-195-1144 home > jamesmeador@hotmail.com > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------ > >_______________________________________________ >Trombone-l mailing list >Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:37:40 -0600 From: "Bill Dinwiddie" Subject: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "List Trombone" Message-ID: <003001c74e57$25c6b810$0a00a8c0@av> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original James wrote : "I can't determine if they were booing because of the musical interpretation or because of the programming, or what, but it shocked everyone in the orchestra and the audience. At least a riot didn't break out!!" Imagine how Stavinsky must have felt in 1912 or whenever it was that "Le Sacre" premiered! Never had the honor myself...but there is still time. Bill Dinwiddie billdin@comcast.net ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 11 Feb 2007 21:48:19 -0600 From: "Bill Dinwiddie" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "Samuel Keyser" Cc: List Trombone Message-ID: <005101c74e58$a2a3f090$0a00a8c0@av> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people who do this have even the remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the artists involved. I think they think they are being funny. They aren't. Bill ----- Original Message ----- From: "Samuel Keyser" To: "Bill Dinwiddie" Cc: "Samuel Keyser" Sent: Sunday, February 11, 2007 9:41 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos > Yes, I thought of the Stravinsky debut when I read James' piece. > Personally, I don't go in for booing. Nathaniel West, the novelist, > wrote once, "No attempt at beauty, however, grotesque is laughable." > Everybody gets a gold star for trying in my book. > > Jay > > > On Feb 11, 2007, at 10:37 PM, Bill Dinwiddie wrote: > >> James wrote : "I can't determine if they were >> booing because of the musical interpretation or because of the >> programming, >> or what, but it shocked everyone in the orchestra and the audience. At >> least a riot didn't break out!!" >> >> Imagine how Stavinsky must have felt in 1912 or whenever it was that "Le >> Sacre" premiered! >> >> Never had the honor myself...but there is still time. >> >> Bill Dinwiddie >> billdin@comcast.net >> >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Trombone-l mailing list >> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > Samuel Jay Keyser > Editor, Linguistic Inquiry > Emeritus Professor of Linguistics > Department of Linguistics > and Philosophy > MIT > > > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 04:18:32 +0000 From: "Daniel Pliskin" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos Cc: TROMBONE-L@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed >Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people who do this have even the >remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the artists involved. I >think >they think they are being funny. They aren't. If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a moment, what they did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted from that act was something personal, but you'll probably never know what was actually meant by their action. With todayâs punk kids, who have no respect for anything other than the acquisition of more high-end goods, they might have booed to embarrass their classical music-loving aunt, who insisted they go to the concert. Short of actually talking with whomever booed at the concert, so that you might actually find out why that person booed, the very best thing you can do in such situations is to put an interpretation on it that empowers you, in some way. ãIt wasnât me they were booing.ä ãThatâs the price you pay for playing something different, for a change.ä Or, ãYou can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the some of the time, but you canât please all of the people all of the time.ä DanP _________________________________________________________________ Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701 ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 00:13:51 -0600 From: "Jeff Albert" Subject: [Trombone-l] @ Penn State with NOJO To: trombone-L Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed I just found out that I will be in State College, PA next Saturday (Feb 17) with the New Orleans Jazz Orchestra. We play at 8 PM in the Eisenhauer Auditorium, which I believe is on the Penn State Campus. The other two trombone players are Steve Walker (who you might not have heard of, but he plays great) and Vincent Gardner, (who you might have heard of). If any listers will be at the concert, please come say hello. Peace, Jeff -- www.jeffalbert.com www.scratchmybrain.com www.pepperenterprises.com ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 00:49:38 -0800 From: Daryl Burch Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "Daniel Pliskin" Cc: List Trombone Message-ID: <5dd247c2c7aba45814f5685305fcaddb@speakeasy.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Good words, Dan. Good on ya for adding that. -D- On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:18 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people who do this have even > the > remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the artists involved. I > think > they think they are being funny. They aren't. If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a moment, what they did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted from that act was something personal, but you'll probably never know what was actually meant by their action. With today?s punk kids, who have no respect for anything other than the acquisition of more high-end goods, they might have booed to embarrass their classical music-loving aunt, who insisted they go to the concert. Short of actually talking with whomever booed at the concert, so that you might actually find out why that person booed, the very best thing you can do in such situations is to put an interpretation on it that empowers you, in some way. ?It wasn?t me they were booing.? ?That?s the price you pay for playing something different, for a change.? Or, ?You can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the some of the time, but you can?t please all of the people all of the time.? DanP _________________________________________________________________ Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701 _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 06:23:57 -0600 From: Chris Waage Subject: [Trombone-l] OTJ Classifieds Update - 2/12/07 To: Trombone-L Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" The Online Trombone Journal Classifieds - http://www.trombone.org/classifieds - have been updated as of 6:23 AM CDT on February 12, 2007. Scam/Fraud Alert: Please be cautious of offers by individuals offering to send you a cashier's check or money order for more than the asking price of your item, and then have you send the balance back to them. The primary warning signs are e-mails sent with very poor grammar asking if you will consider shipping the item overseas. Banks will cash these counterfeit checks, but then hold you responsible for the funds when the check fails to clear. If you have been victimized, you can contact the FTC toll-free at 1-877-FTC-HELP (1-877-382-4357) or use the complaint form at www.ftc.gov, or contact your local law enforcement agency. For additional information, please visit the OTJ Classifieds FAQ at: http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/faq.asp Remember - if the deal sounds too good to be true, it probably is. - - - - - Thank you for using the OTJ Classifieds! - - - - - OTJ Classifieds Frequently Asked Questions http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/faq.asp OTJ Gift Shoppe: http://www.cafepress.com/cp/store/store.aspx?storeid=trombones If you have any questions or comments about the Online Trombone Journal Classifieds, please contact me at chris@trombone.org. Chris Waage -- Chris Waage, Bass Trombonist The Online Trombone Journal www. trombone.org ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 08:29:10 EST From: Matmutt@aol.com Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Booo!! To: jamesmeador@hotmail.com, trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Sounds like it may have been a personal attack on the conductor by a few individuals, and may have had nothing to do with the immediate event. LP ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 08:59:11 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Booo!! To: jamesmeador@hotmail.com, trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" for some reason, spanish guitar, flamenco and the like are taking up a lot of Public Radio musical themes. WBAA is our local affiliate and they play a lot of it . going thru a phase??? beldon wade ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 08:04:15 -0800 From: "Chris Tune" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "Daryl Burch" , "Daniel Pliskin" Cc: List Trombone Message-ID: <004601c74ebf$7240fc10$0300a8c0@athlon2800> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Yes DP, and it is not just Erhard. That is in every thorough treatise on basic psychology. It comes down to a built-in part of us that wants to "belong" and to be considered part of the group. We are, after all "homo" sapiens. Intelligent beings who prefer being in groups--so we are loaded with mechanisms designed to help us "fit in". However, you can learn, as a performer, to control how you react to stuff like that. DEFENSE: If you are absolutely positive that you and your group put out a great effort and perhaps a very good performance (based upon your internalized standards), then you can easily deal with situations like this. You take any parenthetical note of anything you might have done different to "entertain", and balance that against the idea that this group may have been impossible to reach. TALENT SHOW: I just saw a similar thing at my kid's school It is ia parochial school and ths was the High School talent show. The row we were in had several teenage girls who absolutely refused to stop talking DURING THE PERFORMANCES. My wife and I and a bunch of other neighbors spoke right to them and said "Would You STOP TALKING?" . . .thus, despite their most likely believing themselves to be Christian (most students at this school look at it this way) they were nonetheless, immature and rude. . .of course anybody familiar with theology knows that Christianity presumes FLAWS. Well, these gals sure showed theirs. I couldn't help but notice even greater boredom and lack of appreciation during the performance who did a very difficult and nice Chopin Prelude on piano, and during the String Quartet and Piano piece (unknown composer. . .modern, with Spanish ideas), and less distraction during the singer or singer guitar player stuff, as well as during the hip-hop dance numbers. Obviously lots of this stuff is "social" stuff. Who is more popular, etc. The pianist doing the Chopin was undoubtedly the single most talented person to perform. That didn't mean she ever had a chance to win. The first place winner was a hip-hop dance group (who, even I would admit had worked hard and turned in a very good performance and OBVIOUSLY had dance talent). DANCE Also, noteworthy--I'm not someone who normally likes anything Hip-Hop. But I could see how young crowds, particularly those who like to dance, could get involved in this music. The dance steps are relatively easy to get into on a basic level, and then they are like "line dancing" in that random groups can be formed to do dance routines. Dancing is where it is at as far as most popular music eras are concerned. The Swing Era (Lindy Hop), Early Rock-and-Roll (Twist, etc.), The Waltz Era, Country Music (Two-Step, Line Dances)--all have their dances, and crowds that like to go out to dance That is the link between musically schooled audiences, and non-musical folk. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daryl Burch" To: "Daniel Pliskin" Cc: "List Trombone" Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 12:49 AM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos Good words, Dan. Good on ya for adding that. -D- On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:18 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people who do this have even > the > remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the artists involved. I > think > they think they are being funny. They aren't. If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a moment, what they did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted from that act was something personal, but you'll probably never know what was actually meant by their action. With today's punk kids, who have no respect for anything other than the acquisition of more high-end goods, they might have booed to embarrass their classical music-loving aunt, who insisted they go to the concert. Short of actually talking with whomever booed at the concert, so that you might actually find out why that person booed, the very best thing you can do in such situations is to put an interpretation on it that empowers you, in some way. "It wasn't me they were booing." "That's the price you pay for playing something different, for a change." Or, "You can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time." DanP _________________________________________________________________ Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701 _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:01:28 -0700 From: "Steve Gamble" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "Chris Tune" Cc: List Trombone Message-ID: <0B5C87139BED1C49B4CFA3563492DD8128A385@srv01.tso.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi All, The truth of the matter is that you don't really know why the audience is applauding either. They don't REALLY know what you are trying to accomplish on stage, you don't REALLY know why they bought their tickets. And it doesn't matter why. Believing that there can be actual artistic communication is a matter of faith at best. Sure, I enjoy it when I can give someone something that makes them happy. But who knows why it makes them happy? Just about every student I've ever had was too concerned with what the audience thought of what they were doing, usually having a negative effect on their playing. I teach them a little mental exercise: Whenever someone says something bad about your playing, think to yourself "there are critics everywhere." Whenever someone says something good about your playing, think to yourself, "there are critics everywhere." Steve Gamble, Librarian Tucson Symphony Orchestra 2175 N. 6th Ave. Tucson, AZ 85705 520-792-9155 x118 office 520-792-9314 fax 520-991-7056 cell sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org www.tucsonsymphony.org -----Original Message----- From: trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu] On Behalf Of Chris Tune Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:04 AM To: Daryl Burch; Daniel Pliskin Cc: List Trombone Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos Yes DP, and it is not just Erhard. That is in every thorough treatise on basic psychology. It comes down to a built-in part of us that wants to "belong" and to be considered part of the group. We are, after all "homo" sapiens. Intelligent beings who prefer being in groups--so we are loaded with mechanisms designed to help us "fit in". However, you can learn, as a performer, to control how you react to stuff like that. DEFENSE: If you are absolutely positive that you and your group put out a great effort and perhaps a very good performance (based upon your internalized standards), then you can easily deal with situations like this. You take any parenthetical note of anything you might have done different to "entertain", and balance that against the idea that this group may have been impossible to reach. TALENT SHOW: I just saw a similar thing at my kid's school It is ia parochial school and ths was the High School talent show. The row we were in had several teenage girls who absolutely refused to stop talking DURING THE PERFORMANCES. My wife and I and a bunch of other neighbors spoke right to them and said "Would You STOP TALKING?" . . .thus, despite their most likely believing themselves to be Christian (most students at this school look at it this way) they were nonetheless, immature and rude. . .of course anybody familiar with theology knows that Christianity presumes FLAWS. Well, these gals sure showed theirs. I couldn't help but notice even greater boredom and lack of appreciation during the performance who did a very difficult and nice Chopin Prelude on piano, and during the String Quartet and Piano piece (unknown composer. . .modern, with Spanish ideas), and less distraction during the singer or singer guitar player stuff, as well as during the hip-hop dance numbers. Obviously lots of this stuff is "social" stuff. Who is more popular, etc. The pianist doing the Chopin was undoubtedly the single most talented person to perform. That didn't mean she ever had a chance to win. The first place winner was a hip-hop dance group (who, even I would admit had worked hard and turned in a very good performance and OBVIOUSLY had dance talent). DANCE Also, noteworthy--I'm not someone who normally likes anything Hip-Hop. But I could see how young crowds, particularly those who like to dance, could get involved in this music. The dance steps are relatively easy to get into on a basic level, and then they are like "line dancing" in that random groups can be formed to do dance routines. Dancing is where it is at as far as most popular music eras are concerned. The Swing Era (Lindy Hop), Early Rock-and-Roll (Twist, etc.), The Waltz Era, Country Music (Two-Step, Line Dances)--all have their dances, and crowds that like to go out to dance That is the link between musically schooled audiences, and non-musical folk. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Daryl Burch" To: "Daniel Pliskin" Cc: "List Trombone" Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 12:49 AM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos Good words, Dan. Good on ya for adding that. -D- On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:18 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people who do this have even > the > remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the artists involved. I > think > they think they are being funny. They aren't. If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a moment, what they did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted from that act was something personal, but you'll probably never know what was actually meant by their action. With today's punk kids, who have no respect for anything other than the acquisition of more high-end goods, they might have booed to embarrass their classical music-loving aunt, who insisted they go to the concert. Short of actually talking with whomever booed at the concert, so that you might actually find out why that person booed, the very best thing you can do in such situations is to put an interpretation on it that empowers you, in some way. "It wasn't me they were booing." "That's the price you pay for playing something different, for a change." Or, "You can please some of the people all of the time or all of the people some of the some of the time, but you can't please all of the people all of the time." DanP _________________________________________________________________ Get in the mood for Valentine's Day. View photos, recipes and more on your Live.com page. http://www.live.com/?addTemplate=ValentinesDay&ocid=T001MSN30A0701 _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 09:12:25 -0800 (PST) From: Jason Smith Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: Steve Gamble , bone list Message-ID: <904079.87157.qm@web35011.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Something that I have learned. When I go to a concert and hear a performer I want to compliment I say "I enjoyed your playing" not "you're good". This allows me to compliment without having to justify my compliment. We all should be performing for some body's enjoyment, Your audience, your momma, your Creator. Without that outward thought we can tend to be rather esoteric and would be better off back home in the practice room playing with ourselves. Jason --- Steve Gamble wrote: > Hi All, > > The truth of the matter is that you don't really > know why the audience > is applauding either. They don't REALLY know what > you are trying to > accomplish on stage, you don't REALLY know why they > bought their > tickets. And it doesn't matter why. Believing that > there can be actual > artistic communication is a matter of faith at best. > Sure, I enjoy it > when I can give someone something that makes them > happy. But who knows > why it makes them happy? Just about every student > I've ever had was too > concerned with what the audience thought of what > they were doing, > usually having a negative effect on their playing. > I teach them a > little mental exercise: Whenever someone says > something bad about your > playing, think to yourself "there are critics > everywhere." Whenever > someone says something good about your playing, > think to yourself, > "there are critics everywhere." > > Steve Gamble, Librarian > Tucson Symphony Orchestra > 2175 N. 6th Ave. > Tucson, AZ 85705 > 520-792-9155 x118 office > 520-792-9314 fax > 520-991-7056 cell > sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org > www.tucsonsymphony.org > > > -----Original Message----- > From: trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu > [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu] On > Behalf Of Chris > Tune > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:04 AM > To: Daryl Burch; Daniel Pliskin > Cc: List Trombone > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos > > Yes DP, and it is not just Erhard. That is in every > thorough treatise > on > basic psychology. It comes down to a built-in part > of us that wants to > "belong" and to be considered part of the group. We > are, after all > "homo" > sapiens. Intelligent beings who prefer being in > groups--so we are > loaded > with mechanisms designed to help us "fit in". > However, you can learn, as > a > performer, to control how you react to stuff like > that. > > DEFENSE: > If you are absolutely positive that you and your > group put out a great > effort and perhaps a very good performance (based > upon your internalized > > standards), then you can easily deal with situations > like this. You take > any > parenthetical note of anything you might have done > different to > "entertain", > and balance that against the idea that this group > may have been > impossible > to reach. > > TALENT SHOW: > I just saw a similar thing at my kid's school It is > ia parochial school > and > ths was the High School talent show. The row we > were in had several > teenage > girls who absolutely refused to stop talking DURING > THE PERFORMANCES. > My > wife and I and a bunch of other neighbors spoke > right to them and said > "Would You STOP TALKING?" . . .thus, despite their > most likely > believing > themselves to be Christian (most students at this > school look at it this > > way) they were nonetheless, immature and rude. . .of > course anybody > familiar > with theology knows that Christianity presumes > FLAWS. Well, these gals > > sure showed theirs. > > I couldn't help but notice even greater boredom and > lack of appreciation > > during the performance who did a very difficult and > nice Chopin Prelude > on > piano, and during the String Quartet and Piano piece > (unknown composer. > . > .modern, with Spanish ideas), and less distraction > during the singer or > singer guitar player stuff, as well as during the > hip-hop dance numbers. > > Obviously lots of this stuff is "social" stuff. Who > is more popular, > etc. > The pianist doing the Chopin was undoubtedly the > single most talented > person > to perform. That didn't mean she ever had a chance > to win. The first > place > winner was a hip-hop dance group (who, even I would > admit had worked > hard > and turned in a very good performance and OBVIOUSLY > had dance talent). > > DANCE > Also, noteworthy--I'm not someone who normally likes > anything Hip-Hop. > But > I could see how young crowds, particularly those who > like to dance, > could > get involved in this music. The dance steps are > relatively easy to get > into > on a basic level, and then they are like "line > dancing" in that random > groups can be formed to do dance routines. Dancing > is where it is at as > far > as most popular music eras are concerned. The Swing > Era (Lindy Hop), > Early > Rock-and-Roll (Twist, etc.), The Waltz Era, Country > Music (Two-Step, > Line > Dances)--all have their dances, and crowds that like > to go out to dance > That is the link between musically schooled > audiences, and non-musical > folk. > > Chris > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Daryl Burch" > To: "Daniel Pliskin" > Cc: "List Trombone" > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 12:49 AM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos > > > Good words, Dan. Good on ya for adding that. > > -D- > > > On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:18 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > > > > > Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people > who do this have even > > the > > remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the > artists involved. I > > think > > they think they are being funny. They aren't. > > > If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a > moment, what they > did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted > from that act was > something personal, but you'll probably never know > what was actually > meant by their action. > > === message truncated === Jason Smith www.thebandroomtx.com www.concerttimeusa.com www.pershingparkbaptist.com ____________________________________________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:27:36 -0700 From: "Steve Gamble" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "bone list" Message-ID: <0B5C87139BED1C49B4CFA3563492DD8128A39A@srv01.tso.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Jason, Now that you mention it, my advice works in the practice room, too. Steve Gamble, Librarian Tucson Symphony Orchestra 2175 N. 6th Ave. Tucson, AZ 85705 520-792-9155 x118 office 520-792-9314 fax 520-991-7056 cell sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org www.tucsonsymphony.org -----Original Message----- From: Jason Smith [mailto:jbone72@yahoo.com] Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 10:12 AM To: Steve Gamble; bone list Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos Something that I have learned. When I go to a concert and hear a performer I want to compliment I say "I enjoyed your playing" not "you're good". This allows me to compliment without having to justify my compliment. We all should be performing for some body's enjoyment, Your audience, your momma, your Creator. Without that outward thought we can tend to be rather esoteric and would be better off back home in the practice room playing with ourselves. Jason --- Steve Gamble wrote: > Hi All, > > The truth of the matter is that you don't really > know why the audience > is applauding either. They don't REALLY know what > you are trying to > accomplish on stage, you don't REALLY know why they > bought their > tickets. And it doesn't matter why. Believing that > there can be actual > artistic communication is a matter of faith at best. > Sure, I enjoy it > when I can give someone something that makes them > happy. But who knows > why it makes them happy? Just about every student > I've ever had was too > concerned with what the audience thought of what > they were doing, > usually having a negative effect on their playing. > I teach them a > little mental exercise: Whenever someone says > something bad about your > playing, think to yourself "there are critics > everywhere." Whenever > someone says something good about your playing, > think to yourself, > "there are critics everywhere." > > Steve Gamble, Librarian > Tucson Symphony Orchestra > 2175 N. 6th Ave. > Tucson, AZ 85705 > 520-792-9155 x118 office > 520-792-9314 fax > 520-991-7056 cell > sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org > www.tucsonsymphony.org > > > -----Original Message----- > From: trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu > [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@maillists.samford.edu] On > Behalf Of Chris > Tune > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 9:04 AM > To: Daryl Burch; Daniel Pliskin > Cc: List Trombone > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos > > Yes DP, and it is not just Erhard. That is in every > thorough treatise > on > basic psychology. It comes down to a built-in part > of us that wants to > "belong" and to be considered part of the group. We > are, after all > "homo" > sapiens. Intelligent beings who prefer being in > groups--so we are > loaded > with mechanisms designed to help us "fit in". > However, you can learn, as > a > performer, to control how you react to stuff like > that. > > DEFENSE: > If you are absolutely positive that you and your > group put out a great > effort and perhaps a very good performance (based > upon your internalized > > standards), then you can easily deal with situations > like this. You take > any > parenthetical note of anything you might have done > different to > "entertain", > and balance that against the idea that this group > may have been > impossible > to reach. > > TALENT SHOW: > I just saw a similar thing at my kid's school It is > ia parochial school > and > ths was the High School talent show. The row we > were in had several > teenage > girls who absolutely refused to stop talking DURING > THE PERFORMANCES. > My > wife and I and a bunch of other neighbors spoke > right to them and said > "Would You STOP TALKING?" . . .thus, despite their > most likely > believing > themselves to be Christian (most students at this > school look at it this > > way) they were nonetheless, immature and rude. . .of > course anybody > familiar > with theology knows that Christianity presumes > FLAWS. Well, these gals > > sure showed theirs. > > I couldn't help but notice even greater boredom and > lack of appreciation > > during the performance who did a very difficult and > nice Chopin Prelude > on > piano, and during the String Quartet and Piano piece > (unknown composer. > . > .modern, with Spanish ideas), and less distraction > during the singer or > singer guitar player stuff, as well as during the > hip-hop dance numbers. > > Obviously lots of this stuff is "social" stuff. Who > is more popular, > etc. > The pianist doing the Chopin was undoubtedly the > single most talented > person > to perform. That didn't mean she ever had a chance > to win. The first > place > winner was a hip-hop dance group (who, even I would > admit had worked > hard > and turned in a very good performance and OBVIOUSLY > had dance talent). > > DANCE > Also, noteworthy--I'm not someone who normally likes > anything Hip-Hop. > But > I could see how young crowds, particularly those who > like to dance, > could > get involved in this music. The dance steps are > relatively easy to get > into > on a basic level, and then they are like "line > dancing" in that random > groups can be formed to do dance routines. Dancing > is where it is at as > far > as most popular music eras are concerned. The Swing > Era (Lindy Hop), > Early > Rock-and-Roll (Twist, etc.), The Waltz Era, Country > Music (Two-Step, > Line > Dances)--all have their dances, and crowds that like > to go out to dance > That is the link between musically schooled > audiences, and non-musical > folk. > > Chris > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Daryl Burch" > To: "Daniel Pliskin" > Cc: "List Trombone" > Sent: Monday, February 12, 2007 12:49 AM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos > > > Good words, Dan. Good on ya for adding that. > > -D- > > > On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:18 PM, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > > > > > Jay, I agree with you. I don't think that people > who do this have even > > the > > remotest idea of how much they are hurting all the > artists involved. I > > think > > they think they are being funny. They aren't. > > > If I may borrow something from Werner Erhard, for a > moment, what they > did was to say boo. What each of you interpreted > from that act was > something personal, but you'll probably never know > what was actually > meant by their action. > > === message truncated === Jason Smith www.thebandroomtx.com www.concerttimeusa.com www.pershingparkbaptist.com ________________________________________________________________________ ____________ Do you Yahoo!? Everyone is raving about the all-new Yahoo! Mail beta. http://new.mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 09:47:03 -0800 From: Daryl Burch Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Boos To: "Steve Gamble" Cc: List Trombone Message-ID: <5f56316f97135de7b512a281c98eda57@speakeasy.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed You just summed up the entire Bebop genre! #;-) I've always held that bebop was not a spectator's sport! Doesn't mean you won't get as much out of it. But the true "art" of bebop is the communication between the players on the stage. 90% of which blows right by the crowd. However, we're still glad they showed & paid their 2-drink minimum. -D- On Feb 12, 2007, at 9:01 AM, Steve Gamble wrote: They don't REALLY know what you are trying to accomplish on stage, you don't REALLY know why they bought their tickets. And it doesn't matter why. ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l End of Trombone-l Digest, Vol 25, Issue 12 ******************************************