Subject: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 28 Date: Sunday, January 29, 2006 12:00 PM From: trombone-l-request@samford.edu Reply-To: trombone-l@samford.edu To: Conversation: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 28 Send Trombone-l mailing list submissions to trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to trombone-l-request@maillists.samford.edu You can reach the person managing the list at trombone-l-owner@maillists.samford.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Trombone-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: Wichita Train Whistle (Larry White) 2. OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle (Jeff Albert) 3. Re: OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle (Chris Tune) 4. Re: Time Life records, was OT browsers (Bonemaster) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 17:36:55 -0800 From: Larry White Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Wichita Train Whistle To: Jon Cc: 'List Trombone' , 'Richard Bartkus' Message-ID: <43DC1C37.30705@shaw.ca> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; format=flowed Unfortunately this site does not support Netscape, which is really too bad. Just MS Explorer5.5 and above. LJ Jon wrote: >Here ya go: > >http://musicstore.connect.com/album/500/000/000/000/010/136/900/500000000000 >010136900.html > > >-----Original Message----- >From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu] >On Behalf Of Richard Bartkus >Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 6:18 PM >To: List Trombone >Subject: [Trombone-l] Wichita Train Whistle > >Does any know the personell on this album ? It was post Monkees Michael >Nesmith. He used a 52 piece orchestra on Nov 18-19 1967 at RCA in Hollywood >with open mic placement. It is a very bizarre album to listen to, but it is >alledged that these were all the A-list players in LA on the session. > >I have been looking for something on the internet, figuring that somebody >must know, but haven't found it yet. > >Thanks in advance >Richard > > >_______________________________________________ >Trombone-l mailing list >Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > >_______________________________________________ >Trombone-l mailing list >Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 19:43:10 -0600 From: Jeff Albert Subject: [Trombone-l] OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle To: Larry White Cc: 'List Trombone' , 'Richard Bartkus' Message-ID: <0CC9566F-C3C7-473C-87CB-6D073DC18E74@jeffalbert.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed Wow, I wonder how much Microsoft had to pay them to do that? I have several browsers on my machine, but none of them are IE. jva On Jan 28, 2006, at 7:36 PM, Larry White wrote: > Unfortunately this site does not support Netscape, which is really too > bad. Just MS Explorer5.5 and above. > LJ > > Jon wrote: > >> Here ya go: >> >> http://musicstore.connect.com/album/ >> 500/000/000/000/010/136/900/500000000000 >> 010136900.html >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l- >> bounces@samford.edu] >> On Behalf Of Richard Bartkus >> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 6:18 PM >> To: List Trombone >> Subject: [Trombone-l] Wichita Train Whistle >> >> Does any know the personell on this album ? It was post Monkees >> Michael >> Nesmith. He used a 52 piece orchestra on Nov 18-19 1967 at RCA in >> Hollywood >> with open mic placement. It is a very bizarre album to listen to, >> but it is >> alledged that these were all the A-list players in LA on the session. >> >> I have been looking for something on the internet, figuring that >> somebody >> must know, but haven't found it yet. >> >> Thanks in advance >> Richard >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Trombone-l mailing list >> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Trombone-l mailing list >> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >> >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Sat, 28 Jan 2006 19:51:28 -0800 From: "Chris Tune" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle To: "Jeff Albert" , "Larry White" Cc: 'List Trombone' , 'Richard Bartkus' Message-ID: <004301c62487$49298300$0400a8c0@athlon2800> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Even once you are using MSFT Internet Explorer 6, it still depends upon WHAT add-in is called upon the browser referring the *.asx page (Active Server Page). Turns out my browser, and only my browser right now is set to put the file into an unusual application called VLC Media Player (aka Video LAN. . .it's interesting because it is Open Source and it supports a lot of formats. . .it is a DRAG because it has a silly way of adding files to its playlist which is super awkward and involves a separate sub-application). Anyway. . .I'd love to return power to play embedded web mp3 files to either MSFT Windows Media Player, Musicmatch 8, or Qucktime. . .any of these at least seem to load up the file and play it. . . THE RECORDING: I got very stuttering audio coming over. . but I heard enough to know what kind of "ambience" was used on the date. They were experimenting with a more "classical music" approach to the audio. It works pretty good for large groups like symphony orchestras (again depending upon the EXACT technique--one pretty interesting one is called the "Decca Tree"). I'm not very fond of that EXACT sound for a big band (of course some times you just have to live with what is available). I really like the way they engineered the Time Life "The Swing Era" series of stereo recordings for traditional big band. . .and I generally have always liked the way the engineering was done on big bands through CTI records. (usually I think this was Rudy Van Gelder at his own studio. . .NOT a totally dry environment, but rather one which "contributes" and doesn't take away from the ambience). This method is a "mixed method" with plenty of both focused and ambient, or "room" sound with a high degree of intelligence used to get full sound out of everything possible. They DO use baffles to remove leakage but they are not trying to add much outboard reverb, because the room provides some of its own. . often enough for a small combo. . .maybe some adding is required for larger groups. This subject is complicated and subject to experimentation even now with so much science available on acoustics. Bruce Swedien discusses this at length in his recent book "Make Mine Music". For those who are scratching their heads. . ."Why does THAT NAME sound so familiar. . . ." This guy is nearly the most famous audio engineer in the world. . certainly the most famous living and working right now. He was the regular with most Quincy Jones / Michael Jackson super-big hit stuff from the 1980's. Stuff like Thriller. He started back in the early 1950's (and worked as an engineer even as a kid in Minneapolis in the late 1940's). He recorded Count Basie, Duke Ellington, Stan Kenton and on up to more modern stuff like Jackson and Jones. Swedien was one of the geniuses behind the renowned Universal Audio Recording in Chicago. This was a sure-fire place to go and set up a recording during your tour. This was especially so while Swedien was there in part of the 1950's. Swedien describes a whole series of evolutions in fits and starts that happened as different things were invented. The old studios in the 40's and 50's were deadened severely but only with regard to the audio frequency range above a several hundred Hertz. So the mids and lows were not damped at all and they could create yucky "phase cancellation" effects which seem to affect sound in making it "muddy" or in sucking up parts of the sound of individual instruments. Then there was the attempt to put live ambience in: Swedien comments "Columbia Records was the first of the major labels to allow musicians and technicians outside the controlled studio environment and attempt to get a more 'live' sound on record.". This means there was an effort in the early fifties to record in concert halls which added reverberant sound to the orchestras and bands. An on goes the changes. Some do not like the isolation of instruments in modern techniques, but, when done properly it is not noticed and the reverberant ambience sounds natural. The main reason they don't want other instruments bleeding into farther away mics is due to the effect when recombining the sound back into a mix. The effect can be to create a "comb filter". So-named because the graph of the filter effects looks just like a comb at times. It is an unpleasant sound for everybody who is exposed to it and asked . . . Interesting that Nesmith did this recording for tax purposes. Shows you that taxation can cause unusual things. Like Chasen's restaurant catering for a recording session! Chris Tune ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Albert" To: "Larry White" Cc: "'List Trombone'" ; "'Richard Bartkus'" Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 5:43 PM Subject: [Trombone-l] OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle > Wow, I wonder how much Microsoft had to pay them to do that? I have > several browsers on my machine, but none of them are IE. > > jva > On Jan 28, 2006, at 7:36 PM, Larry White wrote: > >> Unfortunately this site does not support Netscape, which is really too >> bad. Just MS Explorer5.5 and above. >> LJ >> >> Jon wrote: >> >>> Here ya go: >>> >>> http://musicstore.connect.com/album/ >>> 500/000/000/000/010/136/900/500000000000 >>> 010136900.html >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l- >>> bounces@samford.edu] >>> On Behalf Of Richard Bartkus >>> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 6:18 PM >>> To: List Trombone >>> Subject: [Trombone-l] Wichita Train Whistle >>> >>> Does any know the personell on this album ? It was post Monkees >>> Michael >>> Nesmith. He used a 52 piece orchestra on Nov 18-19 1967 at RCA in >>> Hollywood >>> with open mic placement. It is a very bizarre album to listen to, >>> but it is >>> alledged that these were all the A-list players in LA on the session. >>> >>> I have been looking for something on the internet, figuring that >>> somebody >>> must know, but haven't found it yet. >>> >>> Thanks in advance >>> Richard >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Trombone-l mailing list >>> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >>> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Trombone-l mailing list >>> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >>> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Trombone-l mailing list >> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Sun, 29 Jan 2006 12:06:44 -0500 From: "Bonemaster" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Time Life records, was OT browsers To: "Chris Tune" , "'List Trombone'" Message-ID: <00c001c624f6$61adc250$23a23c45@america.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Hey Chris, Speaking of the 'Time Life Swing Era Series', does anyone know where the set past 41-42 can be had? I can't find anything on their website. I have the 40-41 red and black 'LP' set and the 41-42 yellow and black 'LP' set. The hardbooks in each have cool info on the original sidemen as well as those who 're-recorded the T-L sets. Any additional info is appreciated! Bob Devine Atlanta, GA An 'All Shires' family -----Original Message----- From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu]On Behalf Of Chris Tune Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 10:51 PM To: Jeff Albert; Larry White Cc: 'List Trombone'; 'Richard Bartkus' Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle Even once you are using MSFT Internet Explorer 6, it still depends upon WHAT add-in is called upon the browser referring the *.asx page (Active Server Page). Turns out my browser, and only my browser right now is set to put the file into an unusual application called VLC Media Player (aka Video LAN. . .it's interesting because it is Open Source and it supports a lot of formats. . .it is a DRAG because it has a silly way of adding files to its playlist which is super awkward and involves a separate sub-application). Anyway. . .I'd love to return power to play embedded web mp3 files to either MSFT Windows Media Player, Musicmatch 8, or Qucktime. . .any of these at least seem to load up the file and play it. . . THE RECORDING: I got very stuttering audio coming over. . but I heard enough to know what kind of "ambience" was used on the date. They were experimenting with a more "classical music" approach to the audio. It works pretty good for large groups like symphony orchestras (again depending upon the EXACT technique--one pretty interesting one is called the "Decca Tree"). I'm not very fond of that EXACT sound for a big band (of course some times you just have to live with what is available). I really like the way they engineered the Time Life "The Swing Era" series of stereo recordings for traditional big band. . .and I generally have always liked the way the engineering was done on big bands through CTI records. (usually I think this was Rudy Van Gelder at his own studio. . .NOT a totally dry environment, but rather one which "contributes" and doesn't take away from the ambience). This method is a "mixed method" with plenty of both focused and ambient, or "room" sound with a high degree of intelligence used to get full sound out of everything possible. They DO use baffles to remove leakage but they are not trying to add much outboard reverb, because the room provides some of its own. . often enough for a small combo. . .maybe some adding is required for larger groups. This subject is complicated and subject to experimentation even now with so much science available on acoustics. Bruce Swedien discusses this at length in his recent book "Make Mine Music". For those who are scratching their heads. . ."Why does THAT NAME sound so familiar. . . ." This guy is nearly the most famous audio engineer in the world. . certainly the most famous living and working right now. He was the regular with most Quincy Jones / Michael Jackson super-big hit stuff from the 1980's. Stuff like Thriller. He started back in the early 1950's (and worked as an engineer even as a kid in Minneapolis in the late 1940's). He recorded Count Basie, Duke Ellington, Stan Kenton and on up to more modern stuff like Jackson and Jones. Swedien was one of the geniuses behind the renowned Universal Audio Recording in Chicago. This was a sure-fire place to go and set up a recording during your tour. This was especially so while Swedien was there in part of the 1950's. Swedien describes a whole series of evolutions in fits and starts that happened as different things were invented. The old studios in the 40's and 50's were deadened severely but only with regard to the audio frequency range above a several hundred Hertz. So the mids and lows were not damped at all and they could create yucky "phase cancellation" effects which seem to affect sound in making it "muddy" or in sucking up parts of the sound of individual instruments. Then there was the attempt to put live ambience in: Swedien comments "Columbia Records was the first of the major labels to allow musicians and technicians outside the controlled studio environment and attempt to get a more 'live' sound on record.". This means there was an effort in the early fifties to record in concert halls which added reverberant sound to the orchestras and bands. An on goes the changes. Some do not like the isolation of instruments in modern techniques, but, when done properly it is not noticed and the reverberant ambience sounds natural. The main reason they don't want other instruments bleeding into farther away mics is due to the effect when recombining the sound back into a mix. The effect can be to create a "comb filter". So-named because the graph of the filter effects looks just like a comb at times. It is an unpleasant sound for everybody who is exposed to it and asked . . . Interesting that Nesmith did this recording for tax purposes. Shows you that taxation can cause unusual things. Like Chasen's restaurant catering for a recording session! Chris Tune ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Albert" To: "Larry White" Cc: "'List Trombone'" ; "'Richard Bartkus'" Sent: Saturday, January 28, 2006 5:43 PM Subject: [Trombone-l] OT browsers was Re: Wichita Train Whistle > Wow, I wonder how much Microsoft had to pay them to do that? I have > several browsers on my machine, but none of them are IE. > > jva > On Jan 28, 2006, at 7:36 PM, Larry White wrote: > >> Unfortunately this site does not support Netscape, which is really too >> bad. Just MS Explorer5.5 and above. >> LJ >> >> Jon wrote: >> >>> Here ya go: >>> >>> http://musicstore.connect.com/album/ >>> 500/000/000/000/010/136/900/500000000000 >>> 010136900.html >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l- >>> bounces@samford.edu] >>> On Behalf Of Richard Bartkus >>> Sent: Friday, January 27, 2006 6:18 PM >>> To: List Trombone >>> Subject: [Trombone-l] Wichita Train Whistle >>> >>> Does any know the personell on this album ? It was post Monkees >>> Michael >>> Nesmith. He used a 52 piece orchestra on Nov 18-19 1967 at RCA in >>> Hollywood >>> with open mic placement. It is a very bizarre album to listen to, >>> but it is >>> alledged that these were all the A-list players in LA on the session. >>> >>> I have been looking for something on the internet, figuring that >>> somebody >>> must know, but haven't found it yet. >>> >>> Thanks in advance >>> Richard >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Trombone-l mailing list >>> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >>> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Trombone-l mailing list >>> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >>> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >>> >>> >>> >> _______________________________________________ >> Trombone-l mailing list >> Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >> >> > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l End of Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 28 ******************************************