Subject: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 19 Date: Friday, January 20, 2006 12:00 PM From: trombone-l-request@samford.edu Reply-To: trombone-l@samford.edu To: Conversation: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 19 Send Trombone-l mailing list submissions to trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to trombone-l-request@maillists.samford.edu You can reach the person managing the list at trombone-l-owner@maillists.samford.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Trombone-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: medium shanks (thetubameister@adelphia.net) 2. Re: medium shanks (Fred Hudson) 3. Re: FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss (Tom Izzo) 4. M-piece shank taper alterations (bonemstr@america.net) 5. Re: medium shanks (Lisa & Patrick Bates) 6. Re: FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss (Raymond Horton) 7. Re: M-piece shank taper alterations (Raymond Horton) 8. Re: Trumpet Duet (conn60h) 9. Re: Performance Oddities - was - "Trumpet Duet" (Daryl Burch) 10. Re: medium shanks (Fred Hudson) 11. new jazz trombone book (Jeff Thompson) 12. Re: medium shanks (John Burton) 13. Re: new jazz trombone book (dslide13@aol.com) 14. Re: medium shanks (thetubameister@adelphia.net) 15. Re: medium shanks (BGuttman) 16. Re: Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. . . (Wayne Dyess) 17. Re: Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. (Moran, Doug) 18. Re: Eb crook for bass bone (Dave Tall) 19. Re: medium shanks (thetubameister@adelphia.net) 20. Re: FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss (Keith Marr) 21. Re: medium shanks (Eric & Candice Swanson) 22. Re: Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. (Chris Tune) 23. Schilke 50 MP (Roger Carmichael) 24. Re: FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss (Adrian Drover) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 13:18:05 -0500 From: thetubameister@adelphia.net Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: Fred Hudson Cc: Trombone Message-ID: <20143960.1137694685383.JavaMail.root@web12.mail.adelphia.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 For $11.00 he can go to the Kelly Mouthpiece site and get a discontinued mustard yellow 5G with a European shank. J.c.S. ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > We have the same situation in our Community Band - nice 4 valve Besson euph > with European receiver. Woodwind/Brasswind as well as Mouthpiece Express > list Dennis Wick m'pcs with medium shank but I can't convince the euph > player to order one. He just plays a small shank with a heavy Teflon pipe > tape wrap and the slides pulled way out. Sometimes he is actually in tune! > > Better luck with yours! :-) > > Fred H > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > To: "Trombone" > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:01 AM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get one > "off > > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs one, > and > > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem was! > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be > > nice............ > > Patrick > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Tom Stark" > > To: "Trombone" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > Hello, > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of taper for a > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it supposed to > measure > > at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > Tom > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Trombone-l mailing list > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 12:59:41 -0600 From: "Fred Hudson" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: , Message-ID: <005d01c61d2a$83a07200$43e6eb3f@s0024172501> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Thanks, I'll pass this on. Or better yet for that price I'll buy one for him! Fred H ----- Original Message ----- From: To: "Fred Hudson" Cc: "Trombone" ; "Lisa & Patrick Bates" Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 12:18 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > For $11.00 he can go to the Kelly Mouthpiece site and get a discontinued mustard yellow 5G with a European shank. > > J.c.S. > > > ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > > We have the same situation in our Community Band - nice 4 valve Besson euph > > with European receiver. Woodwind/Brasswind as well as Mouthpiece Express > > list Dennis Wick m'pcs with medium shank but I can't convince the euph > > player to order one. He just plays a small shank with a heavy Teflon pipe > > tape wrap and the slides pulled way out. Sometimes he is actually in tune! > > > > Better luck with yours! :-) > > > > Fred H > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > To: "Trombone" > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:01 AM > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get one > > "off > > > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs one, > > and > > > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem was! > > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be > > > nice............ > > > Patrick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Tom Stark" > > > To: "Trombone" > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of taper for a > > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it supposed to > > measure > > > at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > > Tom > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Trombone-l mailing list > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 12:21:24 -0800 (PST) From: Tom Izzo Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss To: Eric Edwards , Trombone-L Message-ID: <20060119202124.9790.qmail@web52708.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Eric, --- Eric Edwards wrote: > OK, my turn for a stupid question. > > What's the difference between an "F" bass and > playing on the "F" trigger? > Playing on an F "trigger" is still a Bb instrument (really a very large bore Tenor) with F attach depressed. An F Bass is built in F WITHOUT depressing the valve. The valve, if there is one, is usually in C. Tom Tom Izzo Principal Trombonist, Bristol Renaissance Faire; Bass Trombonist, West Suburban Symphony Orchestra; Founding Director, The Naperville Area Trombone Ensemble; Alto/Tenor/Bass/Contrabass Trombones, Tubas, Euphonium, Bass Trumpet, Electric Bass, Timpani & Percussion. http://www.Geocities.com/Vienna/Studio/7875/ (630) 858-7832 __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 16:09:57 -0500 From: bonemstr@america.net Subject: [Trombone-l] M-piece shank taper alterations To: Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <1137704997.43d00025a1873@pop.america.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Fellow Listers, I have a Shilke mp that Scott cut for me in the early 1990's. It' a 51 derivative for a lg bore tenor. The shank does not fit properly in a Shires leadpipe (which I assume is a standard taper, likely a Morse 2). Schilke wants $27.50 and 30 DAYS just to do the cutting. Does anyone know of a repairman that can do an excellent job for a reasonable price and get it turned around in a reasonable time frame (no plating)? I called BrassLab in NYC (Chuck) but he seemed a bit hesitant about it, or maybe I caught him at a bad time. Thanks for your input! Bob Devine Atlanta An 'All Shires' family ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 16:46:39 -0500 From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: "Fred Hudson" , , Message-ID: <004501c61d41$d4fd7d20$7f885fd8@oemcomputer> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Only if you beat me to it!! :) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Fred Hudson" To: ; Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 1:59 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > Thanks, > > I'll pass this on. Or better yet for that price I'll buy one for him! > > Fred H > ----- Original Message ----- > From: > To: "Fred Hudson" > Cc: "Trombone" ; "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 12:18 PM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > For $11.00 he can go to the Kelly Mouthpiece site and get a discontinued > mustard yellow 5G with a European shank. > > > > J.c.S. > > > > > > ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > > > We have the same situation in our Community Band - nice 4 valve Besson > euph > > > with European receiver. Woodwind/Brasswind as well as Mouthpiece Express > > > list Dennis Wick m'pcs with medium shank but I can't convince the euph > > > player to order one. He just plays a small shank with a heavy Teflon > pipe > > > tape wrap and the slides pulled way out. Sometimes he is actually in > tune! > > > > > > Better luck with yours! :-) > > > > > > Fred H > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > To: "Trombone" > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:01 AM > > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get one > > > "off > > > > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs > one, > > > and > > > > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem > was! > > > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be > > > > nice............ > > > > Patrick > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Tom Stark" > > > > To: "Trombone" > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of taper for a > > > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it supposed to > > > measure > > > > at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > > > Tom > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 17:28:12 -0500 From: Raymond Horton Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss To: Tom Izzo Cc: Trombone-L Message-ID: <43D0127C.3090307@insightbb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed Bartok had in mind an Bass Trombone in F from his earlier days in Central Europe which (presumably) had 7 full positions, so a real glissando from low B up to F was possible. So the solo in the Concerto for Orchestra (which was written for the Boston Symphony which had only single valve instruments at the time) and the repeated glissandos in _The Miraculous Mandarin_ (the complete ballet, not the shortened suite that is more commonly performed) would be much more practical on the F bass than they are on a Bb bass trombone. Bartok's F Bass trombone did not have a valve - as evidenced by the fact that he always wrote the pedal Bbs and As for the tenor trombones, but wrote pedal F for the Bass Trombone. See the 2nd piano concerto for some of the most interesting writing in this fashion. It's been about 30 years (!) since I've played it, but I recall it having a passage that jumps back and forth from one part to another, using only four notes: Pedal Bb in Trb 2, Pedal F in Trb 3, low Eb in Trb 3, and middle G (top space) in Trb 1, making an odd, hocketed syncopated melody. The gap in the range of the F bass trombone is the same reason why you will see pedal Bbs in 2nd trb, not third, in Prokofiev scores. Most trombone sections will trade these notes whenver practical so the Bass Trombonist plays the pedals. I don't know what the best modern solution would be for the Bartok 2nd Piano Concerto - I've always hoped we would play it again so I could rescore the trombone parts all the way through, myself, but we never have. RBH LO Tom Izzo wrote: >Eric, > > >--- Eric Edwards wrote: > > > >> OK, my turn for a stupid question. >> >>What's the difference between an "F" bass and >>playing on the "F" trigger? >> >> >> > >Playing on an F "trigger" is still a Bb instrument >(really a very large bore Tenor) with F attach >depressed. >An F Bass is built in F WITHOUT depressing the valve. >The valve, if there is one, is usually in C. > >Tom > > > ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 17:35:37 -0500 From: Raymond Horton Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] M-piece shank taper alterations To: bonemstr@america.net Cc: Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <43D01439.8080407@insightbb.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed You are close to a very fine repairman - Rich Ita. He is just a few exits north of Hotlanta, in Marietta. Here is his website: http://www.brassinstrumentworkshop.com/ bonemstr@america.net wrote: >Fellow Listers, > >I have a Shilke mp that Scott cut for me in the early 1990's. It' a 51 >derivative for a lg bore tenor. The shank does not fit properly in a Shires >leadpipe (which I assume is a standard taper, likely a Morse 2). >Schilke wants $27.50 and 30 DAYS just to do the cutting. Does anyone know of a >repairman that can do an excellent job for a reasonable price and get it turned >around in a reasonable time frame (no plating)? I called BrassLab in NYC >(Chuck) but he seemed a bit hesitant about it, or maybe I caught him at a bad >time. >Thanks for your input! > >Bob Devine >Atlanta >An 'All Shires' family >_______________________________________________ >Trombone-l mailing list >Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 16:50:05 -0600 From: "conn60h" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Trumpet Duet To: "Bill Dinwiddie" , "List Trombone" Message-ID: <024901c61d4a$b0b07ea0$1c7662d1@WORKSTATION2> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=response Back in the 60's and 70's we had a trumpet player up in this neck of the woods who would play three trumpets at once, and two when astride his pogo stick. Wally Pikal was his name. The band was Wally Pikal and the Dill Pickles. Great polka band. Great name. The guy is still playing. I think he's 76 now. Only playing one trumpet at a time now. LOL Kenny ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill Dinwiddie" To: "List Trombone" Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:14 AM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Trumpet Duet >I just love the way he kind of sucks you in to the increasingly improbable, >nay, the clearly impossible things that he is doing. Very clever and funny. > > I actually used to back up an act who could play 3 trumpets > simultaneously. He has a special triple mouthpiece with 3 cups welded > together. > > But it looks to me like Ed can really play. I just don't know if he IS > playing at any time. But Jeff is probably right, the tone is pretty much > the same throughout. I wonder who played on the original Zorba tracks. > Some excellent playing by some studio cat (or cats). > > Bill Dinwiddie > > > > ************************************************************************** > > No, the whole thing is on tape. The trumpet tone is too good, and > doesn't change at all through the course of him moving to two > trumpets, then nostrils, etc, > > Jeff > On Jan 19, 2006, at 12:53 AM, Chris Tune wrote: > >> Not to rain on the parade . . .(and I totally dig this act!) . . . >> >> I assume the first part he literally IS playing both trumpet parts >> (and that >> is pretty impressive) . . but the later stuff is just trumpets on >> tape . . >> .otherwise I'm looking at a guy who can use his nostrils to play >> trumpet >> (hey. . .maybe that explains some of the sounds I hear coming out from >> behind me in some of these groups. .) >> >> What is this? Never on Sunday? I'm trying to remember if that's >> this tune. >> >> Chris >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> From: "Wayne Dyess" >> To: >> Cc: "Bone List" >> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 4:19 PM >> Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Math question >> >> >>> Speaking of websites: >>> >>> Does he get paid for doubling? >>> Click to watch: Trumpet Duet >>> Description: Ed Thompson's hilarious trumpet duet...with himself. >>> >>> >>> We need a TROMBONE duet like this one.... >>> Oh yeah. Maybe Tom Izzo could do a quartet in similar fashion? >>> How's >>> about it Tom?? Game??? >>> Wayne Dyess > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 15:05:20 -0800 From: Daryl Burch Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Performance Oddities - was - "Trumpet Duet" To: List Trombone Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; delsp=yes; format=flowed I knew a guy in drum corps (Boston, '86-ish) that played "Bugler's Holiday" on a Contrabass in 3-part harmony. He was just a little nuts. He was 5'4" and insisted on playing contra. At parade rest the contra stood almost to his shoulder. It's that trick of playing a note, singing a 5th above it, and having the harmonics ring-in to make the third voice. (Somebody may know the technical name for it.) I've had limited luck pulling it off. (It's kinda like playing 7-against-4 on independent piano lines.) But he could do it, with clean triple-tounging, and relatively in tune. It takes a fair bit of practice even to get coordinated enough to sing a fifth above a note, while holding the bottom note--in tune--and supporting it. Takes almost twice the breath support. He was also a fairly impressive juggler/sword swallower. Cheers! -D- www.radionoise.com <- Rock star by night www.burchinteractive.com <- Tech-nerd by day #;-) On Jan 19, 2006, at 2:50 PM, conn60h wrote: > Back in the 60's and 70's we had a trumpet player up in this neck of > the > woods who would play three trumpets at once, and two when astride his > pogo > stick. Wally Pikal was his name. The band was Wally Pikal and the > Dill > Pickles. Great polka band. Great name. The guy is still playing. I > think > he's 76 now. Only playing one trumpet at a time now. LOL > > Kenny > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Bill Dinwiddie" > To: "List Trombone" > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 10:14 AM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Trumpet Duet > > >> I just love the way he kind of sucks you in to the increasingly >> improbable, >> nay, the clearly impossible things that he is doing. Very clever and >> funny. >> >> I actually used to back up an act who could play 3 trumpets >> simultaneously. He has a special triple mouthpiece with 3 cups welded >> together. >> >> But it looks to me like Ed can really play. I just don't know if he IS >> playing at any time. But Jeff is probably right, the tone is pretty >> much >> the same throughout. I wonder who played on the original Zorba tracks. >> Some excellent playing by some studio cat (or cats). >> >> Bill Dinwiddie >> >> >> >> ********************************************************************** >> **** >> >> No, the whole thing is on tape. The trumpet tone is too good, and >> doesn't change at all through the course of him moving to two >> trumpets, then nostrils, etc, >> >> Jeff >> On Jan 19, 2006, at 12:53 AM, Chris Tune wrote: >> >>> Not to rain on the parade . . .(and I totally dig this act!) . . . >>> >>> I assume the first part he literally IS playing both trumpet parts >>> (and that >>> is pretty impressive) . . but the later stuff is just trumpets on >>> tape . . >>> .otherwise I'm looking at a guy who can use his nostrils to play >>> trumpet >>> (hey. . .maybe that explains some of the sounds I hear coming out >>> from >>> behind me in some of these groups. .) >>> >>> What is this? Never on Sunday? I'm trying to remember if that's >>> this tune. >>> >>> Chris >>> >>> ----- Original Message ----- >>> From: "Wayne Dyess" >>> To: >>> Cc: "Bone List" >>> Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 4:19 PM >>> Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Math question >>> >>> >>>> Speaking of websites: >>>> >>>> Does he get paid for doubling? >>>> Click to watch: Trumpet Duet >>>> Description: Ed Thompson's hilarious trumpet duet...with himself. >>>> >>>> >>>> We need a TROMBONE duet like this one.... >>>> Oh yeah. Maybe Tom Izzo could do a quartet in similar fashion? >>>> How's >>>> about it Tom?? Game??? >>>> Wayne Dyess >> >> >> >> > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 17:10:39 -0600 From: "Fred Hudson" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" , , Message-ID: <002a01c61d4d$92c96fc0$a5d08c41@s0024172501> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Someone apparently beat both of us, at least I couldn't find any mention of it on the web site. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" To: "Fred Hudson" ; ; Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 3:46 PM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > Only if you beat me to it!! :) > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Fred Hudson" > To: ; > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 1:59 PM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > Thanks, > > > > I'll pass this on. Or better yet for that price I'll buy one for him! > > > > Fred H > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: > > To: "Fred Hudson" > > Cc: "Trombone" ; "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 12:18 PM > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > For $11.00 he can go to the Kelly Mouthpiece site and get a discontinued > > mustard yellow 5G with a European shank. > > > > > > J.c.S. > > > > > > > > > ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > > > > We have the same situation in our Community Band - nice 4 valve Besson > > euph > > > > with European receiver. Woodwind/Brasswind as well as Mouthpiece > Express > > > > list Dennis Wick m'pcs with medium shank but I can't convince the euph > > > > player to order one. He just plays a small shank with a heavy Teflon > > pipe > > > > tape wrap and the slides pulled way out. Sometimes he is actually in > > tune! > > > > > > > > Better luck with yours! :-) > > > > > > > > Fred H > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > > To: "Trombone" > > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:01 AM > > > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get > one > > > > "off > > > > > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs > > one, > > > > and > > > > > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem > > was! > > > > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be > > > > > nice............ > > > > > Patrick > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Tom Stark" > > > > > To: "Trombone" > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > > > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of taper for > a > > > > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it supposed to > > > > measure > > > > > at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Trombone-l mailing list > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 19:37:12 -0500 From: Jeff Thompson <7cuh-asb6@spamex.com> Subject: [Trombone-l] new jazz trombone book To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <200601200047.k0K0lCRH031379@server5.samford.edu> Content-Type: text/plain I was at the IAJE last week, and while I was there I bought the new book by Kurt Dietrich, titled Jazz 'Bones, The World of Jazz Trombones. Published by Advance Music. List price I think is $49.95. Its a paperback and has 611 pages. It talks about 485 jazz trombonists. I have been having a lot of fun skimming various pages. Start looking for this at the usual places. Regards, Jeff Thompson ------------------------------ Message: 12 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 19:51:15 -0500 From: "John Burton" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: , Message-ID: <2C761FD6AEB2B640BF5524B1DD167C9D5BF6@centralstorage.johnburton.local> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I hadn't bought gold from them yet, and I've been toying about buying a gold Schilke 60 to replace my silver 59. Thanks for the comment, I guess I'll just look elsewhere for gold. Thanks! ~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~= john burton Bach 50B3 Bass Trombone, Charleston NeoPhonic Orchestra South Charleston, West Virginia > -----Original Message----- > From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu > [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu] On Behalf Of > thetubameister@adelphia.net > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 9:44 AM > To: trombone-l@samford.edu > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > I've had good experiences with them as well, though their > gold plating is pretty low-grade - lasts about 6 months. > Save your money if you want gold, but otherwise they're great! > > J.c.S. > > > ---- John Burton wrote: > > Sounds like a task for "http://www.MouthPieceExpress.com". > > > > I've done a lot of business thru them, and always pleased. > > > > Somewhat along the same lines, I've found that they're > willing to send > > a Schlike up to Carl and have him turn the shank to fit my Bach > > receiver prior to sending it on to me; presuming I ask first! > > > > Give 'em a look, and if you don't see what you're looking for, ask. > > They've got a good customer service dept as well. > > > > ~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~=~= > > > > john burton > > Bach 50B3 > > Bass Trombone, Charleston NeoPhonic Orchestra South > Charleston, West > > Virginia > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu > > > [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu] On Behalf Of Lisa > & Patrick > > > Bates > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 6:02 AM > > > To: Trombone > > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone > could get > > > one "off the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated > > > that needs one, and I'm the only guy in the area that had half a > > > clue what the problem was! > > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local > dealer would be > > > nice............ > > > Patrick > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: "Tom Stark" > > > To: "Trombone" > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of > taper for > > > > a > > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it > supposed to > > > measure at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > > Tom > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Trombone-l mailing list > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 13 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 20:19:33 -0500 From: dslide13@aol.com Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] new jazz trombone book To: 7cuh-asb6@spamex.com, trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <8C7EB76B46C1534-A58-6239@FWM-D06.sysops.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Advance typically publishes high quality material. I'll be on the lookout for this. Feel free to share a review of the book with us when you've gotten through it. David Gibson trombonist/educator www.jazzbone.org -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Thompson <7cuh-asb6@spamex.com> To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Sent: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 19:37:12 -0500 Subject: [Trombone-l] new jazz trombone book I was at the IAJE last week, and while I was there I bought the new book by Kurt Dietrich, titled Jazz 'Bones, The World of Jazz Trombones. Published by Advance Music. List price I think is $49.95. Its a paperback and has 611 pages. It talks about 485 jazz trombonists. I have been having a lot of fun skimming various pages. Start looking for this at the usual places. Regards, Jeff Thompson _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 14 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 21:14:15 -0500 From: thetubameister@adelphia.net Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: Fred Hudson Cc: TROMBONE-L@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <13577562.1137723255149.JavaMail.root@web27> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 http://www.kellymouthpieces.com/discontinued.asp J.c.S. ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > Someone apparently beat both of us, at least I couldn't find any mention of > it on the web site. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > To: "Fred Hudson" ; ; > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 3:46 PM > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > Only if you beat me to it!! :) > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: "Fred Hudson" > > To: ; > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 1:59 PM > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > I'll pass this on. Or better yet for that price I'll buy one for him! > > > > > > Fred H > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > From: > > > To: "Fred Hudson" > > > Cc: "Trombone" ; "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 12:18 PM > > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > For $11.00 he can go to the Kelly Mouthpiece site and get a > discontinued > > > mustard yellow 5G with a European shank. > > > > > > > > J.c.S. > > > > > > > > > > > > ---- Fred Hudson wrote: > > > > > We have the same situation in our Community Band - nice 4 valve > Besson > > > euph > > > > > with European receiver. Woodwind/Brasswind as well as Mouthpiece > > Express > > > > > list Dennis Wick m'pcs with medium shank but I can't convince the > euph > > > > > player to order one. He just plays a small shank with a heavy Teflon > > > pipe > > > > > tape wrap and the slides pulled way out. Sometimes he is actually in > > > tune! > > > > > > > > > > Better luck with yours! :-) > > > > > > > > > > Fred H > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > From: "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > > > To: "Trombone" > > > > > Sent: Thursday, January 19, 2006 5:01 AM > > > > > Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get > > one > > > > > "off > > > > > > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs > > > one, > > > > > and > > > > > > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem > > > was! > > > > > > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would > be > > > > > > nice............ > > > > > > Patrick > > > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > > > > > From: "Tom Stark" > > > > > > To: "Trombone" > > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 18, 2006 10:18 PM > > > > > > Subject: [Trombone-l] medium shanks > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > > Does anyone know the actual dimensions and/or rate of taper > for > > a > > > > > > "European" style medium shank? i.e. what diameter is it supposed > to > > > > > measure > > > > > > at the small end, and one inch up? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thanks in advance!! > > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > Trombone-l mailing list > > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 15 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 00:07:42 -0500 From: BGuttman Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: Trombone Mailing List Message-ID: <200601200007_MC3-1-B5F5-E793@compuserve.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Message text written by "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get one "off the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs one, and I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem was! Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be nice............< There are actually two different "Medium" shanks, one originally for the Boosey / Besson Euphonium, and one for the Yamaha 321 Euphonium. Denis Wick has both types. One is M, and one is Y. I got a 4AY for an old G-Bass trombone and it works great. I think the M and Y shanks are available in 4 and 6 cups. Good luck. Bruce Guttman Londonderry, NH ------------------------------ Message: 16 Date: Thu, 19 Jan 2006 23:52:39 -0600 From: Wayne Dyess Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. . . To: "Moran, Doug" Cc: Bone List Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed I, too, do a lot of on-location recording work, and had a pro studio for 10 years. The Lexicon 480L just can't be beat. I'd love to check out the Sony you mention, Doug. I have also tried the Waves (works OK) and the Alitverb... but even they don't come close to my outboard Yamaha. If you must stay onboard computing-wise as a plug-in, try to get a demo version before paying your bucks. You'll be glad you did. Best wishes, Wayne Dyess On Jan 19, 2006, at 10:27 AM, Moran, Doug wrote: > I have an on-location recording business, but no a home-studio > technically. I use ProTools and Sound Designer II for editing. Most > of my projects are single-point stereo. > > The only reverb I have tried that I like is in an outboard box. The > high end Lexicons (300, 480, etc.) are great, but big $$$. I found > and bought a used Sony DPS-V77 multi-effect processor. Crazy stuff in > there, but the reverbs are the best. Digital I/O and well as analog, > but you have to have the Digital I/O adaptor or make one. The digital > I/O accepts and returns up to 24 bits. > > If you need to stay in the computer, the best I found is Waves > (http://www.waves.com/) Trueverb, and I think they also have a newer > reverb plug-in available. > > I've not used Altiverb (http://www.audioease.com/), but the folks that > have dual processor Macs say it is a great software reverb. > > Check on the Cubase user groups. I'm on the DAW-Mac list and most of > the great things I learn about digital audio come from there. Sort of > like Trombone-L - real folks who tell it like it is. > > Doug > morand@denison.edu > > > On Jan 19, 2006, at 11:07 AM, Chris Tune wrote: > >> Perhaps someone on the Trb-L knows something about this issue I'm >> facing: >> >> I've been mastering tunes onto CD recently and have become thoroughly >> dissatisfied with the pre-packaged reverb that is in Cubase SL. I've >> been >> looking at newer reverbs and came up with a Google hit on Convolution >> Reverbs with an interesting product to possibly purchase. >> >> These Convolution Reverbs essentially capture the "response pattern" >> of a >> room given a set of test tones which are run into the room while >> recording >> the responses. The software then can (possibly aided with some >> "mapping" of >> the dimensions of the room. . .I don't know, but I've seen what looks >> like a >> "room" "as-built" type drawing with drawings or figures representing >> something to do with room acoustics. .this part I'm fuzzy on. .) >> reproduce >> the acoustic effect of your recorded sound being emitted into that >> room. Of >> course you can control or "tweak" subtle and not-so-subtle aspects of >> the >> reverb, but the idea is that you finally get that "perfect" hall you >> always >> really, really liked. Also, you can trade patterns or download and >> upload >> these things to web sites. >> >> Anyway, one software convolution reverb product (I'm guessing this is >> NOT >> the only one) that seems to be a good one runs US$ about 140. It is >> called >> Voxengo "Pristine Space". It also has tools for managing or obtaining >> the >> sampled rooms (available under separate charge, of course). We >> apparently >> already have enough of a standard here (the add-in is VST based so >> Cubase >> loves it) that there are web sites with reverb characteristics for >> churches, >> symphonic halls. . .auditoriums. . .funny rooms like stairwells. . >> .and so >> on. It appears that you load these into your computer directory at >> the >> right place and away you go. Up to eight channels of this reverb can >> be >> used (I would likely not use any more than that . . and would more >> likely >> use only a few at a time). The sample people Garritan have started to >> issue >> preset patterns for various rooms. Of course these are obtainable >> under >> separate cost. . .like everything in the software world. >> >> Anybody know about this thing? It "sounds" good, but I've not "heard >> it". . >> .[odd, huh?] I like the idea of having the capability of trying out a >> Lexicon unit one second and then switching to a Yamaha unit the next >> and >> then on to an Alesis (I love my outboard Midiverb 4. . .but it is >> kinda >> clunky sitting there on the studio desk or in the rack. .) and of >> course, >> you don't lose fidelity by going out to Analog and back into Digital. >> >> Thanks >> Chris > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 17 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 08:50:12 -0500 (EST) From: "Moran, Doug" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. To: Wayne Dyess , Bone List Message-ID: Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII Great advice from Wayne about using the demo before purchasing. Most of the plug-in suppliers let you use a plug-in for 30 days or a set number of uses. Listen to the results on multiple sets of speakers as well. But, you need to know what the speakers sound like with a few of your favorite recordings so you know what you are listen to and for. Trombone is a hard instrument to reproduce well. The audible frequency lies in the range of the crossover in most 2 way speaker systems. It depends on the decay slopes of the crossover, and how much overlap the crossover gives each speaker. A friend of mine design and built me a crossover for a speaker and sub combo I have. Absolutely flat lined when you add up the decay lines from the scope. It lost the trombones. Wayne - the Sony V77 shows up used on eBay once in a while. A close second is the Kurzweil Rumour. I understand the A/D in the Rumour is good enough to buy it just for that. Doug On Thu, 19 Jan 2006, Wayne Dyess wrote: > I, too, do a lot of on-location recording work, and had a pro studio > for 10 years. The Lexicon 480L just can't be beat. I'd love to check > out the Sony you mention, Doug. I have also tried the Waves (works OK) > and the Alitverb... but even they don't come close to my outboard > Yamaha. > > If you must stay onboard computing-wise as a plug-in, try to get a demo > version before paying your bucks. You'll be glad you did. > Best wishes, > Wayne Dyess > > On Jan 19, 2006, at 10:27 AM, Moran, Doug wrote: > > > I have an on-location recording business, but no a home-studio > > technically. I use ProTools and Sound Designer II for editing. Most > > of my projects are single-point stereo. > > > > The only reverb I have tried that I like is in an outboard box. The > > high end Lexicons (300, 480, etc.) are great, but big $$$. I found > > and bought a used Sony DPS-V77 multi-effect processor. Crazy stuff in > > there, but the reverbs are the best. Digital I/O and well as analog, > > but you have to have the Digital I/O adaptor or make one. The digital > > I/O accepts and returns up to 24 bits. > > > > If you need to stay in the computer, the best I found is Waves > > (http://www.waves.com/) Trueverb, and I think they also have a newer > > reverb plug-in available. > > > > I've not used Altiverb (http://www.audioease.com/), but the folks that > > have dual processor Macs say it is a great software reverb. > > > > Check on the Cubase user groups. I'm on the DAW-Mac list and most of > > the great things I learn about digital audio come from there. Sort of > > like Trombone-L - real folks who tell it like it is. > > > > Doug > > morand@denison.edu > > > > On Jan 19, 2006, at 11:07 AM, Chris Tune wrote: > > > >> Perhaps someone on the Trb-L knows something about this issue I'm > >> facing: > >> > >> I've been mastering tunes onto CD recently and have become thoroughly > >> dissatisfied with the pre-packaged reverb that is in Cubase SL. I've > >> been > >> looking at newer reverbs and came up with a Google hit on Convolution > >> Reverbs with an interesting product to possibly purchase. > >> > >> These Convolution Reverbs essentially capture the "response pattern" > >> of a > >> room given a set of test tones which are run into the room while > >> recording > >> the responses. The software then can (possibly aided with some > >> "mapping" of > >> the dimensions of the room. . .I don't know, but I've seen what looks > >> like a > >> "room" "as-built" type drawing with drawings or figures representing > >> something to do with room acoustics. .this part I'm fuzzy on. .) > >> reproduce > >> the acoustic effect of your recorded sound being emitted into that > >> room. Of > >> course you can control or "tweak" subtle and not-so-subtle aspects of > >> the > >> reverb, but the idea is that you finally get that "perfect" hall you > >> always > >> really, really liked. Also, you can trade patterns or download and > >> upload > >> these things to web sites. > >> > >> Anyway, one software convolution reverb product (I'm guessing this is > >> NOT > >> the only one) that seems to be a good one runs US$ about 140. It is > >> called > >> Voxengo "Pristine Space". It also has tools for managing or obtaining > >> the > >> sampled rooms (available under separate charge, of course). We > >> apparently > >> already have enough of a standard here (the add-in is VST based so > >> Cubase > >> loves it) that there are web sites with reverb characteristics for > >> churches, > >> symphonic halls. . .auditoriums. . .funny rooms like stairwells. . > >> .and so > >> on. It appears that you load these into your computer directory at > >> the > >> right place and away you go. Up to eight channels of this reverb can > >> be > >> used (I would likely not use any more than that . . and would more > >> likely > >> use only a few at a time). The sample people Garritan have started to > >> issue > >> preset patterns for various rooms. Of course these are obtainable > >> under > >> separate cost. . .like everything in the software world. > >> > >> Anybody know about this thing? It "sounds" good, but I've not "heard > >> it". . > >> .[odd, huh?] I like the idea of having the capability of trying out a > >> Lexicon unit one second and then switching to a Yamaha unit the next > >> and > >> then on to an Alesis (I love my outboard Midiverb 4. . .but it is > >> kinda > >> clunky sitting there on the studio desk or in the rack. .) and of > >> course, > >> you don't lose fidelity by going out to Analog and back into Digital. > >> > >> Thanks > >> Chris > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Trombone-l mailing list > > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > > > ------------------------------ Message: 18 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 08:14:12 -0600 From: Dave Tall Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Eb crook for bass bone To: George Carr Cc: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20060120081412.013c46d0@mail.mchsi.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:04 AM 1/19/2006 -0500, George Carr wrote: >> When independant horns came on the market, all that was done was move the whole step valve out of the F tubing and onto the main line behind the F valve. By itself the valve become known as the G valve. Two triggers down still gave Eb in first, but now the second trigger could be used by itself. Having a G valve added a great deal of facility for those brave enough to use it alone. Many players at this time were still wed to the idea of the second valve only being used in conjuntion with the first valve. >> > >This is the historical part that confuses me. When the whole-step >valve is independent, and used by itself, doesn't it shift the horn >from Bb to Ab? Why is it called a G valve? It's the length of a whole step for the instrument plus the F valve tubing. This is longer than a whole step for the Bb instrument. The slide location for low Eb with the valve is somewhere between open 3rd and open 4th position. This is the length of the "whole step" tubing; it's a whole step on an instrument in F, not one in Bb. Therefore, that amount of tubing puts the open instrument in a somewhat sharp G. Dave Tall Bass Trombonist New Mexico Symphony ------------------------------ Message: 19 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 9:46:51 -0500 From: thetubameister@adelphia.net Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: BGuttman Cc: Trombone Mailing List Message-ID: <28365105.1137768411256.JavaMail.root@web27> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Hm. I use a stock Perantucci 2A small shank and it fits my 321 fine... J.c.S. ---- BGuttman wrote: > Message text written by "Lisa & Patrick Bates" > > > Good question! I'll add to it. Anyone know where someone could get one "off > the shelf"? Our local community band had a horn donated that needs one, and > I'm the only guy in the area that had half a clue what the problem was! > Something mainstream that I can get through a local dealer would be > nice............< > > There are actually two different "Medium" shanks, one originally for the > Boosey / Besson Euphonium, and one for the Yamaha 321 Euphonium. > > Denis Wick has both types. One is M, and one is Y. I got a 4AY for an old > G-Bass trombone and it works great. > > I think the M and Y shanks are available in 4 and 6 cups. > > Good luck. > > Bruce Guttman > Londonderry, NH > > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 20 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 16:17:22 -0000 From: "Keith Marr" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss To: "Trombone-L" Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original For that matter this is why you always find the Bb pedals in the 2nd trombone in Elgar. He was thinking of a bass trombone in G. Knowing that explains a lot of his trombone section writing, for example the bass trombone rests while the 2nd trombone glissandos up from E (or is it F sharp) in the finale of the cello concerto. just can't be done on a G bass. Keith in Bb/F/D (but can be in G/D when he gets it down from the attic!) ----- Original Message ----- > Bartok had in mind an Bass Trombone in F from his earlier days in > Central Europe which (presumably) had 7 full positions, so a real > glissando from low B up to F was possible. So the solo in the Concerto > for Orchestra (which was written for the Boston Symphony which had only > single valve instruments at the time) and the repeated glissandos in > _The Miraculous Mandarin_ (the complete ballet, not the shortened suite > that is more commonly performed) would be much more practical on the F > bass than they are on a Bb bass trombone. > > Bartok's F Bass trombone did not have a valve - as evidenced by the fact > that he always wrote the pedal Bbs and As for the tenor trombones, but > wrote pedal F for the Bass Trombone. > > See the 2nd piano concerto for some of the most interesting writing in > this fashion. It's been about 30 years (!) since I've played it, but I > recall it having a passage that jumps back and forth from one part to > another, using only four notes: Pedal Bb in Trb 2, Pedal F in Trb 3, low > Eb in Trb 3, and middle G (top space) in Trb 1, making an odd, hocketed > syncopated melody. > > The gap in the range of the F bass trombone is the same reason why you > will see pedal Bbs in 2nd trb, not third, in Prokofiev scores. Most > trombone sections will trade these notes whenver practical so the Bass > Trombonist plays the pedals. I don't know what the best modern solution > would be for the Bartok 2nd Piano Concerto - I've always hoped we would > play it again so I could rescore the trombone parts all the way through, > myself, but we never have. ------------------------------ Message: 21 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 10:21:49 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] medium shanks To: Trombone Mailing List Message-ID: <43D10E1D.8030005@earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1; format=flowed thetubameister@adelphia.net wrote: >Hm. I use a stock Perantucci 2A small shank and it fits my 321 fine... > >J.c.S. > > > > I was thinking the same thing. The Yamaha 321 just takes the regular small shank trombone mouthpiece. I have always used Bach or Denis Wick trombone mouthpieces and they fit correctly. Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Message: 22 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 08:44:13 -0800 From: "Chris Tune" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. To: "Moran, Doug" , "Wayne Dyess" , "Bone List" Message-ID: <021401c61de0$bfeb8180$0400a8c0@athlon2800> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original What is that crossover frequency? That must be a point which provides the "diction" to trombone sound (or maybe some unique quirk or useful transient sound), as opposed to the primary or fundamental frequency of the notes we play. Perhaps this is where much of our important acoustic energy is directed. Or perhaps this is a "weak link" frequency which, if not handled just right, works to oppose the propagation of the trombone sound. . . .[hmmm . . . .think, think, think . . .this is why I really LIKE acoustics. . .I tend to believe that we still have more to learn in these arenas. . .particularly in very low and mid-low frequency ranges. . . .mainly, I think this because the human ear is very sensitive at hearing "around" here and also because we also "feel" sound here via ultra low content] Interesting that larger diaphragm condenser mic and RIBBON mics are renown for their ability with the instruments in this mid low to low range. Why would the size of the sensing diaphragm make such a difference? Why, when the mics are generally tested at equally flat response patterns? Seems to me a pedal Bb is around the 50-60hz area as to fundamental, but I'm sure just from listening to a brassy, loud pedal tone that a typical good bass trombone sound is putting out quite a bit of sound an octave higher and another octave higher than that, and then also probably on up the higher harmonics to a sound two ocataves and a fifth above the fundamental and so forth. The exact mix of energy I'm not able to describe, but I've looked at the sound of my quartet parts on the 'Spectrum" view that is so common now and I can see much additional energy coming in above the "hot" bottom note area. Luckily for me, when I auditioned the KRK "Rokit 8" monitors that I use, I had a CD of "Free for All" by Frank Rosolino with me. The KRK stood up very well against numerous other monitors including ones costing much, much more. I have yet to add a subwoofer to the mix here but there is one available from KRK themselves and so far they are impressing me as a speaker manufacturer. I'll have to look around on these reverb issues. The real important thing to me is that this reverb sound very good. I "may" try just some remastering using the outboard Midiverb 4 unit. This is a 48khz 18bit (? I think that is right) unit which really has some gorgeous hall sounds in there. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Moran, Doug" To: "Wayne Dyess" ; "Bone List" Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 5:50 AM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Any Home Recordist / Home Studio folk out there. > Great advice from Wayne about using the demo before purchasing. Most of > the plug-in suppliers let you use a plug-in for 30 days or a set number of > uses. Listen to the results on multiple sets of speakers as well. But, > you need to know what the speakers sound like with a few of your favorite > recordings so you know what you are listen to and for. > > Trombone is a hard instrument to reproduce well. The audible frequency > lies in the range of the crossover in most 2 way speaker systems. It > depends on the decay slopes of the crossover, and how much overlap the > crossover gives each speaker. A friend of mine design and built me a > crossover for a speaker and sub combo I have. Absolutely flat lined when > you add up the decay lines from the scope. It lost the trombones. > > Wayne - the Sony V77 shows up used on eBay once in a while. A close > second is the Kurzweil Rumour. I understand the A/D in the Rumour is good > enough to buy it just for that. > > Doug > > On Thu, 19 Jan 2006, Wayne Dyess wrote: > >> I, too, do a lot of on-location recording work, and had a pro studio >> for 10 years. The Lexicon 480L just can't be beat. I'd love to check >> out the Sony you mention, Doug. I have also tried the Waves (works OK) >> and the Alitverb... but even they don't come close to my outboard >> Yamaha. >> >> If you must stay onboard computing-wise as a plug-in, try to get a demo >> version before paying your bucks. You'll be glad you did. >> Best wishes, >> Wayne Dyess >> >> On Jan 19, 2006, at 10:27 AM, Moran, Doug wrote: >> >> > I have an on-location recording business, but no a home-studio >> > technically. I use ProTools and Sound Designer II for editing. Most >> > of my projects are single-point stereo. >> > >> > The only reverb I have tried that I like is in an outboard box. The >> > high end Lexicons (300, 480, etc.) are great, but big $$$. I found >> > and bought a used Sony DPS-V77 multi-effect processor. Crazy stuff in >> > there, but the reverbs are the best. Digital I/O and well as analog, >> > but you have to have the Digital I/O adaptor or make one. The digital >> > I/O accepts and returns up to 24 bits. >> > >> > If you need to stay in the computer, the best I found is Waves >> > (http://www.waves.com/) Trueverb, and I think they also have a newer >> > reverb plug-in available. >> > >> > I've not used Altiverb (http://www.audioease.com/), but the folks that >> > have dual processor Macs say it is a great software reverb. >> > >> > Check on the Cubase user groups. I'm on the DAW-Mac list and most of >> > the great things I learn about digital audio come from there. Sort of >> > like Trombone-L - real folks who tell it like it is. >> > >> > Doug >> > morand@denison.edu >> > >> > On Jan 19, 2006, at 11:07 AM, Chris Tune wrote: >> > >> >> Perhaps someone on the Trb-L knows something about this issue I'm >> >> facing: >> >> >> >> I've been mastering tunes onto CD recently and have become thoroughly >> >> dissatisfied with the pre-packaged reverb that is in Cubase SL. I've >> >> been >> >> looking at newer reverbs and came up with a Google hit on Convolution >> >> Reverbs with an interesting product to possibly purchase. >> >> >> >> These Convolution Reverbs essentially capture the "response pattern" >> >> of a >> >> room given a set of test tones which are run into the room while >> >> recording >> >> the responses. The software then can (possibly aided with some >> >> "mapping" of >> >> the dimensions of the room. . .I don't know, but I've seen what looks >> >> like a >> >> "room" "as-built" type drawing with drawings or figures representing >> >> something to do with room acoustics. .this part I'm fuzzy on. .) >> >> reproduce >> >> the acoustic effect of your recorded sound being emitted into that >> >> room. Of >> >> course you can control or "tweak" subtle and not-so-subtle aspects of >> >> the >> >> reverb, but the idea is that you finally get that "perfect" hall you >> >> always >> >> really, really liked. Also, you can trade patterns or download and >> >> upload >> >> these things to web sites. >> >> >> >> Anyway, one software convolution reverb product (I'm guessing this is >> >> NOT >> >> the only one) that seems to be a good one runs US$ about 140. It is >> >> called >> >> Voxengo "Pristine Space". It also has tools for managing or obtaining >> >> the >> >> sampled rooms (available under separate charge, of course). We >> >> apparently >> >> already have enough of a standard here (the add-in is VST based so >> >> Cubase >> >> loves it) that there are web sites with reverb characteristics for >> >> churches, >> >> symphonic halls. . .auditoriums. . .funny rooms like stairwells. . >> >> .and so >> >> on. It appears that you load these into your computer directory at >> >> the >> >> right place and away you go. Up to eight channels of this reverb can >> >> be >> >> used (I would likely not use any more than that . . and would more >> >> likely >> >> use only a few at a time). The sample people Garritan have started to >> >> issue >> >> preset patterns for various rooms. Of course these are obtainable >> >> under >> >> separate cost. . .like everything in the software world. >> >> >> >> Anybody know about this thing? It "sounds" good, but I've not "heard >> >> it". . >> >> .[odd, huh?] I like the idea of having the capability of trying out a >> >> Lexicon unit one second and then switching to a Yamaha unit the next >> >> and >> >> then on to an Alesis (I love my outboard Midiverb 4. . .but it is >> >> kinda >> >> clunky sitting there on the studio desk or in the rack. .) and of >> >> course, >> >> you don't lose fidelity by going out to Analog and back into Digital. >> >> >> >> Thanks >> >> Chris >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Trombone-l mailing list >> > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu >> > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l >> > >> >> > > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 23 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 11:50:25 -0500 (GMT-05:00) From: Roger Carmichael Subject: [Trombone-l] Schilke 50 MP To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <19609386.1137775825360.JavaMail.root@elwamui-rustique.atl.sa.earthlink.net> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Anyone have a Schilke 50 large shank mouthpiece not being used that you would sell? Would need to be in excellent to mint conditon. ------------------------------ Message: 24 Date: Fri, 20 Jan 2006 17:21:17 -0000 From: "Adrian Drover" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] FW: Eb crook for bass bone - now best Bartok gliss To: "'Keith Marr'" , "'Trombone-L'" Message-ID: <004401c61de5$eca6d2b0$0100a8c0@Adrian> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" > From: Keith Marr > > For that matter this is why you always find the Bb pedals in the 2nd > trombone in Elgar. He was thinking of a bass trombone in G. I have a big band arranging book written by British arranger Reg Owen, dated 1956. It speaks of the trombones having "one useful pedal note (Bb) which should be used with discretion". Then it says that the bass trombone is usually pitched in G, having a normal range down to C#. No mention that it is also possible to play pedals on this instrument. So, one would assume that the tenor was able to play lower than the bass. I don't ever remember British big bands using the G trombone. I think this arranger was probably mis-informed about big band instrumentation, as was the case with a few writers in that era of dance band music. G trombones were however used extensively in brass bands when I was a kid, being the only band instrument to play from a bass clef part. A. ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l End of Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 19 ******************************************