Subject: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 5 Date: Thursday, January 5, 2006 12:00 PM From: trombone-l-request@samford.edu Reply-To: trombone-l@samford.edu To: Conversation: Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 5 Send Trombone-l mailing list submissions to trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to trombone-l-request@maillists.samford.edu You can reach the person managing the list at trombone-l-owner@maillists.samford.edu When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of Trombone-l digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Hearing Loss (Bill Dinwiddie) 2. Re: Pederson Etudes? (BITEensemble@aol.com) 3. Gouinguene Trombone Concerto (Bruce Faske) 4. Re: Pederson Etudes? (Chris Tune) 5. RECORD PRACTICE? (Charles Levine) 6. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (Mikel K. Smith) 7. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (Jeff Albert) 8. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (dslide13@aol.com) 9. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (Keith Marr) 10. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (Chris Tune) 11. Re: RECORD PRACTICE? (Paul Johnston) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 12:32:06 -0600 From: "Bill Dinwiddie" Subject: [Trombone-l] Hearing Loss To: "List Trombone" Message-ID: <004001c6115d$2addfda0$0a00a8c0@av> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original >From this morning's Chicago Tribune: Pete Townshend Warns iPod Users By Associated Press Published January 4, 2006, 11:34 AM CST LONDON -- Guitarist Pete Townshend has warned iPod users that they could end up with hearing problems as bad as his own if they don't turn down the volume of the music they are listening to on earphones. Townshend, 60, guitarist in the 60s band The Who, said his hearing was irreversibly damaged by years of using studio headphones and that he now is forced to take 36-hour breaks between recording sessions to allow his ears to recover. "I have unwittingly helped to invent and refine a type of music that makes its principal components deaf," he said on his Web site. "Hearing loss is a terrible thing because it cannot be repaired. If you use an iPod or anything like it, or your child uses one, you MAY be OK ... But my intuition tells me there is terrible trouble ahead." Referring to the increasingly popular practice of downloading music from the Internet, Townshend said: "The downside may be that on our computers -- for privacy, for respect to family and co-workers, and for convenience -- we use earphones at almost every stage of interaction with sound." The Who rock group was famous for its earsplitting live performances, but Townshend said his problem was caused by using earphones in the recording studio. ...Forwarded by Bill Dinwiddie ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 18:04:14 EST From: BITEensemble@aol.com Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Pederson Etudes? To: bach42@gmail.com, Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <2a4.350283a.30edae6e@aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" In a message dated 1/3/2006 2:25:18 P.M. Eastern Standard Time, bach42@gmail.com writes: I am looking for copies of the "Elementary Etudes for Tenor Trombone" and "Elementary Etudes for Bass Trombone" by Tommy Pederson. They were published by Schmitt Music but seem to be out of print. Any used copies available? Bill Bach42@gmail.com Used to have them. If I find them, I'll scan and send since they are out of print (tenor). Wesley A. Hopper Trombone, _Triton Brass_ (http://www.tritonbrass.org/) Adjunct Professor, _Boston College_ (http://www.bc.edu/) Faculty, _Atlantic Brass Quintet Seminar_ (http://www.atlanticbrassquintet.com/seminar.php) Faculty, _Boston University Tanglewood Institute (BUTI)_ (http://www.bu.edu/cfa/music/tanglewood/) 617.331.6438 (m) 781.369.4666 (h) 2 Wyman Court Winchester, MA 01890 ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 16:01:35 -0800 (PST) From: Bruce Faske Subject: [Trombone-l] Gouinguene Trombone Concerto To: trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <20060105000135.63717.qmail@web50107.mail.yahoo.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Can anyone give me some information on the Gouinguene Concerto for Trombone and Strings? I've come up dry everywhere I've looked, and I'm trying to compile program notes for a recital I'm doing later this month. I would REALLY appreciate any help, folks. Thanks! -Bruce Faske ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Wed, 4 Jan 2006 21:29:58 -0800 From: "Chris Tune" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] Pederson Etudes? To: "Bill" , Message-ID: <004c01c611b9$343ad290$0400a8c0@athlon2800> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original That is good news. These etudes are great for the "unexpected" stuff that Tommy always throws your way. (Not unusual to have yourself jumping up by sixths from a very low note to an ultra high note. . and then doing something more scalar) And Tommy and Hoyt got a sort of way of writing going, that used bass clef and tenor clef alternatively, so that you could read it, but the copyist could minimize the ledger lines. They must have had some rules of thumb about when to switch and how many notes a phrase would have if it was to be "recast" in a new clef. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: "Bill" To: Sent: Tuesday, January 03, 2006 11:24 AM Subject: [Trombone-l] Pederson Etudes? >I am looking for copies of the "Elementary Etudes for Tenor Trombone" and > "Elementary Etudes for Bass Trombone" by Tommy Pederson. They were > published by Schmitt Music but seem to be out of print. Any used copies > available? > > Bill > Bach42@gmail.com > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 08:43:12 -0500 From: "Charles Levine" Subject: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: Message-ID: <001401c611fd$fb613e10$6fb01ad1@upstairs> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" IS IT A GOOD IDEA TO RECORD YOUR PRACTICE SESSIONS? ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2006 09:16:11 -0500 From: "Mikel K. Smith" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii I wouldn't record all - who has the time to listen to all that? I do like to record an occasional passage I'm working on. Often I find hear things I'm doing wrong - or could do better - that I don't notice as I'm playing. Mikel ------------------------------ Message: 7 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 08:04:08 -0600 From: Jeff Albert Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: "Charles Levine" Cc: Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Message-ID: <92BAA782-B400-4EA9-AF28-AAFA89C872A6@jeffalbert.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed SOMETIMES! On Jan 5, 2006, at 7:43 AM, Charles Levine wrote: > IS IT A GOOD IDEA TO RECORD YOUR PRACTICE SESSIONS? > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > > ------------------------------ Message: 8 Date: Thu, 05 Jan 2006 10:01:20 -0500 From: dslide13@aol.com Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: trombone-l@samford.edu Message-ID: <8C7E020055034B3-ED4-198F0@FWM-D10.sysops.aol.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed It really depends on what you're trying to accomplish. We tend to tackle individual facets of our development which initiates a cyclical improvement. As we become aware of one problem, we solve it to reveal another. One of the most difficult tasks in the process is the ability to hear "how we sound" and not "how we think we sound". Recording your practice can reveal this. But, hearing ourselves in this way could also be a hindrance. I know there are places in my home where the sound doesn't resonate as well and I'm affected physically. Without the acoustic warmth to which I'm accustomed, I will instinctively make a physical adjustment to achieve the purity of tone that I desire. In that case, I might be better off hearing myself less and feeling the instrument more. The practice battle is often between conscious and subconscious. Recording sessions as a "fishing expedition" to find faults in your playing may be a little too daunting. But, listening with a specific purpose could be very beneficial. i.e., how smooth are my articulations?....is my breathing/phrasing natural? how is my intonation? Using the recording as a crutch can be dangerous though. It should reveal to you what you're failing to perceive when the horn is on your face, so that you can use that awareness in the future. The ideal is to hear all of your inconsistencies when the horn IS on your face. David Gibson trombonist/educator www.jazzbone.org -----Original Message----- From: Charles Levine To: Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Sent: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 08:43:12 -0500 Subject: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? IS IT A GOOD IDEA TO RECORD YOUR PRACTICE SESSIONS? _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 9 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 15:49:39 -0000 From: "Keith Marr" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original I think I would only record my practice sessions in order to relive the agony. That would make me a masochist though . . . Seriously, I can't imagine any real value in this unless you are exceptionally self-critical. Otherwise you need a teacher listening to benefit at all. Keith in Bb/F/D Bass Trombone St Albans Symphony Orchestra Page Three Big Band ------------------------------ Message: 10 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 08:34:56 -0800 From: "Chris Tune" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: , Message-ID: <009d01c61215$f70968c0$0400a8c0@athlon2800> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1"; reply-type=original Occassionally this may be a good idea. . .but the GREAT IDEA is to record ensemble playing (i.e. rehearsals with band. . .concerts. . .gigs). Make sure you get a secure place to put your mic and recorder and it should be in front of the group. I've been doing this for a while now at some kinds of gigs and rehearsals. I've found that the trombone section is never as loud as we think we are. This may be no news for experienced professionals out there, but there appears to be an acoustic phenomenon at work that makes the ACTUAL balance much different than the players think. The saxes are much, much, much louder than you would think. The trumpets are quite a bit louder than they and almost anybody think (perhaps a good way to put it. . .is they are very AUDIBLE. . .). Trombones are nowhere as loud as they should be (and this is not just trombone chauvinism. . .they really could use a boost). I believe that the sonority of trombone does not lend itself to cutting through an ensemble's sound as well as the higher pitched instruments do. The alto saxophone can cut through with amazing "bite". .and the lead trumpet is always audible, as is the electric piano. But the lead bone is not high enough most times to get that benefit. Also the tone of the lead bone is mellower than the trumpet in the same register. This mellowness means less of the high overtones. Thus, less audibility. You should listen to this stuff. The only time the trombones are truly kinda loud is when we THINK we are "peeling the paint off the walls". Then were kinda loud. NOT peeling paint loud, but just LOUD. Chris ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 7:01 AM Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? > It really depends on what you're trying to accomplish. We tend to > tackle individual facets of our development which initiates a cyclical > improvement. As we become aware of one problem, we solve it to reveal > another. One of the most difficult tasks in the process is the ability > to hear "how we sound" and not "how we think we sound". Recording your > practice can reveal this. But, hearing ourselves in this way could also > be a hindrance. I know there are places in my home where the sound > doesn't resonate as well and I'm affected physically. Without the > acoustic warmth to which I'm accustomed, I will instinctively make a > physical adjustment to achieve the purity of tone that I desire. In > that case, I might be better off hearing myself less and feeling the > instrument more. > > The practice battle is often between conscious and subconscious. > Recording sessions as a "fishing expedition" to find faults in your > playing may be a little too daunting. But, listening with a specific > purpose could be very beneficial. i.e., how smooth are my > articulations?....is my breathing/phrasing natural? how is my > intonation? > > Using the recording as a crutch can be dangerous though. It should > reveal to you what you're failing to perceive when the horn is on your > face, so that you can use that awareness in the future. The ideal is to > hear all of your inconsistencies when the horn IS on your face. > > David Gibson > trombonist/educator > www.jazzbone.org > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Charles Levine > To: Trombone-l@server5.samford.edu > Sent: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 08:43:12 -0500 > Subject: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? > > IS IT A GOOD IDEA TO RECORD YOUR PRACTICE SESSIONS? > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l > _______________________________________________ > Trombone-l mailing list > Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu > http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ Message: 11 Date: Thu, 5 Jan 2006 10:46:09 -0600 From: "Paul Johnston" Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? To: "'Keith Marr'" , Message-ID: Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Keith and all; I think there is value in recording practice and you don't really have to be "exceptionally self-critical". You can here bumps in your playing, slight pitch issues and other things from the recording that you may be missing. This doesn't mean you have to record every hour, but a check every so often is good. My grad school teacher had me regularly record practice sessions. His take on this also had to do with what he would teach grad level students. Part of what he taught is to self anaylze. Once you get to a certain level, he thought teachers become more of a "coach" helping analyze and point out inconsistencies and problems and helping the player work through those problems more so then actually teaching new material and techniques. I agree. None of this means we get to a point where we stop learning and that there are no new techniques to learn, but we can learn to do some of that analyzing ourselves. And think, when you are out of school, who does the day to day maintenance of your playing.......you do. Maybe a lesson every now and then to get that fresh set of ears, but many of us, once out of school don't get that weekly input. And as has been said many a time here on the list, it sounds different from the drivers seat then out in the audience. If you really want something to engage your masochistic tendencies......get a multiple speed recorder, record the Clark studies playing them quickly and legato at the high tape speed and listen back at the slow speed. You will hear every gliss, bump, slop, etc., etc., etc.. This brings back bad nightmares of grad school. But with work, it can help one clean up the legato!! Paul Bass Trombone - Fort Smith Symphony -----Original Message----- From: trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu [mailto:trombone-l-bounces@samford.edu] On Behalf Of Keith Marr Sent: Thursday, January 05, 2006 9:50 AM To: trombone-l@samford.edu Subject: Re: [Trombone-l] RECORD PRACTICE? I think I would only record my practice sessions in order to relive the agony. That would make me a masochist though . . . Seriously, I can't imagine any real value in this unless you are exceptionally self-critical. Otherwise you need a teacher listening to benefit at all. Keith in Bb/F/D Bass Trombone St Albans Symphony Orchestra Page Three Big Band _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ Trombone-l mailing list Trombone-l@maillists.samford.edu http://maillists.samford.edu/mailman/listinfo/trombone-l End of Trombone-l Digest, Vol 12, Issue 5 *****************************************