Subject: TROMBONE-L digest 287 Date: Monday, January 24, 2005 12:01 AM From: Multiple recipients of list To: Multiple recipients of list TROMBONE-L Digest 287 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Slide doctor in Los Angeles by Robert Slaven 2) Re: Birthday by "Adrian Drover" 3) Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey by "Adrian Drover" 4) Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles by "Adrian Drover" 5) Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles by BGuttman 6) RE: Orchestra Bows: A Survey by "Steve Gamble" 7) Re: Birthday by Steve Beck 8) Re: Birthday by "Steve Gamble" 9) Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles by "Chris Tune" 10) Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles by Eric & Candice Swanson 11) Re: Birthday by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 12) trolls and not, pseudonyms, etc was Re: Re: Birthday by Jeff Albert 13) Broadway show instrumentaion by Eric & Candice Swanson 14) Re: Birthday by "Paul Kemp" 15) Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey by Gabriel Langfur 16) Re: Birthday by "David A. Schwartz" 17) Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey by "Chris Tune" 18) reality was Re: Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey by Jeff Albert 19) JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday by Jeff Albert 20) Alessi Seminar by ALEX ILES 21) Re: Birthday by "Paul Kemp" 22) Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday by Gussieboy@aol.com 23) Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday by "Chris Tune" 24) Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday by ALEX ILES From: Robert Slaven Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2005 22:35:34 -0800 To: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3668] Slide doctor in Los Angeles I'm going to L.A. next month to make myself a bit of money on a TV studio. I know there is at least one good slide doctor in the L.A. area, having read this list quite a bit, so I'm going to take my 4B and 2B down to get the slides tweaked into perfection, Heaven willing. So who is there, preferably close to Culver City? (That's where I'm going to be, and would rather not have to spend too much time driving.) Thanks to all! -- No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.300 / Virus Database: 265.7.2 - Release Date: 2005-01-21 From: Adrian Drover Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:48:36 -0000 To: , Trombone-L Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3669] Re: Birthday From: "Keith Marr" > It is however perfectly acceptable to say that JJ was "one of the best of > all time" as this implies an accumulative list. All I can say is Jay was O Kai A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk From: Adrian Drover Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:55:32 -0000 To: , Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3670] Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey From: "Peter Collins" > I play mainly in two orchestras and their policies are pretty similar. > They do face the audience during the bows, like you say, especially > the string players. In Hamilton, our director is constantly reminding > us to smile during the bows. A lot of people don't like it and find his > approach annoying. But, hey, he's the director so if he wants us to > smile than we can smile. How hard is that to do? I usually do my part > by not only smiling but making some wisecrack at the end of the piece > to get my section mates smiling at least for some reason. Sometimes it > works, sometimes not. For a smile to work, it has to be genuine. A forced smile looks like, well, a forced smile. If you love your audience, the smile will be genuine. A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk From: Adrian Drover Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:56:40 -0000 To: , Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3671] Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles From: "Robert Slaven" > I'm going to L.A. next month to make myself a bit of money on a TV studio. You're going to buy one? A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk From: BGuttman Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 10:20:57 -0500 To: Trombone-L Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3672] Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles Check out John Sandhagen. He is on the Online Trombone Journal Forum (http://forum.trombone.org) as a moderator. Bruce Guttman Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orchestra Hollis Town Band From: Steve Gamble Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:58:40 -0700 To: , Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3673] RE: Orchestra Bows: A Survey Hi Alex and everyone, A couple of years ago we were asked to face the audience when we bow. Except for that Earth-shattering innovation, it's just the usual stand straight up along with the Concertmaster and receive the applause thing. Everybody just started doing it, no big deal. No bid deal was made out of why we were making the change, either. I guess we're pretty easy here. Baaahhh Baaahhh Baaahhh. Steve Gamble, Librarian Tucson Symphony Orchestra 2175 N. 6th Ave. Tucson, AZ 85705 (520) 792-9155 x118 (520) 792-9314 fax (520) 991-7056 cel sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu [mailto:owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu] On Behalf Of ALEX ILES Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2005 10:46 AM To: TROMBONE-L@server5.samford.edu Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3653] Orchestra Bows: A Survey Hi everyone, This is a question for all orchestral players and orchestra concert audience members alike... When the orchestras you see and play with take a group bow, do they... a. just stand straight up b. turn slightly if necessary to face the audience [the strings especially] c. make any other "bowing" gestures. d. do anything else I haven't already said. This came up at my rehearsal with the Long Beach Symphony last night. Apparently our orchestra exec. director attended the convention in Florida a while back and saw the New World Symphony members do a different kind of bow. He liked the way it looked as did several members of our orchestra committee. He wanted to institute a new bow for the orchestra, which on the surface sounds harmless enough, but those of you who play in orchestras know when it comes to things like this, NOTHING is easy!! There are several members or our orchestra, who don't like doing anything "different" or not what they think the "major" orchestras do. I am just trying to see what everyone else's experience is here. If you play in a professional orchestra, has this subject ever come up? If so, how was it handled? Thanks for any input! Best wishes, Alex Iles From: Steve Beck Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 10:58:18 -0500 To: Trombone-L Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3674] Re: Birthday Well I think we went overboard in the troll thing. Someone posted a contrary opinion, he was labeled a troll and subsequently trashed. I don't see him continuing the baiting. Gussieboy thinks there are other trombonists, past, present, and future that may be as good or better than JJ. That is called an opinion folk. Let it go. From: Steve Gamble Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 09:23:47 -0700 To: , Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3675] Re: Birthday Hello Alex and Mr. P. Oops, did I get the initial wrong? Well anyway, it's not that everyone isn't entitled to their opinion, I just think they ought to have the balls to have it out in the open. May I suggest that Mr. P. (darn, I did it again!) re-subscribe, no questions asked, and start fresh under his true identity (although some of us MAY be able to recognize your style)? Troll or not, you'd get more respect. Steve Gamble, Librarian Tucson Symphony Orchestra 2175 N. 6th Ave. Tucson, AZ 85705 (520) 792-9155 x118 (520) 792-9314 fax (520) 991-7056 cel sgamble@tucsonsymphony.org -----Original Message----- From: owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu [mailto:owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu] On Behalf Of ALEX ILES Sent: Saturday, January 22, 2005 5:03 PM To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3663] Re: Birthday Hi all, This discussion reminds me of an incident when a JJ-bashing "troll" appeared on the JJ Johnson-list. Just as many listers began attacking this person and defending JJ, JJ himself actually entered into the heated exchange and defended the guy's right to be as big a jerk as he wanted. In fact, he LOVED the whole idea of someone criticizing him!!! To me, this incident illustrated JJ's greatness and nobility as a person might have even exceeded his immense talents as a musician. Ask anyone who knew him well and that is what you hear. I agree wholeheartedly with Chuck M... As each of us has different definitions of greatness and bring our own individual tastes to the table, it is a hopeless task to truly argue who is better at what in music. Last time I checked, there have never been judge's scores posted anywhere at the Village Vanguard, Blues Alley or Ronnie Scott's. But I digress... Personally, the moment I hear Jack T., JJ, Rosolino,Harris, Brown, Dorsey, Green, Fontana, Bequet, Vernon,Ulyate, Nanton, Alessi, Roberts, Crook, Lindberg, Nash, etc, etc, I am tempted to label EACH of them as "the greatest". Time and history will probably bear any of our individual arguments out. So far, JJ's contributions and importance to the trombone and the greater music worlds are hard to argu. Name just about any other bone player living or dead, you will get an argument, but with JJ's name, you are likely to get the LEAST disagreement. But there will always be room for disagreement and healthy debate. ...just as JJ would have wanted it. Be well and Happy B-day, J!! Alex ===================== On Jan 22, 2005, at 1:02 PM, Gussieboy@aol.com wrote: > > In a message dated 1/22/2005 2:51:13 P.M. Central Standard Time, > jimlee@cttsweb.com writes: > >> Today is the birthday of the legendary and greatest Jazz >> trombonist of all time, JJ Johnson> >> Best of all time? You are kidding, right? > After you, of course. > > > > Look, it is impossible to be the best of all time. There have been > better > and more interesting players and there will be more innovative players > in the > future and time has not ended yet. > : An attachment to this post has been stripped by: : > : plaintext.pl : > : Original idea by Phillip Porch (ppp@theporch.com) : > : Written by Stephen Modena, AB4EL (shimshon@theporch.com) : > : Modifications by Mearl Danner, (jmdanner@samford.edu) : > : All rights reserved. : > ............................................................ From: Chris Tune Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 08:40:02 -0800 To: , Trombone-L Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3676] Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles John Sandhagen is at (909) 626-2796 home (909) 869-3550 work (CSU Poly Pomona) He's located in the Pomona area about thirty five miles east of Culver City. If you left early in the morning to go out to his area you would be going against the prevailing commuter rush traffic. You might want to strategize on that a bit with one of us Angelenos. . .most of us develop alternate route strategies. The other guy I use is down in Orange County which is also far away. Chris Tune ----- Original Message ----- From: "BGuttman" To: "Trombone-L" Cc: Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2005 7:20 AM Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3672] Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles > Check out John Sandhagen. > > He is on the Online Trombone Journal Forum (http://forum.trombone.org) as > a > moderator. > > Bruce Guttman > Merrimack Valley Philharmonic Orchestra > Hollis Town Band > > From: Eric & Candice Swanson Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 11:07:41 -0600 To: Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3677] Re: Slide doctor in Los Angeles Robert Slaven wrote: > > I know there is at least one good slide doctor in the L.A. area, > having read this list quite a bit, so I'm going to take my 4B and 2B > down to get the slides tweaked into perfection, Heaven willing. > > So who is there, preferably close to Culver City? Robert, Not very good on my LA geography, but I have gotten good reports on the following: Bruce Belo 714-999-3584 9 am - 4 pm ask receptionist for Bruce Belo Jon Sandhagan [909] 626 2796 [Pomona] Robb Stewart [626] 447-1904 [Arcadia] Don Sawday ]562] 861-8159 [Long Beach] Chris Gonzalez [818] 599 3551 [SF Valley] ............................................................ : An attachment to this post has been stripped by: : : plaintext.pl : : Original idea by Phillip Porch (ppp@theporch.com) : : Written by Stephen Modena, AB4EL (shimshon@theporch.com) : : Modifications by Mearl Danner, (jmdanner@samford.edu) : : All rights reserved. : ............................................................ From: Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:42:58 EST To: , , Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3678] Re: Birthday Kenny G. Gosh what a rash of stuff that could bring out on the List. JJ got started in INDY just before I did, and he went with Thornhill, which I refused to go because I was only 17 and a hick. Early Bones Vinyl was a great one which reflected his abilities before be bop. beldon wade CPCU ............................................................ : An attachment to this post has been stripped by: : : plaintext.pl : : Original idea by Phillip Porch (ppp@theporch.com) : : Written by Stephen Modena, AB4EL (shimshon@theporch.com) : : Modifications by Mearl Danner, (jmdanner@samford.edu) : : All rights reserved. : ............................................................ From: Jeff Albert Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 13:02:04 -0600 To: Cc: Trombone-L Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3679] trolls and not, pseudonyms, etc was Re: Re: Birthday I don't think it is the existence of a contrary opinion that gets one labeled a troll. It is usually the style of presentation that gets one labeled a troll. I didn't mean to call Gussieboy a troll, I just wish that people that are obviously trying to stir the stuff, would do so without the use of a pseudonym. I think the "you've got to be kidding" part of his contrary opinion, is pretty obviously an attempt to ruffle some feathers. Jeff Albert Steve Beck wrote: > Well I think we went overboard in the troll thing. Someone posted a > contrary opinion, he was labeled a troll and subsequently trashed. I > don't see him continuing the baiting. > > Gussieboy thinks there are other trombonists, past, present, and > future that may be as good or better than JJ. That is called an > opinion folk. Let it go. > > > > > -- Jeff Albert P.O. Box 8645 Mandeville, LA 70470 (504) 782-5835 www.jeffalbert.com jeff@jeffalbert.com From: Eric & Candice Swanson Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 16:31:04 -0600 To: Trombone-l Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3680] Broadway show instrumentaion Gang, If anybody is playing or has played any of the National Tours of the following Broadway shows, I would like to know what the current instrumentation is, at least the brass. Contact me off-list. Thanks, Eric Swanson Hairspray Peter Pan The Producers On The Record (Songs from the Disney movies and musicals) Movin' Out (Billy Joel songs) Wicked From: Paul Kemp Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 17:40:17 -0500 To: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3681] Re: Birthday Since this list is intended to be a place where we offer opinions, I do have one this subject. BTW, Happy New Year to all of you. I haven't posted anything to the list in quite some time. So in a way, this is letting all of you know that I am alive and well. As far as JJ being the greatest player ever, I disagree. The reason that I disagree is because there are many people out there who, to my ears, have more interesting things to say. I never really got the idea when JJ played; (rest his soul) that he really believed that the first thing that people listen to when you play, DESPITE THE SOPHISTICATEDNESS OF THEIR LISTENING SKILLS, is the sound that you produce. There are many jazz/pop/commercial players out there who DO grab my attention, and the reason they do is because first and foremost, if you were to take 1 note out of any line that they play and analyze it, it would be a slice out of the most beautiful long tone every played. That may be somewhat narrow, but particularly in the present world in which we live, there are many people whose bare bones sound is quite uninteresting to me. As a consumer, I have a choice to make as to not I purchase their music, and there's a lot of stuff that is passed off as music that is rather uninteresting to me. So, my wallet stays in my pocket. Someone mentioned Kenny G. I don't own 1 of his albums, but that doesn't appear to have hurt his financial success any. Besides, he owns 51% of Starbucks coffee. He doesn't have to play another note. He can leave the saxophone in his case if he so desires. He is criticized more by real musicians who play the saxophone than anyone else. There are saxophone players around my locale that are definitely more interesting to my ears than Kenny G. They don't have to be famous. Perhaps I am taking the road least traveled, but I think that we must all consciously decide which road we going to take in regards to developing our artistic taste. I just received a recording of Murray McEachern about a week ago. WOW. He's just one. There are many others. Again, this is my opinion. I am not trying to force it on any of you. Got to go. Paul D Kemp Jr. 2nd Trombone Chattanooga Symphony & Opera From: Gabriel Langfur Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 14:56:07 -0800 (PST) To: , Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3682] Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey A couple of the orchestras I play in have reminded the members of the group to turn, face the audience, smile, don't fidget with your music or have an involved conversation with your stand partner or neighbor, etc. Pretty reasonable stuff, I think. I played as a ringe for a student orchestra recently where the whole orchestra took a group bow led by the conductor. It felt stupid, and I doubt it looked any better than just standing and facing and acknowledging the audience. Gabe --- ALEX ILES wrote: > > Hi everyone, > > This is a question for all orchestral players and > orchestra concert > audience members alike... > > When the orchestras you see and play with take a group > bow, do they... > > a. just stand straight up > b. turn slightly if necessary to face the audience [the > strings > especially] > c. make any other "bowing" gestures. > d. do anything else I haven't already said. > > This came up at my rehearsal with the Long Beach Symphony > last night. > Apparently our orchestra exec. director attended the > convention in > Florida a while back and saw the New World Symphony > members do a > different kind of bow. He liked the way it looked as did > several > members of our orchestra committee. He wanted to > institute a new bow > for the orchestra, which on the surface sounds harmless > enough, but > those of you who play in orchestras know when it comes to > things like > this, NOTHING is easy!! > > There are several members or our orchestra, who don't > like doing > anything "different" or not what they think the "major" > orchestras do. > I am just trying to see what everyone else's experience > is here. > > If you play in a professional orchestra, has this subject > ever come up? > If so, how was it handled? > > Thanks for any input! > > Best wishes, > > Alex Iles > > ===== Gabe Langfur Boston, MA From: "David A. Schwartz" Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:54:47 -0500 To: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3683] Re: Birthday Paul Kemp wrote >. . . As far as JJ being the greatest player ever, I disagree. > A lot of negative words have been flying in this thread. Yet no one has proposed who else is the greatest. Happy birthdary, JJ. From: Chris Tune Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 19:03:41 -0800 To: , , Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3684] Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey That's why a frown is pretty good. . .nobody cares if it's fake or real. It produces the same effect either way. . .mostly thoughts of ". . ..why are those musicians so unhappy?. . . Answer. . .they could use some more pay. . .and maybe some better benefits. . . Chris Tune ----- Original Message ----- From: "Adrian Drover" To: ; Cc: Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2005 12:55 AM Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3670] Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey > > From: "Peter Collins" > >> I play mainly in two orchestras and their policies are pretty similar. >> They do face the audience during the bows, like you say, especially the >> string players. In Hamilton, our director is constantly reminding us to >> smile during the bows. A lot of people don't like it and find his >> approach annoying. But, hey, he's the director so if he wants us to smile >> than we can smile. How hard is that to do? I usually do my part by not >> only smiling but making some wisecrack at the end of the piece to get my >> section mates smiling at least for some reason. Sometimes it works, >> sometimes not. > > > For a smile to work, it has to be genuine. > A forced smile looks like, well, a forced smile. > If you love your audience, the smile will be genuine. > > A. > > Adrian Drover > ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk > Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk > > From: Jeff Albert Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:35:47 -0600 To: Chris Tune Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3685] reality was Re: Re: Orchestra Bows: A Survey Chris Tune wrote: > That's why a frown is pretty good. . .nobody cares if it's fake or > real. It produces the same effect either way. . .mostly thoughts of > ". . ..why are those musicians so unhappy?. . . > > Answer. . .they could use some more pay. . .and maybe some better > benefits. . . If that's what they were looking for, they should have pursued a different career. I'm not saying that professional musicians shouldn't insist on respectable pay and working conditions, but if the driving force of their happiness is financial, then they went into the wrong business. I got to sub with a full time professional orchestra some last year (most of my work is jazz/commercial stuff). I was in heaven for a few weeks. We were playing great music that I never get a chance to play, I was always home before Letterman was over, the gigs were all indoors, smoke free, and well lit, it was great. Some of these guys were the grumpiest SOBs I have ever seen. I kept kidding them that they didn't make enough money not to be happy. If the music doesn't make you happy enough to smile while you take your bow, go get a real estate license. I understand frowning about the corollary BS before or after the gig, but if you can't get past that on stage, then move on. Jeff -- Jeff Albert P.O. Box 8645 Mandeville, LA 70470 (504) 782-5835 www.jeffalbert.com jeff@jeffalbert.com From: Jeff Albert Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:39:52 -0600 To: Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3686] JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday Paul Kemp wrote: >As far as JJ being the greatest player ever, I disagree. The reason that I >disagree is because there are many people out there who, to my ears, have >more interesting things to say. I never really got the idea when JJ played; >(rest his soul) that he really believed that the first thing that people >listen to when you play, DESPITE THE SOPHISTICATEDNESS OF THEIR LISTENING >SKILLS, is the sound that you produce. There are many jazz/pop/commercial >players out there who DO grab my attention, and the reason they do is >because first and foremost, if you were to take 1 note out of any line that >they play and analyze it, it would be a slice out of the most beautiful long >tone every played. > > That's interesting that JJs sound doesn't grab you. It just goes to show that we all perceive music differently and are moved by different things. If there is one thing I get listening to JJ, it is the sound. What moves me about JJ isn't really all the notes (plus there are cats that play more notes), it's the sound and the swing. Of course there are people that didn't dig his sound, and didn't think he swung very hard. I guess that's why there are so many different cats to listen to, because different things move us all. Jeff -- Jeff Albert P.O. Box 8645 Mandeville, LA 70470 (504) 782-5835 www.jeffalbert.com jeff@jeffalbert.com From: ALEX ILES Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 19:52:58 -0800 To: Trombone-l Cc: Peter Ellefson Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3687] Alessi Seminar Hi all, I am forwarding the following message from Pete Ellefson about the 2005 Alessi Seminar. I would like to echo Pete's comments. I attended the 2001 Seminar as a participant and I too cannot begin to tell you how much this week of intense playing, listening and learning changed my outlook on music and the trombone. Regardless of what kind of playing you are into, I can't recommend it highly enough!! Best wishes, Alex Iles ===================================================== > Okay, folks, it is that time again. The Alessi Seminar IV will be held > this > summer in Albuquerque, New Mexico. I was a participant in 1999 for the > first > seminar and still believe it to be the most pivotal week in my > development > as a trombonist and teacher. Everyone I have spoken with over the > years, who > has attended the seminar, has come away with the same reaction. To be > around > Mr. Alessi and the highest caliber of participant he attracts is very > inspiring. All of the seminar's activities are geared toward making > every > player, in attendance, improve---and they all do! There are recitals > every > night and a wonderful sense of camaraderie. I cannot recommend the > Alessi > Seminar highly enough. If you are serious about a career in trombone > performance you need to consider this 10-day long event. You will > improve > and have a new perspective and appreciation for the art of trombone > playing. > > A quick note about the auditors. In addition to the select few who > become > participants, there will be an auditors class---with a limit of 45 > people. > The auditors are allowed access to everything that participants are > except > for being coached by Mr. Alessi in a master class setting. In addition > there > are other special classes and ensemble opportunities for the auditors. > This > summer, I am honored to be teaching/leading the auditors class. > > The audition recording is due by March 1. People who desire to be > auditors > need not send a recording. > > Please visit this page for more information: > > http://www.slidearea.com/html/seminar.php > > I really hope you will consider auditioning to be a participant and > attending as an auditor if not selected to be a participant. > > Peter Ellefson From: Paul Kemp Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 23:00:25 -0500 To: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3688] Re: Birthday Why does there have to be one person who is the greatest? Players have different strengths and more importantly, different musical preferences. Those preferences are going to be largely determined by their individual approach to the horn. Not everyone has the desire to play as a soloist with a rhythm section, while not everyone has the desire to play in a big band trombone section, and not everyone has the desire to play in an orchestral trombone section, just to name a few. However, I do believe that if you strive to be a fundamentally great musician, and if you always maintain the attitude that you are a STUDENT, and that there is ALWAYS something new to learn about the art form, you can be successful in a number of venues. There are fundamentals in music that are universal to every type of musical situation, and the stronger that those fundamentals are, the more flexible that you can be. Wouldn't it be boring if every pianist in the world played like Bill Evans? Or Oscar Peterson? Or Art Tatum? Or Andre Previn? Or Marian PcPartland, Or Vladimir Horowitz? Or Arthur Rubenstein? Or Rudolf Serkin? Or Vladimir Ashkenazy? Now, let's apply that to our instrument. Wouldn't it be boring if everyone tried to play (sound) like Joe Alessi? Or Jay Friedman? Or Charlie Vernon? Or Doug Yeo? Or Glenn Dodson? Or Dave Steinmeyer? Or Dick Nash? Or Alistar Kay? Or Tommy Dorsey? Here's my point. Is it wrong to be influenced by great players? NO. NO. NO. More than likely, if you were to study with any of the trombone players that I mentioned, and if they detected something that was fundamentally prejudicial in your playing, they would address it. Some players are very good teachers. Some are not. Some like to teach---some really dislike it. There are things that must happen if you are going to be professionally successful on the trombone, piano, or any other instrument that you name. I would like to bring up something here that goes hand in hand with I've just said. I see this happening in the orchestral audition world more & more. I had a conversation recently with a graduate student that told me that he felt that the reason that he wasn't getting advanced in auditions was because he didn't play an X brand of trombone, and that he didn't study with X. He indicated that the student's that come out of this particular player's studio all sounded like the teacher---or if you will, clones of that teacher. I told this gentleman to stick to his convictions, to learn as much as he could from as many people as possible, and to play an instrument that truly suited him. I would bet that the reason that this person wasn't getting advanced was because of something faulty in his PREPARATION. Why should everyone play the exact same thing? Some people drive Fords, some drive Chevrolets, some drive Dodge, some drive Toyota, some drive Mitsubishi, some drive Mercedes. Every one of those cars will do basically the same thing: provide dependable transportation from point A to point B. There are very successful trombone sections in orchestras where everyone plays a different brand of instrument. There are different bells, different mouthpieces, and different types of valves. There is not one setup that is perfect for everyone. Why is it then that this garbage is being propagated that if you don't play X brand of instrument, then you'll never enjoy any kind of success? It's really strange. I've NEVER heard a player SAY that, but that seems to be idea that is going around. Younger players: become fundamentally, musically excellent. Find an instrument that suits you, and work to become the best player that you can. Paul D Kemp Jr. 2nd Trombone Chattanooga Symphony & Opera -----Original Message----- From: owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu [mailto:owner-TROMBONE-L@listproc.samford.edu] On Behalf Of David A. Schwartz Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2005 9:55 PM To: trombone-l@server5.samford.edu Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3683] Re: Birthday Paul Kemp wrote >. . . As far as JJ being the greatest player ever, I disagree. > A lot of negative words have been flying in this thread. Yet no one has proposed who else is the greatest. Happy birthdary, JJ. From: Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 23:08:39 EST To: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3689] Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday In a message dated 1/23/2005 9:40:21 P.M. Central Standard Time, jeff@jeffalbert.com writes: It just goes to show that we all perceive music differently and are moved by different things. If there is one thing I get listening to JJ, it is the sound. What moves me about JJ isn't really all the notes (plus there are cats that play more notes), it's the sound and the swing. Of course there are people that didn't dig his sound, and didn't think he swung very hard. I guess that's why there are so many different cats to listen to, because different things move us all. Now You Got It! No one can be the best of all time! My point exactly! ............................................................ : An attachment to this post has been stripped by: : : plaintext.pl : : Original idea by Phillip Porch (ppp@theporch.com) : : Written by Stephen Modena, AB4EL (shimshon@theporch.com) : : Modifications by Mearl Danner, (jmdanner@samford.edu) : : All rights reserved. : ............................................................ From: Chris Tune Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:24:10 -0800 To: , Cc: Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3690] Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday That's interesting. . .I had a similar thing happen with a good veteran player here. I said something about folks wanting to emulate Frank Rosolino's sound. He said "Why would you want to have THAT sound?" To him that wasn't a good tone quality. I rather like his tone quality. I also like JJ's tone quality. I prefer Frank over just about anybody, except maybe Urbie. Seems to me between Urbie and Frank (and Nash and a few others) I've got a pretty good variety of sweet and jazzy sounds. Interesting thing about JJ. He could arrange really well, too! Everybody who was influenced by him or met him said how sweet of a guy he was. . .sorry he's gone. He contributed greatly. Happy Birthday Mr. Johnson! He's quite "O Kai" with me too Chris Tune ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jeff Albert" To: Cc: Sent: Sunday, January 23, 2005 7:39 PM Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3686] JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday > > > Paul Kemp wrote: > >>As far as JJ being the greatest player ever, I disagree. The reason that I >>disagree is because there are many people out there who, to my ears, have >>more interesting things to say. I never really got the idea when JJ >>played; >>(rest his soul) that he really believed that the first thing that people >>listen to when you play, DESPITE THE SOPHISTICATEDNESS OF THEIR LISTENING >>SKILLS, is the sound that you produce. There are many jazz/pop/commercial >>players out there who DO grab my attention, and the reason they do is >>because first and foremost, if you were to take 1 note out of any line >>that >>they play and analyze it, it would be a slice out of the most beautiful >>long >>tone every played. > That's interesting that JJs sound doesn't grab you. It just goes to show > that we all perceive music differently and are moved by different things. > If there is one thing I get listening to JJ, it is the sound. What moves > me about JJ isn't really all the notes (plus there are cats that play more > notes), it's the sound and the swing. Of course there are people that > didn't dig his sound, and didn't think he swung very hard. I guess that's > why there are so many different cats to listen to, because different > things move us all. > > Jeff > > -- > Jeff Albert > P.O. Box 8645 > Mandeville, LA 70470 > (504) 782-5835 > www.jeffalbert.com > jeff@jeffalbert.com > > From: ALEX ILES Date: Sun, 23 Jan 2005 21:47:12 -0800 To: Trombone-l Subject: [TROMBONE-L:3691] Re: JJs sound was Re: Re: Birthday On Jan 23, 2005, at 9:24 PM, Chris Tune wrote: > > Interesting thing about JJ. He could arrange really well, too! > Everybody who was influenced by him or met him said how sweet of a guy > he was. . .sorry he's gone. He contributed greatly. Happy Birthday > Mr. Johnson! For a great introduction to JJ's fantastic composition/arranging chops, check out "Say When" [it is on CD]. It is a small big band recording made in the 60's in NYC...GREAT writing, excellent playing!! > > Alex