Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 4 Jan 2004 to 5 Jan 2004 (#2004-6) Date: Tuesday, January 6, 2004 12:00 AM From: Automatic digest processor Reply-To: "Trombones and related issues forum." To: Recipients of TROMBONE-L digests There are 12 messages totalling 462 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Hit Me, Fred (5) 2. OTJ Classifieds Update - 1/5/04 3. Rims-soldered or unsoldered. What is the difference? (3) 4. Brass Overhaul/Refinishing 5. Fw: Burt Massengale Obituary 6. Chuck McAlexander contact ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 23:10:50 -0700 From: David Oliver Subject: Hit Me, Fred I wanted to let the brethren know that a book titled "Hit Me, Fred - Recollections of a Sideman" (Fred Wesley, Jr.) is very much worth the time. It was recommended by Mike Suter back in February 2003. I wanted Mike to know that at least one lister took him up on his recommendation. (It's $21 now on Amazon) It summarizes the good and bad of someone who wanted to be jazz trombonist, and the twists and turns of his life in trying to reach that elusive goal. The sections on James Brown and his control techniques were fascinating. He also briefly performed with Ike & Tina Turner when he was a teenager. My father (retired Gary, Indiana cop) told me a story about James Brown flying into the Gary airport, not getting the money for the gig - he was always paid up front I think - and flying right back out again. Fred was apparently was here in the Denver area for a time in the 90's playing in local jazz clubs, but I wasn't back into playing yet and would have had no clue who he was then. One of the best things about his recollections are the many "lessons learned" after wrong choices. It's a great window into the jazz and funk worlds. He also addresses the big change in the ability to get recording gigs after synthesizers (and sequencers) hit, with a recollection that "horns and strings become obsolete in less than a year." He felt that all the skills he'd been refining for years were obsolete almost overnight. It's the kind of book that you can easily go back through and re-read. David Oliver Broomfield, Colorado USA ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 06:57:28 -0600 From: Chris Waage Subject: OTJ Classifieds Update - 1/5/04 Happy New Year from the Online Trombone Journal! The Online Trombone Journal Classifieds (http://www.trombone.org/classifieds) have been updated as of 6:56 AM CST on January 5, 2004. - - - - - Thank you for using the OTJ Classifieds! - - - - - OTJ Classifieds Frequently Asked Questions http://www.trombone.org/classifieds/faq.asp OTJ Gift Shoppe: http://www.cafepress.com/cp/store/store.aspx?storeid=trombones If you have any questions or comments about the Online Trombone Journal Classifieds, please contact me at chris@trombone.org. Chris Waage -- Chris Waage, Associate Webmaster The Online Trombone Journal "A Website for Trombonists" ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 08:37:56 -0500 From: sabutin Subject: Re: Rims-soldered or unsoldered. What is the difference? >Can't help but think with some of the replies regarding soldered and >un-soldered that many of them are Conn vs Bach. This really isn't an >apples-apples comparison due to the 2 companies having many other >aspects to their horns which are designed differently ie leadpipes, >tuning slides, bell tapers etc etc. > >Get Steve Shires to make you 2 (as close as possible) identical >bells, and solder one of them, then you can really get an idea as to >how this effects the horn. > >just a thought....... > >Matthew Walker >Bass Trombonist, Opera Australia >Walker's Instrument Repair, "The Brassery" > ============= Matthew... I have done comparisons like that at the factory and never achieved any sort of consistent results. A soldered bead on one bell and alloy type seems to do certain things to the response and blow of the horn, but 15 minutes later on a different set of bells the results will seem to be different. This is such a subjective experiment. We change and adapt how we are playing so quickly to different inputs that it is very hard to get a consistent read on things like this. At least it is for me. I play so many different combinations of horn and mouthpiece over a given period that this is something that has become quite reflexive. Other players who play fewer horns and in more settled situations...regular gigs with a symphony that has a home hall...seem to be more consistent in their reactions to differing equipment. That's why I am asking. Sam -- Sam Burtis is a NYC freelance trombonist and composer, the author of "The American Trombone" and proud proprietor of The Trombone Store in NYC. Visit us on the web at and/or , email us at , or call us at [718] 796-4413. The actual store in NYC is by appointment only. PLEASE VISIT THE OPEN HORN,A WEB FORUM Lots of interesting discussions going on every day. An introduction to the site is available at ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 09:17:20 -0500 From: sabutin Subject: Re: Brass Overhaul/Refinishing >I'm seeking recommendations of repair shops who overhaul and >relacquer brass instruments, specifically trombones. I have already >received Chuck McAlexander's name but do not know how to get in >touch with him. >Thanks, >Roger Carmichael His phone number is (212) 243-7180. Where are you located? S. -- Sam Burtis is a NYC freelance trombonist and composer, the author of "The American Trombone" and proud proprietor of The Trombone Store in NYC. Visit us on the web at and/or , email us at , or call us at [718] 796-4413. The actual store in NYC is by appointment only. PLEASE VISIT THE OPEN HORN,A WEB FORUM Lots of interesting discussions going on every day. An introduction to the site is available at ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 10:59:42 -0500 From: DSlide13@AOL.COM Subject: Re: Hit Me, Fred I read the book too, and have given it as a gift to a couple of non-trombonists. It is not just a trombone book, although there are many trombone related topics to appreciate. I gave it to one friend for all of the JB recollections, and to another for the memories of Mobile from Fred's formative years. And, a buddy of mine is getting ready to go on the road for a few weeks. He'll be getting a copy too. This book is a real picture of life on the road in the funk world. I play every so often with pianist Kenny Ascher here in NYC. You may know Kenny's name as the composer of "Rainbow Connection". Fred mentions that Kenny and Lew Soloff and others played sessions that he booked through Emile Charlap for JB in NYC. Kenny told me that at one of the sessions, JB didn't think the drums sounded funky enough. So, he went into the drum booth and started dancing in front of the drummer while they recorded the track. Kenny said it was amazing how much energy JB produced by doing that. It really worked. The book is full of plenty of stories like that, and also has plenty of life lessons for the willing reader. Peace, DG ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 10:11:55 -0600 From: Todd Slothower Subject: Re: Hit Me, Fred Greetings, Having been away from the list for a couple of weeks, I must have missed the title of the book referred to in your message. Could you please tell me (and others?) the title and publisher of this book? Thank you! Todd Slothower This transmission is intended and restricted for use by the above addressee only. It may contain confidential and/or privileged information exempt from disclosure under federal or state law. In the event some other person or entity receives this transmission, said recipient is hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution, or duplication of this transmission or its contents is prohibited. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 11:13:29 -0500 From: Roger Carmichael Subject: Fw: Burt Massengale Obituary Sad to announce that Burt Massengale passed away this weekend. There is a nice article about Burt in the Greensboro (NC) News and Record. Those of us who have played with Burt over the years will definitely miss him. He was a big band leader for 72 years! http://www.newsandrecord.com/news/local/gso/massengale_010504.htm ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 11:21:02 -0500 From: Monique Buzzarte Subject: Chuck McAlexander contact Chuck McAlexander The Brass Lab 532 W. 25th Street New York, NY 10001 212.243.7180 He's usually booked pretty far in advance (you need an appointment, no drop ins) but he does take smaller jobs (first come, first served, until he's got enough for the day) on Tuesdays. I've used him for many years now. Mostly minor stuff - one major job after an auto accident - I've always had good work done. Monique At 12:00 AM -0600 1/5/04, Automatic digest processor wrote: >Date: Sun, 4 Jan 2004 14:02:30 -0500 >From: Roger Carmichael >Subject: Brass Overhaul/Refinishing > >I'm seeking recommendations of repair shops who >overhaul and relacquer brass instruments, >specifically trombones. I have already received >Chuck McAlexander's name but do not know how to >get in touch with him. >Thanks, >Roger Carmichael -- ________________________ Monique BuzzartŽ monique@buzzarte.org http://www.buzzarte.org ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 12:43:35 -0500 From: "Camenga, John" Subject: Re: Hit Me, Fred Wesley, Fred. _Hit me, Fred: recollections of a side man_ Durham, NC. Duke University Press, 2002. I think that's close enough to MLA; I just put in an Ill for it(325 libraries own according to World Cat.) It's available from Amazon for $20.97 new or $11.00 used and probably at other outlets as well. I'd say more but I'm back on the internet desk John Camenga Public Library of Charlotte & Mecklenburg County Bass Trombone Matthews Town Band -----Original Message----- From: Todd Slothower To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU Sent: 1/5/04 11:11 AM Subject: Re: [TBN-L] Hit Me, Fred Greetings, Having been away from the list for a couple of weeks, I must have missed the title of the book referred to in your message. Could you please tell me (and others?) the title and publisher of this book? Thank you! Todd Slothower ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 18:45:51 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: Rims-soldered or unsoldered. What is the difference? I asked my local repairman about soldering rims, many years ago. His reply was that in the process of soldering the rim, you also wind up annealing the rim, thus also changing the tone of the bell, in that way (whatever way that is). As a result, I decided to try gluing my rim. I used lacquer, as a glue, since the trombone was not lacquered. Several times, I filled the lip with lacquer, and let it dry. Then I cleaned up any lacquer that showed, with a rag, dipped in solvent. And the results wereˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇˇ. The trombone seemed to have a more focused tone, with the addition of the lacquer. But in that it took about a day to get the lacquer to fully dry, there was no way to do an A-B comparison. So, again, weâre back to "Find a horn that you love and buy it". Donât worry so much about the things that you canât hear (bell material, soldered rim, ˇ). Leave that for the scientists, who, for reasons I wonât go into, here, donât trust their ears. Let them come up with their theories and patiently wait until they put some of those theories into practice. And if the resulting instruments sound better, then, again, just follower your ears. DanP _________________________________________________________________ Tired of slow downloads? Compare online deals from your local high-speed providers now. https://broadband.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 12:04:03 -0800 From: Dale Cruse Subject: Re: Rims-soldered or unsoldered. What is the difference? Wow. In light of this message, I just spoke to the craftsmen here in the Shires factory. They were saying that the temperature needed to solder a rim is much lower than to anneal it. Soldering is at about 500F, and annealing is above 1000F. If they were the same temperature, one would end up "annealing" the leadpipe, the handslide, the tuning slide, the valves, etc. during assembly. Dale Cruse Director of Sales S.E. Shires ---------- Original Message ---------------------------------- From: Daniel Pliskin Reply-To: Daniel Pliskin Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 18:45:51 +0000 >I asked my local repairman about soldering rims, many years ago. His reply >was that in the process of soldering the rim, you also wind up annealing the >rim ____________________________________________________________ Free 20 MB Bannerless Domain Hosting, 1000 MB Data Transfer 10 Personalized POP and Web E-mail Accounts, and more. Get It Now At Doteasy.com http://www.doteasy.com/et/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 5 Jan 2004 21:03:37 -0600 From: "Richard Z. Johnson" Subject: Re: Hit Me, Fred Here is a "book review" of sorts that I posted on the trombone.org in October, 2002: posted October 20, 2002 05:51 PM I finished reading the book yesterday. It was a VERY interesting book......one that I recommend every aspiring professional trombone player or other aspiring professional musician to read. The autobiography covers Fred's musical career from his musical beginnings learning or rather attempting to learn piano as a child to his present day professional musical career. We learn that Fred played professionally as a teenager with a jazz big band. His father was a high school choral director and profesional jazz pianist. His grandmother was a piano teacher. He covers his days playing for Ike and Tina Turner, James Brown, Bootsy Collins, George Clinton and their bands of Parliament/Funkadelic and Bootsy's Rubber Band. We learn of his playing days with the Count Basie Band. Wesley is very candid regarding what he feels are the good points AND the bad points in his playing. He talks about his failed audition for a college band scholarship because of his playing shortcomings. He also talks about the major adjustment that he made from being a member of the Parliament/Funkadelic and Bootsy's Rubber Band bands to taking over the second chair that was previously vacated in the Basie band by Al Grey. Wesley is also candid about the dual temptations of women and drugs that are faced by those musicians who are world famous or who are sidemen to the world famous. In addition, he talks about the ruthlessness of the music business, not only the managers and record company owners but also some of the fellow sidemen and the superstars that employ the sidemen. The major thrust of the entire book is that Wesley managed to persevere with a combination of talent, hard work and a smattering of luck. He talks a great deal about his love/hate relationship with James Brown, The Godfather of Soul/Hardest Working Man in Show Business. It is positively hilarious to read Fred's accounts of disciphering James Brown's grunts into music that could be played by the band. Througout the entire book, you get a feel about a man who has a deep love for music, especially jazz. However, his path always seemed to work its way back to the funk genre. He tells of solos that he played and that he recorded and that he was ashamed for his musical peers to hear. Hmmm......some of the solos that he was ashamed to play were ones that I found especially entertaining to hear and play when I was in high school in the early and mid 1970's! He not only played trombone. He wrote and arranged music for several different bands. He worked as a studio musician and even scored a couple of movies. This is a frank and revealing book about a vastly talented man who worked extremely hard to make a living as a professional musician, supporting himself and his family. If you don't feel a need to buy the book but still want to read it, then feel free to ask your library to buy it for you to read. Most public libraries are more than willing to buy book that are requested by their patrons. If you and some of your buddies call or stop by and request a book, there is a good chance that the library will order it for you. The relevant information that you would need to give them is as follows: Title: "Hit Me, Fred" Author: Fred Wesley, Jr. Publisher: Duke University Press ISBN: 0-8223-2909-3 ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 4 Jan 2004 to 5 Jan 2004 (#2004-6) *************************************************************