Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 5 Mar 2003 to 6 Mar 2003 (#2003-65) Date: Friday, March 7, 2003 12:00 AM From: Automatic digest processor Reply-To: "Trombones and related issues forum." To: Recipients of TROMBONE-L digests There are 15 messages totalling 841 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. more on diversity 2. Musician-Finder Service 3. King 4B F-trigger help (7) 4. FW: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help (3) 5. Remington 6. Band of the Grenadier Guards 7. Is there an ideal gap? ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 08:36:50 -0000 From: Adrian Drover Subject: Re: more on diversity From: "Jeff Albert" > Asking DJ what kind of horns he has...that's a dangerous question. OK, I'm in for a bit of excitement. What kind of horns does DJ have? A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 06:18:47 -0500 From: Lawrence Zaidan Subject: Musician-Finder Service Here is a free link, that may be of help to some of your ensembles in locating musicians: http://www.lasr.cs.ucla.edu/geoff/musicianfinder Cheers! Larry Zaidan ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 09:56:05 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. ... The problem I have is > with > the F-attachment trigger. > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem would > be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point with the trigger > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help. I envision that this > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don’t want > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect move > the contact point back sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over the > thumb press. It sounds like you're wanting to raise the hieght of the trigger lever, is that right? Doesn't this horn have a string trigger linkage? If so, then it is adjustable already. Loosen the screw that holds the string to the stop arm on the valve. Move the trigger to the desired height (the string will slide around the screw if the correct screw is loosened) and then tighten the screw back up when you have the trigger where you want it. Try it, it's not difficult at all. If this horn doesn't have string linkage, then I'm mistaken. A good repair technician should be able to bend it for you if necessary. Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 16:36:00 +0000 From: rkeilitz@ATT.NET Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help Eric, I'm not aware of a 4B having a string linkage, but I could be wrong. This one is a mechanical linkage. The trigger is thumb piece and the arm that reaches across the bell side of the rotor is all one piece. It then attaches to a small white plastic piece, which is pretty small already. If this white piece were smaller, that in effect would solve the problem. I have the horn in the shop currently for another issue, but when I pick it up, I'll ask them if they know of anything that can be done. Bob > rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. ... The problem I have is > > with > > the F-attachment trigger. > > > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem would > > be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point with the > trigger > > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help. I envision that > this > > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don’t want > > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect move > > the contact point back sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering > > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over the > > thumb press. > > It sounds like you're wanting to raise the hieght of the trigger lever, is that > right? Doesn't this horn have a string trigger linkage? If so, then it is > adjustable already. Loosen the screw that holds the string to the stop arm on > the > valve. Move the trigger to the desired height (the string will slide around the > screw if the correct screw is loosened) and then tighten the screw back up when > you have the trigger where you want it. Try it, it's not difficult at all. If > this horn doesn't have string linkage, then I'm mistaken. A good repair > technician should be able to bend it for you if necessary. > > Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 16:46:22 +0000 From: rkeilitz@ATT.NET Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help Mr. Edwards, Moving the bell brace back is an option, but I'm hesitant to do that, because doing so would cause the new lacquer job to be discolored. It's another option I can discuss with the technician when I pick it up either tomorrow or Monday. Another option that I've thought about since posting this initial question is to have one of those large rings that are typical on King slides soldered on the bell side of the thumb press. Then using a Bullet Brace, I could just insert my thumb through the ring and work it that way. At least I now have some options to discuss with the tech. Bob > Hi Bob, have you thought about moving the bell brace back toward the rotor? > This would set the trigger position somewhat like the 88H and 42B, where > the thumb is actually in front of the brace. > It would be possible to add some kind of material to the brace, but I think > since you said you have smaller hands, this would not be a comfortable > resolution. > By rebuilding and moving the brace out of the way, you could utilize the > Bullet Brace and position it exactly where you like. > > I hope this gives you some help. > Please call or write if you have any more questions or thoughts. > > Thanks > Eric Edwards > ee.bonearzt@verizon.net > 972.841.2931 > > -----Original Message----- > From: Trombones and related issues forum. > [mailto:TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU]On Behalf Of rkeilitz@ATT.NET > Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2003 10:21 PM > To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU > Subject: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help > > This is primarily for those who have had experience with the King trombones > with F-attachments. I don't know if the 3B has this design flaw or not. My > experience has been with the 4B and 5B. I'll try to explain the problem I'm > having in a way that is understandable. > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. A very nice job was > done > on this horn by Taylor Music (www.1800bandusa.com). The problem I have is > with > the F-attachment trigger. I have smallish hands, which makes for a > difficult > time working the F-attachment trigger effectively. I find that if I hold > the > horn so that it is correctly supported with my left hand, working the F- > trigger causes my thumb to press against the bell support between the > knuckle > and the thumb joint. This is fairly uncomfortable. The problem lies in > that > King places the pivot for the trigger behind the bell support, forcing the > player to bring the thumb around the bell support to work the trigger. > When I > come to a section of music that calls for use of the trigger, especially a > part > with a lot of trigger work, then I actually have to reposition my hand a bit > in > order to allow for this. Then, the horn is not supported as well as I'd > like. As I stated earlier, those with experience with King trombones of > this > nature will know EXACTLY what I'm talking about. > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem > would > be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point with the > trigger > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help. I envision that > this > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don't > want > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect > move > the contact point back sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over > the > thumb press. By the way, a Bullet Brace won't work on this horn, for this > purpose. I've even thought about drilling a hole in the thumb press, which > would allow a bolt to through it. I would then take a round headed bolt, > run a > nut or two all the way up to the bolt head, then run the bolt through the > hole > in the thumb press, and then affix a nut on the opposite side. The bolt > head > is then what I would be pressing upon. However, the bolt would have to be > fairly large in diameter in order to not cause pain in the thumb for > pressing > upon it a great deal. > > The other possible solution would be to place something upon the bell > support > brace that would effectively move the pivot point of my thumb rearward a > bit, > enough to be able to allow my thumb to approach the thumb press from a bit > more > of an angle than is currently available. > > I guess the real problem lies in the fact that the bell brace doesn't sit > nicely in the crook of my hand between my thumb and forefinger, like I > believe > King designers had envisioned. There is a slight contact between crook and > brace, but I don't actually "rest" the horn in this crook. At least not > like > I do my Benge 190C which has the Bullet Brace on it. > > If any of you have ever dealt with this scenario, I would certainly be glad > to > know how you did so. I really don't want to send the horn back because of > this. I love the way it plays, and it offers me exactly what I've been > looking > for in a horn in terms of slide action, slotting, response, and weight. > > I'm posting this on both the "L" and in the OTJ forum. So, if you reply to > this on one source, please don't feel obligated to reply to it in the other, > unless you would like your reply available in both forums. > > Bob > ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 12:08:01 -0600 From: "D.J. Kennedy" Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help linkage --hum might be different depending on when made im looking at a 70s 4b/f has trigger axle sticking out horiz towards mpc and bar going up inside f tubes to solid swiviling bar --then string - 3b/f -some have the nylon link ---- --------change bend twist fit try a pad - change spring -- change linkage //trigger if you have to --- german style leather thumb pull --------------why not !!!!!!! rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > Eric, > > I'm not aware of a 4B having a string linkage, but I could be wrong. This one > is a mechanical linkage. The trigger is thumb piece and the arm that reaches > across the bell side of the rotor is all one piece. It then attaches to a > small white plastic piece, which is pretty small already. If this white piece > were smaller, that in effect would solve the problem. I have the horn in the > shop currently for another issue, but when I pick it up, I'll ask them if they > know of anything that can be done. > > Bob > > rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > > > > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. ... The problem I have is > > > with > > > the F-attachment trigger. > > > > > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem would > > > be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point with the > > trigger > > > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help. I envision that > > this > > > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don’t want > > > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect move > > > the contact point back sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering > > > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over the > > > thumb press. > > > > It sounds like you're wanting to raise the hieght of the trigger lever, is that > > right? Doesn't this horn have a string trigger linkage? If so, then it is > > adjustable already. Loosen the screw that holds the string to the stop arm on > > the > > valve. Move the trigger to the desired height (the string will slide around the > > screw if the correct screw is loosened) and then tighten the screw back up when > > you have the trigger where you want it. Try it, it's not difficult at all. If > > this horn doesn't have string linkage, then I'm mistaken. A good repair > > technician should be able to bend it for you if necessary. > > > > Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 13:18:32 EST From: "Thomas B. Cox" Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help Y'all, I've seen some different King horns of various vintages. The older (pre 70'= s=20 or so) ones all have mechanical linkages. I actually think that the design=20 of those mechanical ones is pretty good except for those with smaller hands=20 like Bob. For me, it works just fine. The 70's-vintage ones have a string=20 linkage that pulls diagonally like the mechanical one did. These have all=20 metal parts (except the string of course). The 80's and newer ones have the= =20 same basic string linkage except with a plastic arm. In my opinion, they=20 ruined a fine linkage when they added the string. It made it much more=20 complicated, less efficient, and really difficult (compared to the Conn-styl= e=20 string linkage) to re-string. Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary. -Thomas B. Cox University of Alabama/ Carrollton, GA (home) Eric, I'm not aware of a 4B having a string linkage, but I could be wrong.=A0 This= =20 one is a mechanical linkage.=A0 The trigger is thumb piece and the arm that reac= hes across the bell side of the rotor is all one piece.=A0 It then attaches to a small white plastic piece, which is pretty small already.=A0 If this white=20 piece were smaller, that in effect would solve the problem.=A0 I have the horn in=20= the shop currently for another issue, but when I pick it up, I'll ask them if=20 they know of anything that can be done. Bob > rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned.=A0 ... The problem I= =20 have is > > with > > the F-attachment trigger. > > > > It seems that if I were able to do one of=A0 two things, that the proble= m=20 would > > be alleviated.=A0 First, if I could move the thumb contact point with th= e > trigger > > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help.=A0 I envision=20 that > this > > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don= =EDt=20 want > > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect= =20 move > > the contact point back sufficiently.=A0 Things come to mind such as=20 layering > > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace ove= r=20 the > > thumb press. > > It sounds like you're wanting to raise the=A0 hieght of the trigger lever,= is=20 that > right?=A0 Doesn't this horn have a string trigger linkage?=A0 If so, then=20= it is > adjustable already.=A0 Loosen the screw that holds the string to the stop=20= arm=20 on > the > valve.=A0 Move the trigger to the desired height (the string will slide=20 around the > screw if the correct screw is loosened) and then tighten the screw back up= =20 when > you have the trigger where you want it.=A0 Try it, it's not difficult at=20 all.=A0 If > this horn doesn't have string linkage, then I'm mistaken.=A0 A good repair > technician should be able to bend it for you if necessary. > > Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 14:52:30 -0500 From: Bruce Guttman Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help Message text written by INTERNET:rkeilitz@ATT.NET >I'm not aware of a 4B having a string linkage, but I could be wrong< I have a 4B and a 7B and used to have a 5B, all with string linkages. All were vintage 1970-1980. My guess is that you are trying to hold the 4B like you would a Conn 88H. The bell brace should ride on the webbing between your finger and thumb. I usually put my index finger on the mouthpiece, middle finger through the ring, and the ring and pinkie fingers on the aft side of the slide brace. This allows your thumb to be higher on the actuating lever. This only applies if your King has a smooth curve to the attachment tubing near the valve. If the tubing has two bends to allow the bell brace to go by, you have a newer King that is held like all the other attachment trombones like Conn, Bach, Holton, etc. I know that King had experimented with mechanical linkages at different times. Most of the ones I have seen are later than mine. Hope this helps Bruce Guttman Section Leader, Merrimack Vally Philharmonic Orchestra Solo Trombone, Hollis Town Band ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:03:51 -0600 From: Eric Edwards Subject: FW: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help Hi All, I've restrung literally hundreds of trombones and horns and I have to say in my opinion they are all the same. The only difficult ones are the old Reynolds horns that have an extremely small string hole, also some old Getzen and Reynolds horns had the levers directly under the leadpipes, made it hard to get to. Anyway, there's nothing really different in stringing a King or a Conn. Plus the linkages don't wear out and get noisy! Thanks Eric -----Original Message----- From: Trombones and related issues forum. [mailto:TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU]On Behalf Of Thomas B. Cox Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 12:19 PM To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: Re: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help Y'all, I've seen some different King horns of various vintages. The older (pre 70's or so) ones all have mechanical linkages. I actually think that the design of those mechanical ones is pretty good except for those with smaller hands like Bob. For me, it works just fine. The 70's-vintage ones have a string linkage that pulls diagonally like the mechanical one did. These have all metal parts (except the string of course). The 80's and newer ones have the same basic string linkage except with a plastic arm. In my opinion, they ruined a fine linkage when they added the string. It made it much more complicated, less efficient, and really difficult (compared to the Conn-style string linkage) to re-string. Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary. -Thomas B. Cox University of Alabama/ Carrollton, GA (home) Eric, I'm not aware of a 4B having a string linkage, but I could be wrong. This one is a mechanical linkage. The trigger is thumb piece and the arm that reaches across the bell side of the rotor is all one piece. It then attaches to a small white plastic piece, which is pretty small already. If this white piece were smaller, that in effect would solve the problem. I have the horn in the shop currently for another issue, but when I pick it up, I'll ask them if they know of anything that can be done. Bob > rkeilitz@ATT.NET wrote: > > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. ... The problem I have is > > with > > the F-attachment trigger. > > > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem would > > be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point with the > trigger > > to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly help. I envision that > this > > could be done by either bending the trigger itself (which I really don’t want > > to do), or by placing something on the thumb press which would in effect move > > the contact point back sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering > > tape, or using the black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over the > > thumb press. > > It sounds like you're wanting to raise the hieght of the trigger lever, is that > right? Doesn't this horn have a string trigger linkage? If so, then it is > adjustable already. Loosen the screw that holds the string to the stop arm on > the > valve. Move the trigger to the desired height (the string will slide around the > screw if the correct screw is loosened) and then tighten the screw back up when > you have the trigger where you want it. Try it, it's not difficult at all. If > this horn doesn't have string linkage, then I'm mistaken. A good repair > technician should be able to bend it for you if necessary. > > Eric Swanson ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 16:01:29 -0500 From: Mike Loewen Subject: Re: FW: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help On Thu, 6 Mar 2003, Eric Edwards wrote: > Anyway, there's nothing really different in stringing a King or a Conn. > Plus the linkages don't wear out and get noisy! I have a 1975 King 4B-F with the original string - it's quiet! More so than my Bach 50B3's original valves. Mike Loewen mloewen@cpumagic.scol.pa.us The Dixie Lion Jazz Band http://ripsaw.cac.psu.edu/dixie.html ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 13:33:14 -0800 From: sloane@BATNET.COM Subject: Re: King 4B F-trigger help Bob et al, IMO, this IS a design flaw in the 4B, and it's the reason why I won't buy another one. (The last one I had was a straight tenor.) The 3B and 5B, curiously, don't use the same linkage as the 4B and consequently don't have this problem. If you really, really, really love it, I suggest you have the linkage replaced with a more traditional paddle. The more expensive alternative is to replace the valve and F-attachment tubing, either with some- thing amazing (Shires, Greenhoe, Kanstul valve, etc.) or with something pedestrian but reliable, like the assembly from an 88H, Bach 42, etc., that somebody else has upgraded to the above or a Thayer conversion. Otherwise, sell it to a deserving student with the right shaped thumb and get an 88H or a Getzen. My $0.02, obviously. Gary > > Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 04:20:53 +0000 > From: rkeilitz@ATT.NET > Subject: King 4B F-trigger help > > This is primarily for those who have had experience with the King > trombones with F-attachments. I don't know if the 3B has this design > flaw or not. My experience has been with the 4B and 5B. I'll try to > explain the problem I'm having in a way that is understandable. > > I recently purchased a 4B, which was reconditioned. A very nice job was > done on this horn by Taylor Music (www.1800bandusa.com). The problem I > have is with the F-attachment trigger. I have smallish hands, which > makes for a difficult time working the F-attachment trigger effectively. > I find that if I hold the horn so that it is correctly supported with > my left hand, working the F- trigger causes my thumb to press against > the bell support between the knuckle and the thumb joint. This is > fairly uncomfortable. The problem lies in that King places the pivot > for the trigger behind the bell support, forcing the player to bring the > thumb around the bell support to work the trigger. When I come to a > section of music that calls for use of the trigger, especially a part > with a lot of trigger work, then I actually have to reposition my hand a > bit in order to allow for this. Then, the horn is not supported as well > as IÕd like. As I stated earlier, those with experience with King > trombones of this nature will know EXACTLY what I'm talking about. > > It seems that if I were able to do one of two things, that the problem > would be alleviated. First, if I could move the thumb contact point > with the trigger to a position of 11:00 or 10:00, this would greatly > help. I envision that this could be done by either bending the trigger > itself (which I really donÕt want to do), or by placing something on the > thumb press which would in effect move the contact point back > sufficiently. Things come to mind such as layering tape, or using the > black foam that came with an Edwards Bullet Brace over the thumb press. > By the way, a Bullet Brace wonÕt work on this horn, for this purpose. > IÕve even thought about drilling a hole in the thumb press, which would > allow a bolt to through it. I would then take a round headed bolt, run > a nut or two all the way up to the bolt head, then run the bolt through > the hole in the thumb press, and then affix a nut on the opposite side. > The bolt head is then what I would be pressing upon. However, the bolt > would have to be fairly large in diameter in order to not cause pain in > the thumb for pressing upon it a great deal. > > The other possible solution would be to place something upon the bell > support brace that would effectively move the pivot point of my thumb > rearward a bit, enough to be able to allow my thumb to approach the > thumb press from a bit more of an angle than is currently available. > > I guess the real problem lies in the fact that the bell brace doesnÕt > sit nicely in the crook of my hand between my thumb and forefinger, like > I believe King designers had envisioned. There is a slight contact > between crook and brace, but I donÕt actually ÒrestÓ the horn in this > crook. At least not like I do my Benge 190C which has the Bullet Brace > on it. > > If any of you have ever dealt with this scenario, I would certainly be > glad to know how you did so. I really donÕt want to send the horn back > because of this. I love the way it plays, and it offers me exactly what > IÕve been looking for in a horn in terms of slide action, slotting, > response, and weight. > > IÕm posting this on both the ÒLÓ and in the OTJ forum. So, if you reply > to this on one source, please donÕt feel obligated to reply to it in the > other, unless you would like your reply available in both forums. > > Bob > > ------------------------------ ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 15:48:12 -0600 From: "Isaac J. Roorda" Subject: Re: FW: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help I agree. Being used to the string linkages on my 88H and 60H, one of the first things I noticed when I played my section leader's Bach 36B was that the linkage, which is somewhat worn, is kinda loud. Then again, if you're lax about horn maintenance, the mechanical linkages last longer before they get too sloppy to use. I've played a friend's King with a mechanical linkage and, although I was able to use the trigger fine once I got used to it, I didn't like the setup as well as my Conn and thought that it might be a problem for someone with small hands. I guess I was right. Isaac ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mike Loewen" To: Sent: Thursday, March 06, 2003 3:01 PM Subject: Re: [TBN-L] FW: [TBN-L] King 4B F-trigger help > On Thu, 6 Mar 2003, Eric Edwards wrote: > > > Anyway, there's nothing really different in stringing a King or a Conn. > > Plus the linkages don't wear out and get noisy! > > I have a 1975 King 4B-F with the original string - it's quiet! More so > than my Bach 50B3's original valves. > > > Mike Loewen mloewen@cpumagic.scol.pa.us > The Dixie Lion Jazz Band http://ripsaw.cac.psu.edu/dixie.html ------------------------ Isaac J. Roorda Pella, IA Tuba - Pella High "Marching Dutch" & Concert Band Bass Trombone - Pella High Jazz II ijroorda@softhome.net ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 17:02:25 -0600 From: "Isaac J. Roorda" Subject: Re: Remington So did Conn ever switch to a more standard taper for the first-generation 88H, or did they use the Remington taper throughout the production run? Isaac ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wayne Dyess" To: Sent: Tuesday, March 04, 2003 11:55 PM Subject: Re: [TBN-L] Was ideal gap? - now Remington > I am a longtime 88H performer, dating back to 1962! Are you sure it > isn't a Remington shank? I'm not sure there is a marking on the > mouthpiece that would identify it as such. > > When I took lessons from Donald Knaub at UT, he had me to switch from > my Remington to a 5G. I did and never looked back. The new 88H-SGX > came with a 5GR -- I have been told that it is the Bach 5G with a > Remington shank and rim. Works for me just GREAT!!! Best of both > worlds. > > Dunno why your 6-1/2 would fit... except that I don't think it > usually comes in a large shank at all. It's a small bore kind of > mouthpiece. To purchase one for a large bore instrument usually > requires a special order. Or if you have a store like ours, they > tend to stock mouthpieces expressly for the 88H. Could that be the > case? > > Just wondering. I'm not doubting your word. Just a wondering and > wandering mind. Others on the list are much more into equipment data > than me. I jess luv ta PLAY!!!! > ;-) > Best wishes, > Wayn > -- > ========================= > Dr. J. Wayne Dyess, Professor of Music > Lamar University Music Department > P. O. Box 10044 > Beaumont, Texas 77710 > 409-880-8146 > FAX: 409-880-8143 > dyessjw@hal.lamar.edu > http://www.lamar.edu ------------------------------ Date: Thu, 6 Mar 2003 23:11:36 -0500 From: Roger Carmichael Subject: Band of the Grenadier Guards I just returned from a magnificant performance of the Band of the = Grenadier Guards in Winston-Salem, NC. Their "Hands Across the Sea" = tour of America is almost over, but if you have a chance to see one of = the last performances, it is well worth the money and time. Six = trombones on the front line and three tubas in the third line. Some of = the best military band music I've ever experienced. Roger Carmichael ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 7 Mar 2003 04:21:52 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: Is there an ideal gap? In case you missed the last episode, I had soldered a piece of brass tubing to the shaft of my Bach 4 mouthpiece, in order to fill in the gap between the mouthpiece and the beginning of the lead pipe. And when I did that my tone got really pure and resonant, but the trombone didnÕt slot worth a damn. Yes, Tim, I said it again. I said that a trombone slots. If it didnÕt slot, you wouldnÕt need a slide. So I asked the list what an ideal gap might be, between the end of the shank and the beginning of the lead pipe. And I got all kinds of different answers. I guess IÕve got some inkling of humanity in me, because in typical human fashion, I chose to believe the answer that I liked best. >ÒSo, you want to know what that optimum distance is? Well, it is somewhere >in the middle between too much and too little, where the overall response >across the registers is even.Ó I started trimming metal off of the length of the brass tube which I had soldered to the end of the shank, until I got enough slotting to get back to doodle-tonguing, while still retaining a lot of the pure tone, I had gained from closing the gap. And the answer isÉwhite envelope pleaseÉthe answer is 0.050Ó. My ideal gap is 50 thousandths of an inch. Oh Tim, I discarded your response, figuring that you were either having a really bad day or that you had run out of Prozac. But IÕve decided that youÕre probably as bad at machining parts and you thought I might be. Tim, I worked my way through electrical engineering school as a prototype machinist, cranking out parts for a four foot diameter flywheel, which we spun at 30,000 RPM. Tim can go off and calculate on that. For the rest of yÕall, thatÕs high tech machiningÉvery high tech. Jeers, oops, I mean cheers, DanP _________________________________________________________________ MSN 8 helps eliminate e-mail viruses. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 5 Mar 2003 to 6 Mar 2003 (#2003-65) **************************************************************