Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 10 Jan 2003 to 11 Jan 2003 (#2003-11) Date: Sunday, January 12, 2003 12:00 AM From: Automatic digest processor Reply-To: "Trombones and related issues forum." To: Recipients of TROMBONE-L digests There are 21 messages totalling 786 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Sackbut 2. Mouth Cavity Size (3) 3. Trombone Parts in String Concertos (3) 4. Stencil horns 5. Stencil Horns: better (3) 6. Extra Bach 50 Bell? 7. Mutes in Till (2) 8. Trombone Quartet Music on eBay - Two Dixieland Arrangements 9. Colo. Springs Symph. Backruptcy 10. Colo. Springs Symph. BANKruptcy 11. Stencil Horns: better (4) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 10 Jan 2003 22:22:04 -0800 From: Elisabeth Frederick Subject: Sackbut Hello List, I decided to join my schools early music ensemble and I found out that the school owns a sackbut. The sackbut that the school has does not have the mouthpiece that came with the instrument. So, what would be appropriate for me to use for now and where can the instructor would buy one that is 'authentic' ?? Thanks!! Elisabeth ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 07:49:18 -0000 From: Adrian Drover Subject: Re: Mouth Cavity Size From: "Edward Solomon" > I don't know about you, Keith, but I'm affected by the size of my oral > cavity. Over the last few years I've had 3 back teeth removed. Can't say I detected any difference in my trombone tone after any of these episodes. A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 07:31:43 -0800 From: Gabriel Langfur Subject: Re: Trombone Parts in String Concertos --- BassBonist@AOL.COM wrote: > Please let me know if any of the following have any > trombone (or tuba) parts: > > Brahms, Violin Concerto Op. 77 > > Saint-Saens, Cello Concert No. 1 in A minor > > Mendelssohn, Violin Concert in E minor Op. 64 > > Definitely not Brahms or Mendelssohn; don't know about SS. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail Plus - Powerful. Affordable. Sign up now. http://mailplus.yahoo.com ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 10:43:14 -0500 From: Randy Campora Subject: Re: Trombone Parts in String Concertos Negatory on all three of those. ~Randy At 11:02 PM 1/10/2003 -0500, BassBonist@AOL.COM wrote: >Please let me know if any of the following have any trombone (or tuba) parts: > >Brahms, Violin Concerto Op. 77 > >Saint-Saens, Cello Concert No. 1 in A minor > >Mendelssohn, Violin Concert in E minor Op. 64 > > >Thanks! > >Matt ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 08:07:23 -0800 From: David Guion Subject: Re: Mouth Cavity Size Ray Avery wrote >I attended a choral workshop once where the leader in explaining how to >develop a singing "head tone" advised us to imagine our heads were empty and >to fill it with sound. You can imagine the responses he got. > As Anna Russell observed, they have resonance where their brains ought to be. -- *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* David Guion Who is General Failure? And why is he reading my hard drive? david@trombone.org *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* -- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 10:15:36 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Stencil horns Gang, I was looking around on a website http://www.saxgourmet.com and found this info on "stencil horns" which some of you might find interesting or useful. He is referring to saxes, but the stencil brands may very well carry over into the trombones as well. Eric ------------------------------------------- (From http://www.saxgourmet.com) Things aren't always what they seem! Many times an instrument stamped with one name was actually made by another manufacturer. The identity of the true maker is often impossible to trace, but here are a few of the most commonly seen "stencils" and their true identity: CONN MADE: Continental Jenkins Sears & Roebuck Selmer US Selmer New York Wurlitzer Pan American Elkhart Lefleur Perfacktone Kalashen's Kleartone Bruno Gretsch Bundy Olympian SELMER MADE: Deville Adolphe Signet Bundy KING MADE: Cleveland Gladiator H. N. White American Standard MARTIN MADE: Lyon & Healy Manhattan Wurlitzer Vega BUESCHER MADE: Elkhart Wurlitzer American Artist Artist Carl Fischer Lyon & Healy Selmer US Selmer New York Silvertone Bundy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 11:08:30 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Stencil Horns: better Sorry, the formatting got all messed up. I cleaned it up and here it is again: --------------------------------------- (From http://www.saxgourmet.com) Things aren't always what they seem! Many times an instrument stamped with one name was actually made by another manufacturer. The identity of the true maker is often impossible to trace, but here are a few of the most commonly seen "stencils" and their true identity: CONN MADE: Continental Jenkins Sears & Roebuck Selmer US Selmer New York Wurlitzer Pan American Elkhart Lefleur Perfacktone Kalashen's Kleartone Bruno Gretsch Bundy Olympian SELMER MADE: Deville Adolphe Signet Bundy KING MADE: Cleveland Gladiator H. N. White American Standard MARTIN MADE: Lyon & Healy Manhattan Wurlitzer Vega BUESCHER MADE: Elkhart Wurlitzer American Artist Artist Carl Fischer Lyon & Healy Selmer US Selmer New York Silvertone Bundy ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 10:17:20 -0700 From: David Oliver Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better Thanks for doing that Eric. This is great info for us full-time (part-time in my case) ebay trollers. I've always been curious about this. David Oliver Broomfield, Colorado USA Eric & Candice Swanson wrote: > Sorry, the formatting got all messed up. I cleaned it up and here it is > again: > > --------------------------------------- > > (From http://www.saxgourmet.com) > > Things aren't always what they seem! Many times an instrument stamped > with one name was actually made by another manufacturer. The identity of > > the true maker is often impossible to trace, but here are a few of the > most commonly seen "stencils" and their true identity: > > CONN MADE: > Continental > Jenkins > Sears & Roebuck > Selmer US > Selmer New York > Wurlitzer > Pan American > Elkhart > Lefleur > Perfacktone > Kalashen's Kleartone > Bruno > Gretsch > Bundy > Olympian > etc. ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 15:22:32 -0500 From: David Buckley Subject: Re: Mouth Cavity Size Trust Anna Russell to make the appropriate comment. "I'm not making this up, you know"! Dave. David Guion wrote: > Ray Avery wrote > > >I attended a choral workshop once where the > leader in explaining how to > >develop a singing "head tone" advised us to > imagine our heads were empty and > >to fill it with sound. You can imagine the > responses he got. > > > As Anna Russell observed, they have > resonance where their brains ought to be. > > -- > *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* > David Guion > > Who is General Failure? And why is he > reading my hard drive? > > david@trombone.org > > *^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^* > > -- ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 16:09:39 -0500 From: "Johnson, Scott (TBS)" Subject: Extra Bach 50 Bell? Hi all! A friend of mine has a Bach 50BO3 that needs another bell flare. He would prefer a Bach bell, but if you have something else comparable, that may be OK. If you have a bass bell available, please send me a note off list. Thanks! Scott Johnson Conyers, GA USA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 17:10:57 -0500 From: Steve McGovern Subject: Mutes in Till Hi. In orchestra this past week, they passed out Till Eulenspiegel (yippee). In looking at it, I found a question of mutes. About 1/2 way through (rehearsal mark 27 in the Kalmus edition) is the indication 'gedampft' (muted). Does this mean we should use straight mutes? If so, why didn't he mark 'mit Dampfer', which appears in trumpet queues early on. My guess is that 'gedampft' really just means to play a bit more subdued, but the other guys in the section went for their straight mutes. Any ideas? Steve ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 17:23:59 -0500 From: Randy Campora Subject: Re: Mutes in Till Yes, this chord is played with straight mutes. I am not good in German, but I believe it is simply the difference between with mute and muted, both meaning the same thing--straight mute. ~Randy Campora Baltimore Symphony Orchestra At 05:10 PM 1/11/2003 -0500, Steve McGovern wrote: >Hi. > > In orchestra this past week, they passed out Till Eulenspiegel >(yippee). In looking at it, I found a question of mutes. About 1/2 way >through (rehearsal mark 27 in the Kalmus edition) is the indication >'gedampft' (muted). Does this mean we should use straight mutes? If >so, why didn't he mark 'mit Dampfer', which appears in trumpet queues >early on. My guess is that 'gedampft' really just means to play a bit >more subdued, but the other guys in the section went for their straight >mutes. Any ideas? > >Steve ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 15:48:34 -0700 From: Dave Tall Subject: Re: Trombone Parts in String Concertos At 11:02 PM 1/10/2003 -0500, BassBonist@AOL.COM wrote: >Please let me know if any of the following have any trombone (or tuba) parts: > >Brahms, Violin Concerto Op. 77 > >Saint-Saens, Cello Concert No. 1 in A minor > >Mendelssohn, Violin Concert in E minor Op. 64 None for these. A standard reference on instrumentation in orchestra works is the David Daniels book. Your orchestra librarian likely has a copy; a local music library likely has a copy as well. Daniels, David. Orchestral music : a handbook. - 3rd ed. Lanham, Md. : Scarecrow Press, 1996. - 611p. For other editions see other entries. ISBN: 0810832283 Dave ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 17:07:41 -0600 From: Fred Hudson Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better One little nit to pick re "King Made" ----- Original Message ----- From: "Eric & Candice Swanson" > (From http://www.saxgourmet.com) > > Things aren't always what they seem! Many times an instrument stamped > with one name was actually made by another manufacturer. The identity of > the true maker is often impossible to trace, but here are a few of the > most commonly seen "stencils" and their true identity: > > > KING MADE: > Cleveland > Gladiator > H. N. White > American Standard The Manufacturer was H. N. White Co. which produced the "King" as the top of the line, the "American Standard" as an entry level instrument (my first trombone BTW) and the "Cleveland" as an advanced student or profesional level instrument. All were engraved on the bell as made by the H. N. White Co., Cleveland Ohio. Actually the Cleveland line was integrated into White after acquisition of the Cleveland Musical Instrument Co. sometime in the twenties. I never saw a Gladiator but it quite possibly was a true stencil horn marketed through a mail order house or some other such outlet. H. N. White died in 1940 and his widow ran the company until 1965. The company was then sold and the name became King Musical Instruments in 1966 A lot of this information is available on the UMI web site which I notice is now the C. G. Conn Website! Fred H ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 18:47:26 -0600 From: Brad Howland Subject: Trombone Quartet Music on eBay - Two Dixieland Arrangements Get Your audience snapping their fingers (or tapping their toes), with these traditional jazz arrangements! Muskrat Ramble: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=157&item=2500337117&rd=1 Just a Closer Walk With Thee: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ViewItem&category=157&item=2500337131&rd=1 Arranged by composer, music educator, and trombonist Rodney Miller (ASCAP). You may have to cut (Ctrl-C) and paste (Ctrl-V) the above locations into the address bar of your browser. Regards, Brad Howland ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 19:25:20 -0700 From: David Oliver Subject: Colo. Springs Symph. Backruptcy I had been reading about this in the paper starting on Wednesday and it looks to have actually happened. Just thought I'd pass on the story. I know a couple of the trombone players. http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/music/article/0,1299,DRMN_54_1666458,00.html David Oliver Broomfield, Colorado USA ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 19:27:41 -0700 From: David Oliver Subject: Re: Colo. Springs Symph. BANKruptcy Oops, but I think you all know what I meant. David David Oliver wrote: > I had been reading about this in the paper starting on Wednesday and it > looks to have actually happened. Just thought I'd pass on the story. I > know a couple of the trombone players. > > http://www.rockymountainnews.com/drmn/music/article/0,1299,DRMN_54_1666458,00.html > > David Oliver > Broomfield, Colorado USA ------------------------------ Date: Sun, 12 Jan 2003 03:52:33 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better I think whatÕs more important than who made what is are any of the stencil horns great? DanP > >CONN MADE: >Continental >Jenkins >Sears & Roebuck >Selmer US >Selmer New York >Wurlitzer >Pan American >Elkhart >Lefleur >Perfacktone >Kalashen's Kleartone >Bruno >Gretsch >Bundy >Olympian > >SELMER MADE: >Deville >Adolphe >Signet >Bundy > >KING MADE: >Cleveland >Gladiator >H. N. White >American Standard > >MARTIN MADE: >Lyon & Healy >Manhattan >Wurlitzer >Vega > >BUESCHER MADE: >Elkhart >Wurlitzer >American Artist >Artist >Carl Fischer >Lyon & Healy >Selmer US >Selmer New York >Silvertone >Bundy _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8 is here: Try it free* for 2 months http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 22:39:06 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better Daniel Pliskin wrote: > I think what’s more important than who made what is are any of the stencil > horns great? > Dan, In most of the cases, they tend to be student line horns. Except for the Kings of course! Eric ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 20:50:57 -0800 From: emrose79@PACBELL.NET Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better You mentioned Elkhart by Conn...Listers have mentioned Elkhart Conn (or Conn Elkhart), seemingly as something special (unless I was reading it wrong). Are those one and the same? Eric & Candice Swanson wrote: > > Daniel Pliskin wrote: > > > I think what’s more important than who made what is are any of the stencil > > horns great? > > > > Dan, > > In most of the cases, they tend to be student line horns. Except for the > Kings of course! > > Eric ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 11 Jan 2003 23:24:33 -0600 From: Eric & Candice Swanson Subject: Re: Stencil Horns: better emrose79@PACBELL.NET wrote: > You mentioned Elkhart by Conn...Listers have mentioned Elkhart Conn (or > Conn Elkhart), seemingly as something special (unless I was reading it > wrong). Are those one and the same? > No. There were some "Elkhart" brand horns made by Conn. I remember seeing one that actually had an Elk engraved on the bell I think. Not to be confused with "Conn" brand horns which were made in Elkhart, Indiana. Eric ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 10 Jan 2003 to 11 Jan 2003 (#2003-11) ****************************************************************