Subject: TROMBONE-L Digest - 28 Nov 2002 to 29 Nov 2002 (#2002-139) There are 17 messages totalling 652 lines in this issue. Topics of the day: 1. Funny Italian Mouthpieces (5) 2. (no subject) 3. Need suggestion for music 4. Italian Mouthpieces, etc. (3) 5. bill watrous at fort zumwalt high school st louis metro area 6. Calgary Philharmonic Demise - Sad 7. More Machanguana Mouthpiece Manipulations 8. laquer stripping (2) 9. New Tenor Tbn Duet 10. Trombone Quartet needed ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 10:28:53 -0000 From: Adrian Drover Subject: Re: Funny Italian Mouthpieces From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" > I have a Bb tenor horn (not an Eb alto/tenor horn) Ah, you mean a baritone. Oh no, that means something completely different on your side of the pond. OK then, Bb tenor horn seems logical. A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 12:36:36 -0000 From: Keith Marr Subject: Re: Funny Italian Mouthpieces Not often I agree with American terminology (simply wouldn't do old chap, wizard prang, toodle pip don't you know!), but Alto in Eb and Tenor in Bb for the saxhorns makes perfect sense and explains their role in the brass band far better. The idea of Tenor in Eb and Baritone in Bb must be to do with their place in their particular family of instruments. And we all know how awkward families can be, especially at this time of year. So what does a baritone mean in US? Keith in Bb/F/D www.allthingsmusic.co.uk/entertainers/keith.htm ----- Original Message ----- From: Adrian Drover > From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" > > > I have a Bb tenor horn (not an Eb alto/tenor horn) > > Ah, you mean a baritone. Oh no, that means something completely different > on your side of the pond. OK then, Bb tenor horn seems logical. > > A ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 13:02:48 -0000 From: Adrian Drover Subject: Re: Funny Italian Mouthpieces ----- Original Message ----- From: "Keith Marr" To: Sent: Friday, November 29, 2002 12:36 PM Subject: Re: [TBN-L] Funny Italian Mouthpieces > So what does a baritone mean in US? Either Frank Sinatra, or a euphonium. Take ya pick. A. Adrian Drover ADIOS, Scotland www.adios.co.uk Personal email: adrian@adios.co.uk ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 08:58:28 EST From: Stephen Colley Subject: (no subject) Hey Folks! Jazz, legit, pro or amateur - there are certain fundamental skills required by all. Fine intonation is one of the most difficult. The TuneUp System is great way to build your skills on your own time. But it's very unlikely someone will give you a TuneUp for Christmas (except maybe anonymously!) So, buy yourself a present that will benefit you and your group for the rest of your life. Ask around; TuneUp works! Save a whoppin' 30% off retail until December 15th. Visit www.tuneupsystems.com. Merry Christmas! Stephen Colley www.tuneupsystems.com 804-852-8219 ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 09:34:19 -0500 From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" Subject: Re: Funny Italian Mouthpieces On Fri, 29 Nov 2002, Adrian Drover wrote: > Ah, you mean a baritone. Oh no, that means something completely different > on your side of the pond. OK then, Bb tenor horn seems logical. No, I mean an American Bb tenor horn. The instrument was made by Henry Distin and is small bore, small bell, and is more cylindrical than a baritone. If you look at 19th century American brass band music you'll find Bb tenor horn parts *as well* as Bb baritone parts. Carole Nowicke cnowicke@indiana.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 10:34:13 -0500 From: Walter Barrett Subject: Re: Need suggestion for music Thus spake, not Zarathustra, but Chuck De Paolo >> Last night my concert band director asked if I could work on finding >> something that our trombone section could play for a concert next season >> that would have 3 or 4 trombone parts and concert band accompaniment. I >> would really appreciate any suggestions anyone could give me. > > There are two trio works of which I am familiar. One is the Hartley > Concerto for Three Trombones and Band which I publish (Ensemble > Publications). It's a tonal work in three movements written in 1968 or so > for a good high school or college ensemble. The other is a piece by Arthur > Pryor called Razzazzamazza. It's a very Pryor-esque chart for one, two or > three trombones with a classic "oom-pah" style band accompaniment. The solo > parts are not too difficulIt - nothing like Bluebells. The bass part (solo > part 3) is quite easy. I can't think of anything for quartet & band > offhand. > > In Music, > ---Charles De Paolo > > General Manager & Webmaster, > Hickeys Music Center (http://www.hickeys.com) > Owner, > Ensemble Publications (http://members.aol.com/enspub) Another one to add to the list is Norman Leyden's "Concerto for 3 Trombones and Band", which I think is out of print, but you might be able to borrow a copy from somewhere. The first movement features the 1st trb, picture a mix of Copland and Alec Wilder. The second mvt. is for 1st & 2nd, kind of a Jay & Kai ballad, and the 3rd mvt. is for all 3 bones, a 6/8 Hindemith-meets-Ben Hur thing. I played it about 7-8 times a few summers ago with 3 different bands, it's a real crowd-pleaser. I'm told (since I'm not old enough to remember myself!) that Norman Leyden was the Music Director for the $64,000 Questio TV show. Walter Barrett "Can placebos cause side effects? If so, are the side effects real?" -George Carlin Yamaha Artist/Clinician Tenor, Alto, Bass Trombones Euphonium Bass Trumpet Tuba ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 12:47:28 -0500 From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" Subject: Re: Funny Italian Mouthpieces On Fri, 29 Nov 2002, Keith Marr wrote: > So what does a baritone mean in US? My interpretation is "School horn with three valves" although I'm not sure whether the fine old Henry Charles Smith model Connstellation was called a euphonium or baritone in advertising. I thought this Distin was a sort of longish Eb until I sat it next to my Besson Eb, and realized what it was. I couldn't find my calipers that day, but comparing 2nd tuning slide bores proved it only a tiny bit larger than the Besson. The idea of calling a wee Eb horn a "tenor" does strike me as peculiar. It's so not-a-tenor voice. I spent last weekend playing screech Eb. Not enough high brass showed up at the Redeeming Brass weekend and I never got off the thing. When I said I could play Eb, I meant like 3rd peckhorn ...on marches...not up THERE. Carole Nowicke cnowicke@indiana.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 19:14:59 +0000 From: "J.c. Sherman" Subject: Italian Mouthpieces, etc. First - for the Eb "Verdi" instrument, I might try to track down a Miraphone "Self" tenor tuba mouthpiece. Wide rim, shallow cup, tenor trombone shank. Alternatives would probably all involve a lathe - Yamaha Bobo tenor tuba mouthpiece, or any large bass or contrabass trombone mouthpiece. You'll need air to play that thing, I would guess... Second - for tiny tenor valve trombones, I've always had good luck with my old Holton "Pryor" model mouthpiece. Its very narrow, (15c or smaller) but (more importantly) nearly funnel-shaped. I also use this on my "bass-horn" as well, but it works great on those stuffy, dead-with-a-12c valve bones. Works okay on small altos too :-) Third - Nomenclature for Saxhorns is an unresolvable issue. For Civil War American saxhorns (usually OTS), Bb cornet pitched instruments are altos, Eb's are tenors (low note A is certainly a low note for the tenor voice), Bb's are baritones and basses (depending on size) and Eb tuba pitch is Contrabass. High Eb's are the sopranos. I think that lines up pretty well with Sax's patent. I like the answer of "student euphonium with 3 valves" for American "baritone" terminology. We use "British baritone" for the Besson sized baritones. I am pretty sure there is no agreement to be found between countries - or musicians for that matter - over the terminology of the conical brass. I've long since given up the fight, thought I will forever refer to "British baritones" as conical, and I don't care who disagrees. If they're cylindrical - what the heck is a valve trombone? Have a good holiday season! J.c. Sherman ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 19:36:52 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: Re: Italian Mouthpieces, etc. I’ve started playing alto horn, when my shoulder was really bothering me and I wanted to minimize my trombone playing, without losing my embouchure. It came with an alto horn mouthpiece, which was scarcely larger than a trumpet moughpiece. With that mouthpiece, it made a sound, which was really piercing and nasal. I’ve started playing alto horn, when my shoulder was really bothering me and I wanted to minimize my trombone playing, without losing my embouchure. It came with an alto horn mouthpiece, which was scarcely larger than a trumpet mouthpiece. With that mouthpiece, it made a sound, which was really piercing and nasal. I tried the thing with a 12C, I had kicking around and eventually bought a used mouthpiece which was considerably smaller. It was relatively easy to turn down the outside of the shank, so that a tenor trombone mouthpiece would fit into the alto receiver. But what I found was that playing a small mouthpiece was worse for my embouchure than not playing anything at all. Also, I liked the sound of the alto, when I played it with a fairly large trombone mouthpiece. So I removed the mouthpiece receiver and made a replacement, which would accept a standard tenor trombone mouthpiece. And now I have a very mellow, warm-sounding alto horn. DanP _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 14:23:49 -0600 From: "D.J. Kennedy" Subject: bill watrous at fort zumwalt high school st louis metro area WRWatrous@aol.com wrote: > D.J. , you old devil !!! Great to see you at that gig !! Thanks for the > great sketches ... My wife is going to frame them both ... She thinks your`e > talented ....So do I ....That was a helluva lot of playin I had to do on that > gig.... Got paid well for it , too !! The challenge is , to have the same > chops at the end as in the beginning .... That band can use a strong lead > trumpet player... they don`t have one,as you heard...Saxes and bones were > good ....A couple of pretty good bone players , didn`t you think ? Did you > notice the rhythm section have trouble ending "No greater love" ? Ifelt bad > for them , as I even wrote it all down for them so that wouldn`t happen !!! > Oh well .... shit happens , doesn`t it ?? Well , so much for that stuff ... > Hope you had a great Thanksgiving , Bruce too !!! Take care , and we`ll talk > soon !!! Bill Watrous ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:11:30 +0200 From: H du Plooy Subject: Re: Calgary Philharmonic Demise - Sad A good place to start might be PDQ Bach's Orchestra vs. Conductor with Beethoven's 5th idea. Any ideas how to implement this? No, seriously, I've thought about this a lot. Of all the concerts that I've played in, from professional orchestras right through to amateur ensembels, the best audiences were always the ones that were free to do more than sit up straight and keep their mouths shut. A few examples: National Chamber Orchestra did a lot of concerts for a local university with which we had good ties. In this perticular town, symphony concerts were often canceled simply because no one or too few people pitched up. However, once a year we did a Christmas carols concert, where the audience could sing along. This normally drew upwards of 3000 people. We also often played at a dancehall. Tickets cost at least four times what our symphony concert tickets cost, but it was always jam packed. Recently I've been playing with a local Blues band. One of the shows was in a small theatre-cafe, where the audience can order their wine and dinner and enjoy it while the music's going. It's still very much a band on the stage setup (as opposed to a band in the corner making background music). There was nothing background about this - we played to be heard. The tickets were really expensive, but the place was packed. Local Symphonic Wind Orchestra. Shows in concert hall are always poorly attended - half a hall if we're lucky. This program always consists of a balanced mix of "music from the movies" arrangements, music specifically written for windband, like Host's Suites and Vaughn Williams' Folk Song Suite and similar works, to very good arrangements of large orchestral works (Movements from Shos #5 and Jupiter from Plantes, amongst other). If we get a jazz soloist to play the second half with bigband style backing, we get a handfull more. Our regular jazzer player all the saxes, flute and clarinet, and all very well with very enjoyable riffs and improvs. Songs like Air Mail, I'm Confessin', St. Thomas, ect. Now, with the very same program, we did an outdoors "Beerfest" concert. Bring your picknick basket and a blanket, buy your booze here. The audience was twice the size. Why? Because the audience are at their most comfortable - they can be flat on their back, stand around with a drink in the hand or do whatever suits them. Even talking on a cell phone wouldn't seem so inappropriate under these circumstances (not that I'm advocating it or even approving, it's just not as annoying). So why not begin by doing a concert in a hall where the orchestra is on the same floor as the audience (this makes a huge difference!), some open floor to dance on (yes, let them dance to Pines of Rome if they feel like it, why not? I do it at home...), and tables to sit around and enjoy dinner and wine while they listen to the concert. The orchestra won't be too loud for the people to hear each other, so this could really work. If National Chamber Orchestra (S.A) had done more of these concerts, we would still have been in business... Hans du Plooy P.S. I would pay good money to attend PDQ Bach's Conductor vs. Orchestra show-off. Just think of the possibilities... Andrew Michael wrote: > How often do they cry? > People need help in releasing these emotions and, to be blunt, I > don't think we're doing it for most people. But, sports are doing it > and so they get more attention and money. We need to figure out how > to fill these basic emotional needs and to be honest I don't really > have a suggestion as to how to do this. The only one I can think of > would be to let the audience cheer for great solos during classical > pieces. == Download ringtones, logos and picture messages at Ananzi Mobile Fun. http://www.ananzi.co.za/cgi-bin/goto.pl?mobile ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 20:28:00 +0000 From: Daniel Pliskin Subject: More Machanguana Mouthpiece Manipulations Fellow mouthpiece fiddlers and other malcontents, I just tried an experiment, which just might have worked. I cut a piece of drafting acetate, which was just slightly larger than the backbore of one of my mouthpieces. Then I held one end in a small vise and the other with a hemostat and gave the acetate a twist of about 360 degrees. I got that twist to stay, by heating the acetate slightly with a heat gun (hair drier). When inserted in the backbore, it seems to slightly decrease the amount of “overblown” sound I get and also tends to stabilize my high range. It does not extend the high range, though, as I had hoped, in my wildest of dreams. Why on earth would someone do such a thing, anyway? I was looking to cause the air to spiral, as it went through the backbore and lead pipe. And why was I interested in doing that? God only knows, ask Him/Her. DanP _________________________________________________________________ The new MSN 8: advanced junk mail protection and 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 20:55:59 -0600 From: Barry Green Subject: laquer stripping Hey out there in trombone land. I find myself needing to strip laquer off a bell and wondered if there were any suggestions. Many thanks, Barry Green Nashville ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:17:50 EST From: AIREV@AOL.COM Subject: New Tenor Tbn Duet Greetings and Happy Thanksgiving Everybody, We are pleased to announce the release of the sheet music for Norman Bolter's "The Archer," for two tenor trombones. For more information about this piece, including ordering, please visit: http://www.air-ev.com/catalogue.html Click Sheet Music in the side bar. This work is listed alphabetically under Trombone Duets. Also, to hear an MP3 sound sample of the premiere recording of this work (played by Norman and Jim Nova and appearing on Norman's new CD, "Occurrences"), please visit: http://www.air-ev.com/recordings.html Scroll down to the "Occurrences" CD, listed alphabetically on that page. Also, a recent thread on the list addressed composers' personal notes about what they envisioned for any given work. Sheet music for all of Norman's compositions include an introduction by Norman with the story line of what inspired each work and what each part of the composition is about, along with technical notes about playing each piece. Enjoy and all the best! Carol ************************************************** Carol Viera, Ph.D. Owner, Air-ev Productions (R) Co-Director, Frequency Band (R) Endeavour E-mail: airev@aol.com/ Website: http://www.air-ev.com/ ************************************************** ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 22:44:24 -0500 From: "Dr. Carole Nowicke, Applied Health Science" Subject: Re: Italian Mouthpieces, etc. On Fri, 29 Nov 2002, Daniel Pliskin wrote: > So I removed the mouthpiece receiver and made a replacement, which would > accept a standard tenor trombone mouthpiece. And now I have a very mellow, > warm-sounding alto horn. I suppose that's better than horn players playing 'em with horn mouthpieces. That's too small. I have some sort of a saxhorn mouthpiece (deep funnel) which Bob Pallansch gave me. I'd sent him a mouthpiece from Henry Meredith to copy, and he dug this out of his junk box as it was quite similar. Bob Rusk had the thing plated for me. Works a fair treat. Carole Nowicke cnowicke@indiana.edu ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 23:41:44 EST From: ALFORDMB@AOL.COM Subject: Re: laquer stripping original message: I find myself needing to strip laquer off a bell and wondered if there were any suggestions. Many thanks, ========================= On lacquer, I have had good success with Strip-Eze, available at most hardware or home improvement stores. Paint it on and let it sit for several minutes. It will soften and pucker up and can be rubbed or washed off with reasonale ease. (-or should I say "eze"?-) Clean the instrument well with lots of water afterward though. It is probably corrosive. If the "lacquer" is actually epoxy, as many newer instruments are coated with, it requires more than I have undertaken, and I have no advice. good luck, Mike Alford ------------------------------ Date: Fri, 29 Nov 2002 21:10:49 -0800 From: Larry White Subject: Re: Trombone Quartet needed The Salvation Army has a whole series of Quartet music You can pick one up at theh Salvation Army Supplies and Purchasing in Newark New York.(If you are in the US. Otherwise there should be a Supplies and Purchasing at other locations e.g. London England, Toronto, Canada etc. L White John Boblett wrote: > There are several pieces out there for Brass Band that may have standard > wind band scores, or maybe someone could arrange for you. One that comes to > mind is "The Irish Washer Woman", not a piece on the more serious side but > fun to play and has audience appeal. > Another piece that is more serious is "My Shepherd" done by Brenton > Broadstock in 1988. It appears that it is copyrighted by The Salvation > Army. You can hear a recording of this on a CD entitled "Blazing Brass" by > the New York Staff Band (TRCD 1067). > Hope this helps a little. > > John Boblett > Springfield, OH > > -----Original Message----- > From: Trombones and related issues forum. > [mailto:TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU]On Behalf Of Jerry Blomberg > Sent: Tuesday, November 26, 2002 1:22 AM > To: TROMBONE-L@PO.MISSOURI.EDU > Subject: [TBN-L] Trombone Quartet needed > > Hi, Listers, > > I'm looking for a trombone quartet number with concert band accompaniment > that wouldn't be too difficult. It will be programmed on a concert in the > park next summer. It should be something on the more serious side . . . > Does anyone have any suggestions? > > Jerry Blomberg > Temple City, CA > > <>< ------------------------------ End of TROMBONE-L Digest - 28 Nov 2002 to 29 Nov 2002 (#2002-139) *****************************************************************