TROMBONE-L Digest 2279 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Quartets with Alto Trombone by Nancy Vogt 2) Report: Learning music may prevent dementia by "Tom C. Shaddox" 3) Re: A new Mozart by "Tom C. Shaddox" 4) Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone by Greg Bergantz 5) Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 6) RE: Quartets with alto by TboneGib@aol.com 7) RE: Quartets with Alto by TboneGib@aol.com 8) Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone by glendening@denison.edu 9) Trombone Choir Arrangements by "Jon Botbyl" 10) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by Robert Holland 11) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by Wayne Winner 12) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by "Daniel Pliskin" 13) RE: New Thread--A new Mozart by "Gary Greenhoe" 14) Re: Help with contacting Denis Wick for a student by Larry White 15) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by Bodie Pfost 16) Continuo Was: New Thread--A new Mozart by Howard Weiner 17) Re: A new Mozart by sabutin 18) RE: Report: Learning music may prevent dementia by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 19) New Bach bass trb. items for sale by Joestanko@aol.com 20) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 21) Re: Report: Learning music may prevent dementia by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 22) RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone by "Thomas Smee" 23) RE: New Thread--A new Mozart by "Daniel Pliskin" 24) RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone by Craig Parmerlee 25) Re: New Thread--A new Mozart by "Daniel Pliskin" 26) RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone by Gabriel Langfur 27) Help with unknown composer by Stephen Troy 28) Re: Help with unknown composer by "keith.marr" 29) RE: Cage's "Solo for Sliding trombone" by =?iso-8859-1?Q?Hugo_Garc=EDa_Sampedro?= 30) RE: Help with unknown composer by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 31) Jim Prindle--Please send me a note by "Paul D. Kemp, Jr." ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 15:29:14 -0600 From: Nancy Vogt To: trombone-l@po.missouri.EDU Subject: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Dear Listers, I'm looking for quartets for my undergraduate students, using alto, two tenors and bass trombone. They'd like something reasonably challenging but not outrageous. Any ideas? Thanks, Nancy Vogt University of Northern Iowa ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 16:24:36 -0600 From: "Tom C. Shaddox" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Report: Learning music may prevent dementia Message-ID: <3C4F3824.53FE8598@fnc.fujitsu.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Counterintuitive? You tell me: http://abcnews.go.com/sections/scitech/DyeHard/dyehard.html Tom Shaddox, 9th chair tenor ljshaddo@gte.net ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 17:23:01 -0600 From: "Tom C. Shaddox" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: A new Mozart Message-ID: <3C4F45D5.FF4E49C4@fnc.fujitsu.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The always intriguing Sabutin wrote in part: >One theory...of how the human brain works...is that much >of it actually works as a FILTER, eliminating useless (read: >non-survival oriented) information and allowing the "important" stuff >to come through. 1. The right amount of filtering would seem to lie somewhere between David Helfgott and Kenny G. 2. One way of engaging the audience during our musical performances is to call their survival into question. I seem to be plateaued at "annoy"; somehow I need to push on through to "threaten". Hmmm - lessons with Paulo Esperanza? I gotta go practice, Tom Shaddox, 9th chair tenor "I might not be Bach, but at least I'm not Offenbach." Rossini ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 16:15:41 -0800 From: Greg Bergantz To: Nancy.Vogt@uni.edu Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <8043DC4B-105F-11D6-B9A8-0003934F876A@linkline.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII; format=flowed Mime-Version: 1.0 (Apple Message framework v480) Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On January 23, 2002, at 01:29 PM, Nancy Vogt wrote: I'm looking for quartets for my undergraduate students, using alto, two tenors and bass trombone. They'd like something reasonably challenging but not outrageous. Any ideas? Here's a start: A listing of many popular alto trombone works, http://www.pittstate.edu/music/kehle/altotrombone.html You can download Beethoven's Three Equali, Susato's Ten Rennaisance Dances and several excerpts (and others) at the Brass World site, http://www.brassworld.co.uk/main.php?instrument=Trombone Nancy, I can't say whether or not these are at the right level for your undergraduates. Chances are, the Susato is going to be tough for most altos...unless they've already developed chops of steel! HTH, - Greg Bergantz ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 21:16:17 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com To: Nancy.Vogt@uni.edu, trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <10f.b096adf.2980c871@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Ellacombe. beldon wade ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 21:58:03 EST From: TboneGib@aol.com To: TROMBONE-L@po.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Quartets with alto Message-ID: <14d.7b77a53.2980d23b@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The Heinrich Isaac quartet works very well with alto on top. You can even discuss Musica Ficta with your students:-) Tom Gibson Brass Dept. Coordinator Georgia State University tbonegib@aol w: 404-651-1740 trombonelessons.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 22:08:43 EST From: TboneGib@aol.com To: TROMBONE-L@po.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Quartets with Alto Message-ID: <32.21364db5.2980d4bb@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit That would be the Isaac Battaglia....sorry for not being more clear. Tom Gibson Brass Dept. Coordinator Georgia State University tbonegib@aol w: 404-651-1740 trombonelessons.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 23:36:16 -0500 From: glendening@denison.edu To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <1011846976.3c4f8f408b4ba@imp.denison.edu> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Content-transfer-encoding: 8bit Nancy, Here are a few more suggestions: (No particular order) Warwick Music has a few works with alto parts, most notable is the Mozart - Magic Flute Overture. I've had undergrads do that in the past. Per Brevig had a manuscript of a Gottfried Reiche Quartet that had an alto part that was very workable. I remember playing that at the New York Brass Conference in the 1980's. Tezak has several including the Double Fugue from the Mozart Requiem. Maybe too tough. If you want a modern piece try Joseph Klein's Parallaxes (Alto, 2 tenors and Bass). It is available from Nopone Music (Search the Web.) Joe is on the Comp Faculty at North Texas. This piece has lots of theatrics and moving around (in fact you need 60 music stands.) It is work, but an event that the audience won't forget. Hope that helps. Andrew Glendening Quoting Greg Bergantz : > On January 23, 2002, at 01:29 PM, Nancy Vogt wrote: > > > I'm looking for quartets for my undergraduate students, using alto, two > > tenors and bass trombone. They'd like something reasonably > > challenging but > > not outrageous. Any ideas? > > Here's a start: > > A listing of many popular alto trombone works, > http://www.pittstate.edu/music/kehle/altotrombone.html > > You can download Beethoven's Three Equali, Susato's Ten Rennaisance > Dances and several excerpts (and others) at the Brass World site, > http://www.brassworld.co.uk/main.php?instrument=Trombone > > Nancy, I can't say whether or not these are at the right level for > your undergraduates. Chances are, the Susato is going to be tough > for most altos...unless they've already developed chops of steel! > > HTH, > > - Greg Bergantz > > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 23:40:29 -0500 From: "Jon Botbyl" To: Subject: Trombone Choir Arrangements Message-ID: <003501c1a491$407f9200$6501a8c0@wchryh01.nj.comcast.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0032_01C1A467.5724C9A0" Does anyone know if the arrangements for trombone ensemble from the Spiritual to the Bone recordings are available? There are some great charts on those recordings and I would love to be able to play them. Thanks. Jon ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 23:27:06 -0600 From: Robert Holland To: "Trb. List" Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: Mime-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I didn't read this thread from the beginning, so I'm not quite sure the source of this stuff. However, this below is really badly misinformed, and I don't want credulous readers of the list to be mislead. > For the most part, classical composers wrote music for the church/state and > there were definite rules for what was legit and what was "musica ficta," > fictitious music, music of the devil. Absolutely untrue. Musica ficta is a term that became standard in the 14th century and referred to chromatic notes outside the G hexachord. They were "not of the hand," that is, the Guidonian hand used to instruct singers. Musica recta referred to the notes that >were< "of the hand." Music of that era was all about voice leading, so vertical, harmonic thinking was quite foreign to them as a concept. Skilled musicians then knew, based on performance practice and voice leading, what notes needed alteration from the (inexact) notation of the day. Transcriptions of Gothic and Renaissance music into modern notation placed chromatic alterations above the notes, rather than before them, in observance of their necessity (arguable in many of their manifestations) but absence from the original part-books (scores also being unheard of until much later). > I've heard that Bach would write out chords with figured bass and, > basically, ad lib from there. If, instead, he were to give that same > notation to a group, to have them fake their parts, would they have strayed > into fictitious music, or was church/state music all they "heard" and > thereby all they could think of playing. This is also quite misleading. Figured bass, also known as thoroughbass, is specific to accompaniments for keyboard instruments and one bass instrument. Figured bass is, for a Baroque performer, no more incomplete than is a lead sheet for a jazz performer. All the information is there, but the specific embodiment is left somewhat flexible. It wasn't about faking, since a properly schooled and trained musician could realize continuo parts from the figured bass without guesswork. These terms are easily found in resources like the Grove Dictionary of Music and Musicians or the Harvard Dictionary of Music. Robert Holland Briar Music Press briar@chicagonet.net http://members.aol.com/EnsPub/briar.htm ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 21:48:32 -0800 (PST) From: Wayne Winner To: daniel_pliskin@hotmail.com, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: <20020124054832.25607.qmail@web14908.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, Mozart was undoubtfully a genius, but how about the ones that followed him. Franz Schubert who was 34 when he died had written just as many if not more pieces than Mozart. Gustav Mahler with his thick orchestrations. Even Richard Stauss was a prodigy composer. I think that throughout music history we have put a lot of imphasis on Mozart being the only genius, but in reallity there were a lot of geniuses, but they weren't as bold as Mozart go against the odds. Mozart in my mind stands out to be the best young composer along with Schubert. I only wish they would have lived longer to produce more of the outstanding pieces they gave to the world. Sincerely, Wayne Winner Northwestern State University --- Daniel Pliskin wrote: > >====================== > > > > Art Tatum. > > > > Charlie Parker...who by the way ALSO died at > 35. > > > > Louis Armstrong. > > > > Stan Getz. > > > > There are others... > > For the most part, classical composers wrote music > for the church/state and > there were definite rules for what was legit and > what was “musica ficta”, > fictitious music, music of the devil. > > I’ve heard that Bach would write out chords with > figured bass and, > basically, adlib from there. If, instead, he were > to give that same > notation to a group, to have them fake their parts, > would they have strayed > into fictitious music, or was church/state music all > they “heard” and > thereby all they could think of playing. > > I have the hardest time thinking of things to play > that are outside of the > box, so to speak. As such, I’d be willing to guess > that musicians, able to > adlib, night actually have had a hard time straying > from the rules, imposed > by the church. > > But for lack of other recording media, all we have > to show for that period > is the written music. All those great “garage” > string quartets, are gone > forever. In contrast, we have a wealth of great > adlib composers, whose > works are “written” on recording media. > > But also, there will never be another Mozart, not > because composers that > have followed have not heard the call, but because > the pioneer Mozart moved > us forward, defining that genre. Subsequent Mozarts > would only be accused > of plagiarism. Perhaps the only exception to that > would be music written > as soundtracks for movies. Just as mock-Stravinsky, > has been used in > soundtracks for years, now, so has mock-Mozart, I’m > sure. > > I continue to marvel at what the likes of Parker and > Armstrong “wrote”, but > it’s not Mozart. Those that long for more Mozart > are kind of out of luck. > > DanP > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Join the world’s largest e-mail service with MSN > Hotmail. > http://www.hotmail.com > __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 06:02:01 From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Robert, To put it rather indelicately, you may play a music scalar on TV but you havenât a clue. Youâre more than willing to claim to disagree with me, but then you state, as fact, exactly what Iâve just said. Moreover, ultimately, you entirely missed the point. But you sure did pretend to be oh so superior, in the process? DanP I didn't read this thread from the beginning, so I'm not quite sure the source of this stuff. However, this below is really badly misinformed, and I don't want credulous readers of the list to be mislead. > For the most part, classical composers wrote music for the church/state and > there were definite rules for what was legit and what was "musica ficta," > fictitious music, music of the devil. Absolutely untrue. Musica ficta is a term that became standard in the 14th century and referred to chromatic notes outside the G hexachord. They were "not of the hand," that is, the Guidonian hand used to instruct singers. Musica recta referred to the notes that >were< "of the hand." Music of that era was all about voice leading, so vertical, harmonic thinking was quite foreign to them as a concept. Skilled musicians then knew, based on performance practice and voice leading, what notes needed alteration from the (inexact) notation of the day. Transcriptions of Gothic and Renaissance music into modern notation placed chromatic alterations above the notes, rather than before them, in observance of their necessity (arguable in many of their manifestations) but absence from the original part-books (scores also being unheard of until much later). > I've heard that Bach would write out chords with figured bass and, > basically, ad lib from there. If, instead, he were to give that same > notation to a group, to have them fake their parts, would they have strayed > into fictitious music, or was church/state music all they "heard" and > thereby all they could think of playing. This is also quite misleading. Figured bass, also known as thoroughbass, is specific to accompaniments for keyboard instruments and one bass instrument. Figured bass is, for a Baroque performer, no more incomplete than is a lead sheet for a jazz performer. All the information is there, but the specific embodiment is left somewhat flexible. It wasn't about faking, since a properly schooled and trained musician could realize continuo parts from the figured bass without guesswork. These terms are easily found in resources like the Grove Dictionary of Music and Musicians or the Harvard Dictionary of Music. Robert Holland Briar Music Press briar@chicagonet.net http://members.aol.com/EnsPub/briar.htm _________________________________________________________________ Join the worldâs largest e-mail service with MSN Hotmail. http://www.hotmail.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 00:10:32 -0600 From: "Gary Greenhoe" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit let's not forget Frank Zappa! gary -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@po.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of Wayne Winner Sent: Wednesday, January 23, 2002 11:49 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Hi, Mozart was undoubtfully a genius, but how about the ones that followed him. Franz Schubert who was 34 when he died had written just as many if not more pieces than Mozart. Gustav Mahler with his thick orchestrations. Even Richard Stauss was a prodigy composer. I think that throughout music history we have put a lot of imphasis on Mozart being the only genius, but in reallity there were a lot of geniuses, but they weren't as bold as Mozart go against the odds. Mozart in my mind stands out to be the best young composer along with Schubert. I only wish they would have lived longer to produce more of the outstanding pieces they gave to the world. Sincerely, Wayne Winner Northwestern State University ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2002 22:52:57 -0800 From: Larry White To: bmroberts@iquest.net Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Help with contacting Denis Wick for a student Message-ID: <3C4FAF49.D5C722FA@telus.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My initial advice is to contact Boosey & Hawkes as he seems to be closely tied into them with his brass mouthpieces and brass instruments. In fact I think that he had a D W model Trom at one time. Not sure of the status of it now. Larry White Vancouver BC Canada Bart Roberts wrote: > Hello Out there, > > I need help to get in touch with Denis Wick. I realize there has been > a great deal of privacy issues being discussed recently and I am > very intrigued by what all have said. > > Anyway point being.....I have a friend that is going to London to study > for the semester who would like to take Lessons with Denis if it's > available. > If anybody could help me with an email or phone that would be great. > > If you could email me privately that would be terrific. > > Thanks > > Bart Roberts > > ___________________________________________ > Bart Roberts > Band/Trombone Graduate Assistant > Ball State University Bands > http://www.bsu.edu/cfa/music/bands > Muncie, Indiana ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 00:48:50 -0800 From: Bodie Pfost To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: <3C4FCA72.E5C4BD2E@humboldt1.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I participated in a discussion about classical era composers, specifically Mozart and Haydn, with a Music Theory/Violin professor, and she thought that there is a lot of music by Mozart that really shouldn't be played/heard but that every one of Haydn's compositions are quite pleasing to play and listen to. -Bodie Wayne Winner wrote: > Hi, > Mozart was undoubtfully a genius, but how about the > ones that followed him. Franz Schubert who was 34 when > he died had written just as many if not more pieces > than Mozart. Gustav Mahler with his thick > orchestrations. Even Richard Stauss was a prodigy > composer. I think that throughout music history we > have put a lot of imphasis on Mozart being the only > genius, but in reallity there were a lot of geniuses, > but they weren't as bold as Mozart go against the > odds. Mozart in my mind stands out to be the best > young composer along with Schubert. I only wish they > would have lived longer to produce more of the > outstanding pieces they gave to the world. > > Sincerely, > Wayne Winner > Northwestern State University > > --- Daniel Pliskin wrote: > > >====================== > > > > > > Art Tatum. > > > > > > Charlie Parker...who by the way ALSO died at > > 35. > > > > > > Louis Armstrong. > > > > > > Stan Getz. > > > > > > There are others... > > > > For the most part, classical composers wrote music > > for the church/state and > > there were definite rules for what was legit and > > what was ămusica fictaä, > > fictitious music, music of the devil. > > > > Iâve heard that Bach would write out chords with > > figured bass and, > > basically, adlib from there. If, instead, he were > > to give that same > > notation to a group, to have them fake their parts, > > would they have strayed > > into fictitious music, or was church/state music all > > they ăheardä and > > thereby all they could think of playing. > > > > I have the hardest time thinking of things to play > > that are outside of the > > box, so to speak. As such, Iâd be willing to guess > > that musicians, able to > > adlib, night actually have had a hard time straying > > from the rules, imposed > > by the church. > > > > But for lack of other recording media, all we have > > to show for that period > > is the written music. All those great ăgarageä > > string quartets, are gone > > forever. In contrast, we have a wealth of great > > adlib composers, whose > > works are ăwrittenä on recording media. > > > > But also, there will never be another Mozart, not > > because composers that > > have followed have not heard the call, but because > > the pioneer Mozart moved > > us forward, defining that genre. Subsequent Mozarts > > would only be accused > > of plagiarism. Perhaps the only exception to that > > would be music written > > as soundtracks for movies. Just as mock-Stravinsky, > > has been used in > > soundtracks for years, now, so has mock-Mozart, Iâm > > sure. > > > > I continue to marvel at what the likes of Parker and > > Armstrong ăwroteä, but > > itâs not Mozart. Those that long for more Mozart > > are kind of out of luck. > > > > DanP > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Join the worldâs largest e-mail service with MSN > > Hotmail. > > http://www.hotmail.com > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! > http://auctions.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 13:19:40 +0100 From: Howard Weiner To: briar@chicagonet.net, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Continuo Was: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: <5.1.0.14.0.20020124131858.009d1910@mail.sampo.de> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 23:27 23.01.02 -0600, Robert Holland wrote among other things: This is also quite misleading. Figured bass, also known as thoroughbass, is specific to accompaniments for keyboard instruments and one bass instrument. Although I agree with most of what Robert wrote here, I do have to comment on this statement. It is a common fallacy that a thoroughbass or basso continuo accompaniment consists of keyboard instrument(s) and one bass instrument (cello, gamba, double bass, bassoon). This may be appropriate for the music of the high Baroque, i.e. Bach, Handel, etc., but not for the whole Baroque period. The music of the early Baroque -- and here's where we get to the trombone content: Schutz' "Fili mi Absalon" and "Attendite," and Cesare's "La Hieronyma" come to mind -- almost never requires an additional bass melody instrument doubling the bass line (much less at the lower octave) and the original performance material also does not make any provision for this. This sort of bass doubling is a practice that came up towards the middle of the Baroque period, long after the trombone had fallen out of use in most places. Since most Baroque music with trombones is sacred music, the appropriate and most effective continuo instrument is an organ. Harpsichord, although a Baroque instrument, does not make it! If you happen to have a chitarrone (archlute) at your disposal, by all means use it. The combination of organ and chitarrone is ideal for the music of the early Baroque. The reason for this undoubtedly has to do with acoustics: In the lively acoustics of a church (not to mention the vastness of most modern concert halls) the harpsichord's sound decays much too quickly to be heard clearly more than a few feet away. However, organ, chitarrone, trombone (= "sackbut"), cornetto, and violin carry very well in church acoustics. Can it be a coincidence that these were the favorite instruments of the early Baroque? Figured bass is, for a Baroque performer, no more incomplete than is a lead sheet for a jazz performer. All the information is there, but the specific embodiment is left somewhat flexible. It wasn't about faking, since a properly schooled and trained musician could realize continuo parts from the figured bass without guesswork. Why "could"? I know many organists, harpsichordists, and chitarrone players who CAN realize a continuo part at sight. In trying to get some editions of early trombone music ready for publication, I had trouble finding someone who was willing to put down on paper what he/she usually just let happen at the keyboard. Just like trying to get a jazz musician to write down his licks. Howard -- Howard Weiner weiner@privat.toplink.de http://www.odilia.ch/howard-weiner If vegetarians eat only vegetables, what do humanitarians eat? ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 08:30:48 -0500 From: sabutin To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: A new Mozart Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="============_-1200243443==_ma============" The always intriguing Sabutin wrote in part: >One theory...of how the human brain works...is that much >of it actually works as a FILTER, eliminating useless (read: >non-survival oriented) information and allowing the "important" stuff >to come through. 1. The right amount of filtering would seem to lie somewhere between David Helfgott and Kenny G. 2. One way of engaging the audience during our musical performances is to call their survival into question. I seem to be plateaued at "annoy"; somehow I need to push on through to "threaten". Hmmm - lessons with Paulo Esperanza? I gotta go practice, Tom Shaddox, 9th chair tenor "I might not be Bach, but at least I'm not Offenbach." Rossini ================== Actually, one of the truly classic ways to make oneself ableĘ to "engage an audience" is to make put your OWN survival on the line. Really. If your playing is a matter of life and death,in some respect, at least to you...audiences pay attention. Later... S. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 08:45:16 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Report: Learning music may prevent dementia Message-ID: <47763CCCA27C4F4FA4BEF7DDB754A1E71249BA@marshall.jmls.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Tom Shaddox wondered if the news story he sent to the list was counterintuitive. I don't know. It does say that musicians' brains are wired differently. Didn't we know that already? Of course, that's learning music may prevent, not learning music prevents. I heard a wonderful story about a retired cellist who spent hours every day playing the same note over and over. Finally his wife got sick of the monotony and asked him why he no longer played lots of different notes and made beautiful melodies like he used to, and like other cellists do. With a scornful look, he replied, "Everyone is looking for the right note. I alone have found it." ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloging Librarian The John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 8guion@jmls.edu Should part-time band directors be called semi-conductors? Quidquid latine dictum sit, profundum viditur. ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 10:24:16 EST From: Joestanko@aol.com To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: New Bach bass trb. items for sale Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="part1_d7.121f6a42.29818120_boundary" I have the following items for sale, having purchased a new, complete instrument (I only wanted the bell section). Shipping (from NYC) is extra; I have excellent boxes for shipping the hard case and slide; the mouthpiece can be sent Priority Mail. Digital photos can be emailed upon request - specify item(s); email with questions. Joe Stanko Bach 50B slide - brand new, unused standard slide with leadpipe, serial number 136490. Woodwind and Brasswind sells for $765 in last year's catalog. Sell for $600 ========================== Bach 1 1/2G mouthpiece - brand new, unused, silver plate, wrapped in box. Woodwind and Brasswind sells for $36.95 Sell for $20 ========================== Bach bass trombone case Brand new with cleaning rod, pristine condition, no scuffs or scratches. These sell for over $200 new when you can find them separately. Sell for $95 ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 10:25:28 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com To: bpfost@humboldt1.com, trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: <22.227ff08d.29818168@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Bodie, I used to have a teacher that didn't think much of Gershwin either. Gershwin was such and upstart who had nothing to say about classical music. Now Gershwin is considered 'long hair' in a lot of circles, classical in other words. Just one persons opinion. beldon wade ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 10:36:31 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com To: 8guion@jmls.edu, trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Report: Learning music may prevent dementia Message-ID: <186.2478543.298183ff@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Stranger than fiction. It has been reported that sometimes people who are unable to speak due to a stroke are able to sing and form words. Stuttering is another problem that the use of musical rhythm to speak produces unbroken speech. All of this is simply anectdotal unfortunately and never have I read any paper on the subject. Music must be connected with parts of the brain that provide alternate roadways for messages to be carried to other motor functions. beldon wade ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 10:40:16 -0500 From: "Thomas Smee" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <454FC5BC266BDB4BBA26E5BBF2F73FEF28CD75@torxchng1.dwpv.com> content-class: urn:content-classes:message MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit One more piece to consider if they're college students: Elizabeth Raum wrote a nice piece, which I think is published by Warwick also, called "Processional . . . " somthing or other. The first part is specified for alto, though it doesn't go terribly high. Nice piece to start with. Tom -----Original Message----- From: glendening@denison.edu [mailto:glendening@denison.edu] Sent: January 23, 2002 11:36 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Re: Quartets with Alto Trombone Nancy, Here are a few more suggestions: (No particular order) Warwick Music has a few works with alto parts, most notable is the Mozart - Magic Flute Overture. I've had undergrads do that in the past. Per Brevig had a manuscript of a Gottfried Reiche Quartet that had an alto part that was very workable. I remember playing that at the New York Brass Conference in the 1980's. Tezak has several including the Double Fugue from the Mozart Requiem. Maybe too tough. If you want a modern piece try Joseph Klein's Parallaxes (Alto, 2 tenors and Bass). It is available from Nopone Music (Search the Web.) Joe is on the Comp Faculty at North Texas. This piece has lots of theatrics and moving around (in fact you need 60 music stands.) It is work, but an event that the audience won't forget. Hope that helps. Andrew Glendening Quoting Greg Bergantz : > On January 23, 2002, at 01:29 PM, Nancy Vogt wrote: > > > I'm looking for quartets for my undergraduate students, using alto, two > > tenors and bass trombone. They'd like something reasonably > > challenging but > > not outrageous. Any ideas? > > Here's a start: > > A listing of many popular alto trombone works, > http://www.pittstate.edu/music/kehle/altotrombone.html > > You can download Beethoven's Three Equali, Susato's Ten Rennaisance > Dances and several excerpts (and others) at the Brass World site, > http://www.brassworld.co.uk/main.php?instrument=Trombone > > Nancy, I can't say whether or not these are at the right level for > your undergraduates. Chances are, the Susato is going to be tough > for most altos...unless they've already developed chops of steel! > > HTH, > > - Greg Bergantz > > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 15:57:10 From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: RE: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed let's not forget Frank Zappa! Do you think that if Zappa had only cleaned up his mouth, a bit, he would have been more honored for the music he wrote? Or would he have lost his following, all together? I, for one, stopped listening to him, when the language got foul. DanP _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:13:33 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20020124111327.01ebb648@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I don't understand the question. Just about every trombone quartet has a first part that is high enough to be in a good alto range. Some are written in bass clef, some in tenor, and some in alto. But the alto player should be able to read all three. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 16:38:06 From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@po.missouri.edu Subject: Re: New Thread--A new Mozart Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Robert, Absolutely untrue. Musica ficta is a term that became standard in the 14th century and referred to chromatic notes outside the G hexachord. Let me try this again. At issue isnât whether the term musica ficta got coined in 1306 or in 1367. The point is that the church drew a line in the sand, as to which musical licks were acceptable to the church and which werenât. The point is that what musicians were allowed to play then and what we hear today, has been shaped by what the church would allow. And the study of harmony, is the history of the evolution of how musicians and composers have managed to slowly move that line in the sand forward. If you then take some point in that evolution of music and play something notated in figured base, thereâs nothing which states explicitly that that part couldnât be played as a boogie-woogie left hand, other than that nobody could imagine that sound, until music had evolved to that point. And what that indicates is that, just as the right hand of continuo is adlibbed, there may have been groups who adlibbed, much like jazz groups do today. Yes, if they had strayed far from what the church was allowing, they would have been booed off of the stage, but their concept of what music should sound like, kept them in their place, so to speak. Itâs clear that the existence of such a group would be lost to us today, in that writing music was the only way to preserve it. In contrast, jazz composers of today preserve the music by recording it. But anyone whoâs written music knows that thereâs a great compromise between writing it as youâd like it to be played and writing it so that someone can play it. If youâd like for that whole note to be held just one 32d beat past the bar, chances are you wonât write it that way. It would be too confusing to read. Instead, youâd just hope that the musicians would get a feel for the music and play it that way. So, in essence, recording music becomes a more precise way to notate music than writing it. Chances are good that more jazz isnât written because writing it doesnât communicate enough about hoe it should sound. DanP _________________________________________________________________ MSN Photos is the easiest way to share and print your photos: http://photos.msn.com/support/worldwide.aspx ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 09:02:42 -0800 (PST) From: Gabriel Langfur To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Quartets with Alto Trombone Message-ID: <20020124170242.68540.qmail@web10303.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii The Suite for Four Trombones by Alfred Hornoff is specified for ATTB. Excellent, challenging piece in 5 short movements. I would think it would be a great challenge for an undergraduate quartet. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Great stuff seeking new owners in Yahoo! Auctions! http://auctions.yahoo.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 12:15:01 -0500 From: Stephen Troy To: Subject: Help with unknown composer Message-ID: <3.0.5.32.20020124121501.008ee8a0@pop.erols.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I was just listening to the local classical radio station, and the announcer said "Coming up we have music by Mozart, Schubert and Lots Lotsmore." I have heard music from many obscure composers, but I have never heard of Lots Lotsmore. Did he write anything for trombone? Steve Troy (ducking and running) ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 17:34:54 -0000 From: "keith.marr" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Help with unknown composer Message-ID: <002801c1a4fd$72d92880$09313c3e@tiny> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Wilhelm von Lotzlosmor (1897-1963). Ruritanian symphonic composer, besides his 47 symphonies for assorted domestic appliances he is best known for his concerto for teapot, mad hatter and hare. It gets played a lot on Radio Finkelstein, Ruritania's national wavelength. I thought this was generally well known. Keith in Bb/F/D ----- Original Message ----- From: "Stephen Troy" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Sent: Thursday, January 24, 2002 5:15 PM Subject: Help with unknown composer > I was just listening to the local classical radio station, and the > announcer said "Coming up we have music by Mozart, Schubert and Lots > Lotsmore." > > I have heard music from many obscure composers, but I have never heard of > Lots Lotsmore. Did he write anything for trombone? > > Steve Troy > (ducking and running) > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 14:37:43 -0300 From: Hugo Garc’a Sampedro To: , "Trombone-list" Subject: RE: Cage's "Solo for Sliding trombone" Message-ID: <013201c1a4fe$7d4e0c80$0100007f@user061a> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hello Alex You can find this Cage work in Lindberg's "The Solitary Trombone" (BIS-CD-388), AND, Lindberg also performed it in a Video recording, the same in which he plays the Motorcycle Concert. That video was originally launch in the old Video Disk System (years ago), but I got a regular (and illegal) VCR copy. This video recording may be specially useful because you can see in it all the theatrical side of the performance of this kind of pieces (the same with the Berio's Sequencia V), in which the visual issues are important). And to add a litlle comment... It's marvelous to see all that "clip" with Lindberg playing the motorcycle concert. Hope been useful -Hugo ----- Original Message ----- From: alex iles To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Thursday, January 17, 2002 8:56 PM Subject: Cage's "Solo for Sliding trombone" > Hi all, > > Can anyone steer me to a/some recordings of Cage's solo piece? I have > searched a little, but would like to hear some specific recommendations. > > Email me privately if you prefer. > > Thanks, > > Alex > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 11:32:06 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Help with unknown composer Message-ID: <47763CCCA27C4F4FA4BEF7DDB754A1E71249BC@marshall.jmls.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Steve Troy tossed this through the window and ran off: > I was just listening to the local classical radio station, and the > announcer said "Coming up we have music by Mozart, Schubert and Lots > Lotsmore." > > I have heard music from many obscure composers, but I have never heard of > Lots Lotsmore. Did he write anything for trombone? > Maybe it's one of the aliases Henry Fillmore used after he found out that Will Huff was a real person. But if he did write anything for trombone, don't count on hearing it on the radio. ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloging Librarian The John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 8guion@jmls.edu Should part-time band directors be called semi-conductors? Quidquid latine dictum sit, profundum viditur. ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279 Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2002 10:34:52 -0500 From: "Paul D. Kemp, Jr." To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Jim Prindle--Please send me a note Message-ID: <001701c1a4ec$ab29e050$df7b4d0c@trbnplyr> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim, Please send me note--I lost all of my e-mail addresses and I'd like to ask you about something. Paul ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_2279--