TROMBONE-L Digest 1954 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Young Trombonist by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 2) I lost some email yesterday by sabutin@mindspring.com 3) Re: Chicago Lyric by Michael Mclemore 4) Sousaphone - Off by "Nick Drozdoff" 5) Re: Chicago Lyric by "Richard Zemry Johnson" 6) Re: Chicago Lyric by "Neal Schermerhorn" 7) Re: Chicago Lyric by "Gary D. Maxwell" 8) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by Gabriel Langfur 9) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by sabutin@mindspring.com 10) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by "ksdowdy" 11) Re: Chicago Lyric by "Daniel Pliskin" 12) Chicago Lyric by BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com 13) Re: Tarnish Isn't the Word ! by Rusty.Trombone@cometcity.com 14) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by Craig Parmerlee 15) RE: J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J. by "Anthony Lees" 16) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by Andrew Michael 17) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by "Tim Dowling" 18) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by Craig Parmerlee 19) New CD - The Brass Connection by "Brad Howland" 20) Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) by "Rod Ellard" 21) CLO by "Dave Wank" 22) Re: New CD - The Brass Connection by "Rod Ellard" 23) CLO results by "posaune rex" 24) eBay retraction by "Hal Starkey" 25) Re: eBay retraction by "Richard Zemry Johnson" 26) Re: eBay retraction by "Douglas Kilen" 27) Re: eBay retraction by "Steve Beck" 28) Re: eBay retraction by Craig Parmerlee 29) Re: eBay retraction by MasterCoda@aol.com 30) Re: eBay retraction by David Oliver ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 09:06:16 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Young Trombonist Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I wonder at the problem of accepting the young trombonist's (the position not the person) winning the Chicago Audition. If I remember correctly in the piano department of our crazy occupation with music, that Van Cliburn was a world reknowned piano virtuoso at 19. Happens...... beldon wade ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 08:59:11 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: macdad@ix.netcom.com Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: I lost some email yesterday Message-ID: <200102171410.JAA20911@hall.mail.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi all... If any of you sent email to me between about 2PM and 11 PM EST yesterday (Fri, 2/16), please resend it. I was trying to fix my son's email account and somehow lost a bunch of messages meant for me. Thanks... S. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 08:26:21 -0600 From: Michael Mclemore To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: <3A8E8A0C.27CA28A9@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My hat is off to the man.....I wish that I had known which end of the trombone to blow into at 18. Michael McLemore ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 09:29:33 -0800 From: "Nick Drozdoff" To: Subject: Sousaphone - Off Message-ID: <005b01c09907$31acc180$278ad0cf@s6d2w6> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi, folks! I am interested in getting an old Sousaphone. Cosmetics are not important. I don't care what it looks like or how banged up it is as long as it plays with a decent tone and is servicable. I don't have a lot of dough (to put it mildly - I've got to get a new car! Ughh!), so I am not looing for anything particularly new or pretty, just useable and cheap. I know many of you are school band directors and music teachers and music store owners. If you have something that is "unloadable" let's get together and see what the possibilities are. I live the the northern suburbs of Chicago and I do drive all over the area for my gigs. That should give an idea of where I can go to pick things up, if some sort of deal can be reached. Please contact me off the list as this is to specific to bore the readers with. Thanks in advance. Nick Drozdoff http://www.mp3.com/NickDrozdoff ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 05:52:52 -0600 From: "Richard Zemry Johnson" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: <006e01c0980f$00600cc0$98ce4fd8@zemry> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_006B_01C097DC.B39D3E80" I'm glad that he won, but it is damned depressing:) ÊHeck, I thought that I was just practicing to get as good as the older fellas. Now, I've got to practice to get as good as the youngsters! I'm REALLY glad that I play trombone for fun and not as a professional now. ----- Original Message ----- From: Posaune9@aol.com To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 4:38 PM Subject: Chicago Lyric Hi listers, I just received word that Ward Stare, an 18 year old Juilliard student, has just won the Chicago Lyric Principal Trombone audition. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 11:55:57 -0500 From: "Neal Schermerhorn" To: Subject: Re: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: <005301c09902$85ea8f20$0101a8c0@hppav> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit My old friend Jarod Vermette - who can't be much over 25 now - has been principal trombone in the Hong Kong Philharmonic since '96. He was 20 then. He played for shows under my baton back when - no doubt he went on to a great gig! What's to wonder? You go in, you play your best, if they like what you can do better than the others they give you the job. What I'm unclear on is why it's so odd to people that a young player can do it. Neal Schermerhorn ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 5:38 PM Subject: Chicago Lyric > Hi listers, > > I just received word that Ward Stare, an 18 year old Juilliard student, has > just won the Chicago Lyric Principal Trombone audition. > > I don't mean to take anything away from the winner. I haven't heard Ward, > but I have heard great things about him. He must have played VERY well in > order to convince a panel that he is the best and most experienced for the > job. What are your feelings? > > I have a feeling there will be some great discussion about this. > > Ryan > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 09:26:59 -0800 From: "Gary D. Maxwell" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: <005101c09906$d6888aa0$18525d3f@garymaxwell> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Michael Mclemore" Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 6:26 AM > My hat is off to the man.....I wish that I had known which end of the trombone > to blow into at 18. ======================================================== You mean we have a choice? Maybe that's why I play bass. I picked the big end. (:>)) Gary Maxwell Bass Trombone Bakersfield Symphony Orchestra ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 10:11:14 -0800 (PST) From: Gabriel Langfur To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <20010217181114.70313.qmail@web10306.mail.yahoo.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Ryan, I think you should realize that the essential message of your post was "hmm" - which can't really be taken any other way than that you think it's strange, or at least remarkable, that the CLO chose someone so young for the job. You may not consider it second-guessing, but I think most of us on the list took it that way. I'm still not clear what your question really is. On reconsideration of my first reply, I think there are some good questions that can come out of this. From your previous posts, I gather that you're a student at Curtis, so I'll assume that you are also fairly young and remarkably talented, and on a good day could win a big audition. Please don't take the questions I'm about to raise as an attack on you or the choices you've made in your life - they're your choices to make, not anybody else's, and I'm NOT asking you to defend them. One question I would ask is not whether the CLO made a good choice, but whether Mr. Stare has made a good choice in accepting the job. I know this is kind of a ridiculous question, because I know I would accept it if I were him, but what about the rest of his education? How much theory does he know? How much music history? How much HISTORY history? How much literature? How much science? And how much of those things was he going to learn at Juilliard anyway? I know from indirect experience (I did a Masters there) that the undergraduate academics at New England Conservatory are not all that great, despite the best efforts of some very good teachers. I can't imagine they're a lot better at Juilliard or Curtis. Call me crazy, but I think musicians deserve better general educations than are really available to them at the major conservatories. We're smart people - we have to be to do what we do - and I think we do ourselves a disservice by specializing so intensely so young. There is so much to be learned in so many other subjects that can enhance our music-making. I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, but I stand by it, and I'm glad I got my education the way I did, with a liberal arts degree as well as a performance degree. But that was my choice, and it's not the right choice for everyone. I'll go on record saying I hope Mr. Stare enjoys his job in Chicago, and that he also takes advantage of all the other great thing that city has to offer - one of the world's finest art museums, and several fine universities. If I were one of his parents or teachers, I would urge him to go to school part-time once he settles into the job, in order to keep exercising the other parts of his brain. Gabe __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 13:28:26 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: glangfur@yahoo.com Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <200102171840.NAA00511@maynard.mail.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:11 AM 2/17/01 -0800, you wrote: >Ryan, > >I think you should realize that the essential message of your post was >"hmm" - which can't really be taken any other way than that you think >it's strange, or at least remarkable, that the CLO chose someone so >young for the job. You may not consider it second-guessing, but I think >most of us on the list took it that way. I'm still not clear what your >question really is. > >On reconsideration of my first reply, I think there are some good >questions that can come out of this. From your previous posts, I gather >that you're a student at Curtis, so I'll assume that you are also >fairly young and remarkably talented, and on a good day could win a big >audition. Please don't take the questions I'm about to raise as an >attack on you or the choices you've made in your life - they're your >choices to make, not anybody else's, and I'm NOT asking you to defend >them. > >One question I would ask is not whether the CLO made a good choice, but >whether Mr. Stare has made a good choice in accepting the job. I know >this is kind of a ridiculous question, because I know I would accept it >if I were him, but what about the rest of his education? How much >theory does he know? How much music history? How much HISTORY history? >How much literature? How much science? And how much of those things was >he going to learn at Juilliard anyway? I know from indirect experience >(I did a Masters there) that the undergraduate academics at New England >Conservatory are not all that great, despite the best efforts of some >very good teachers. I can't imagine they're a lot better at Juilliard >or Curtis. =============== I'm sure they're not very good at ANY "music" school...but he loses nothing by taking the job. If he wishes to broaden his education, all he has to do is read...he can do that as easily in Chicago as in NY, and since he'll have a LOT more money, if he wants to take really high level courses at the University of Chicago or someplace like that, he'll have plenty of time to do so. ============================ > >Call me crazy, but I think musicians deserve better general educations >than are really available to them at the major conservatories. We're >smart people - we have to be to do what we do - and I think we do >ourselves a disservice by specializing so intensely so young. There is >so much to be learned in so many other subjects that can enhance our >music-making. ============= And we should go ahead and study by ourselves. You can't really ask specialized schools like Juilliard to attract great literature or physics teachers any more than you can expect MIT or Brandeis to have great music teachers. ======================= >I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, but I stand by >it, and I'm glad I got my education the way I did, with a liberal arts >degree as well as a performance degree. But that was my choice, and >it's not the right choice for everyone. I'll go on record saying I hope >Mr. Stare enjoys his job in Chicago, and that he also takes advantage >of all the other great thing that city has to offer - one of the >world's finest art museums, and several fine universities. If I were >one of his parents or teachers, I would urge him to go to school >part-time once he settles into the job, in order to keep exercising the >other parts of his brain. > >Gabe ================= Me too. S. > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 >a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 12:46:03 -0600 From: "ksdowdy" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <003001c09912$0e2c01c0$271d0f3f@m2y9x8> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I certainly did not take Ryan's post as second guessing the audition committee. It is "interesting" that one so young could get a position of such ranking, particularly for those of us who are not musicians and often work in fields where experience is quite important. On the other hand, the arts are an area where talent often is more important than "experience". If we expand away from the orchestral scene, I have seen that youth is really an asset in music. One does not see many 30+ year olds "breaking in" to the scene. Perhaps this is also connected with the frequent pay issues that arise on this list. You don't find many 18 to 20 year olds landing principal engineer positions, or senior surgeon positions. I also doubt that many law firms have 20 year old attorneys handling critical cases either. So, it is "interesting" to some of us when we read on one hand how much time, training, and education it takes to become a musician, and then read on the other that an 18 year old can do it. Either the job is over-rated, or the individual in question is quite exceptional. I assume on the latter. And I, for one, find exceptional people both "interesting" and rare. KSD ----- Original Message ----- From: Gabriel Langfur To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 12:11 PM Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) > Ryan, > > I think you should realize that the essential message of your post was > "hmm" - which can't really be taken any other way than that you think > it's strange, or at least remarkable, that the CLO chose someone so > young for the job. You may not consider it second-guessing, but I think > most of us on the list took it that way. I'm still not clear what your > question really is. > > On reconsideration of my first reply, I think there are some good > questions that can come out of this. From your previous posts, I gather > that you're a student at Curtis, so I'll assume that you are also > fairly young and remarkably talented, and on a good day could win a big > audition. Please don't take the questions I'm about to raise as an > attack on you or the choices you've made in your life - they're your > choices to make, not anybody else's, and I'm NOT asking you to defend > them. > > One question I would ask is not whether the CLO made a good choice, but > whether Mr. Stare has made a good choice in accepting the job. I know > this is kind of a ridiculous question, because I know I would accept it > if I were him, but what about the rest of his education? How much > theory does he know? How much music history? How much HISTORY history? > How much literature? How much science? And how much of those things was > he going to learn at Juilliard anyway? I know from indirect experience > (I did a Masters there) that the undergraduate academics at New England > Conservatory are not all that great, despite the best efforts of some > very good teachers. I can't imagine they're a lot better at Juilliard > or Curtis. > > Call me crazy, but I think musicians deserve better general educations > than are really available to them at the major conservatories. We're > smart people - we have to be to do what we do - and I think we do > ourselves a disservice by specializing so intensely so young. There is > so much to be learned in so many other subjects that can enhance our > music-making. > > I know a lot of people will disagree with me on this, but I stand by > it, and I'm glad I got my education the way I did, with a liberal arts > degree as well as a performance degree. But that was my choice, and > it's not the right choice for everyone. I'll go on record saying I hope > Mr. Stare enjoys his job in Chicago, and that he also takes advantage > of all the other great thing that city has to offer - one of the > world's finest art museums, and several fine universities. If I were > one of his parents or teachers, I would urge him to go to school > part-time once he settles into the job, in order to keep exercising the > other parts of his brain. > > Gabe > > > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Get personalized email addresses from Yahoo! Mail - only $35 > a year! http://personal.mail.yahoo.com/ ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 19:10:58 From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/html I, for one, am pleased that someone so young won out of all those more mature folk. It gives me hope that I, too, might, some day, be able to play the trombone. You see, I may be old, but Iâm very immature. DanP Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 14:33:03 EST From: BJMCHAFFIE@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Chicago Lyric Message-ID: <82.7047d0b.27c02bef@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On the degree business. I lost a friend four years ago who had a degree in Organ Performance from Arthur Jordan (Butler University) and considering the dearth of Organists jobs available to her I am sure that she would have had a more satisfying life from the standpoint of challenges if she had pursued another degree with the organ performance also. However she was a lovely person and did not express a feeling of discontent because she was underutilized in her profession. We certainly enjoyed those moments of music she could share with us. beldon wade ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: 17 Feb 2001 11:33:56 -0800 From: Rusty.Trombone@cometcity.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Tarnish Isn't the Word ! Message-ID: <20010217193356.28776.cpmta@c008.sfo.cp.net> Content-Type: text/plain Content-Disposition: inline Mime-Version: 1.0 Thanks Dan, I have it down at the shop being looked at right now. It's all original and the slide is in very decent shape in all regards considering it's age. The Tech said he could make it look brand new for me. I guess whether that's good or bad and to what degree it affects it's overall worth and sound characteristics is hard for me to tell right now. Time will tell. Regards, Dave Dyke On Sat, 17 February 2001, "Daniel Pliskin" wrote: > > > I removed the finish on a Reynolds trombone and the sound got appreciably more raucous. I have the equipment to refinish it, but I need to wait until the weather gets warmer and dryer. > The lacquer is also going to take more of a beating when the dents are removed, so, one way of the other, the lacquer has to go. > Any good paint remover will work on a lacquered horn. The newer epoxies require a way more nasty paint stripper, also available at the hardware store. But read the directions and be careful. Paint removers burn your skin and can probably blind you. > DanP > >In line with this current topic I seek your valued opinions. I have a prewar King Liberty that is in need of some serious cleaning. Lacquere is poor in many areas and there are a few tiny dings here and there. It needs a good professional cleaning and slide adjustment, and maybe a relacquering over the entire horn. (The orginal lacquere is that bad) The horn is currently at Osmuns for eval. > > > >Without seeing the horn yourself, and I apologize for that, what would your recommendations be in restoration ? > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:41:08 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20010217163209.01e87008@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 12:46 PM 2/17/2001 -0600, ksdowdy wrote: So, it is "interesting" to some of us when we read on one hand how much time, training, and education it takes to become a musician, and then read on the other that an 18 year old can do it. Either the job is over-rated, or the individual in question is quite exceptional. I assume on the latter. At the risk of exposing my deep curmudgeonly roots, I suggest that while it does take a lifetime to become a master, it doesn't take so long to be able to play a handful of opera pieces adequately each season. OK, I guess I'm not being as respectful for the gentleman or the fine opera company, but really, how hard can it be? It isn't as if we are asking for a the composition of a piece of music that will survive the ages. We aren't even asking for a competent soloist, for the most part. We're simply asking for a person to toot in the right spots, and not too loudly to cover up the crooners. I've never heard Mr. Stare or the Lyric company, but I'm sure both are wonderful. I'm sure they have made an excellent employment choice for their business. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 21:55:13 -0000 From: "Anthony Lees" To: "trombone L mailing list" Subject: RE: J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J. Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit You might want to see a doctor about that mate :) Anthony -----Original Message----- From: Chris Waage [mailto:chris@trombone.org] Sent: 15 February 2001 20:42 To: Trombone-L Subject: Re: J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J.J. Depends upon the location of the green stains. ;-) Chris -- ________________________________________________ Chris Waage chris@trombone.org Associate Webmaster The Online Trombone Journal http://www.trombone.org ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 14:41:31 -0800 From: Andrew Michael To: craig@acticalc.com, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 1:41 PM -0800 2/17/01, Craig Parmerlee wrote: >At 12:46 PM 2/17/2001 -0600, ksdowdy wrote: >At the risk of exposing my deep curmudgeonly roots, I suggest that while it >does take a lifetime to become a master, it doesn't take so long to be able >to play a handful of opera pieces adequately each season. OK, I guess I'm >not being as respectful for the gentleman or the fine opera company, but >really, how hard can it be? It isn't as if we are asking for a the >composition of a piece of music that will survive the ages. We aren't even >asking for a competent soloist, for the most part. We're simply asking for >a person to toot in the right spots, and not too loudly to cover up the >crooners. Oh my, oh my. I actually study with the principal of the San Francisco Opera Company, and I stand in complete awe of his deep knowledge of the opera repertoire and performance practice. The level of knowledge, in addition to performing ability, required to do the best possible job is truly incredible. Even after many years of performing and having his current position he went back to school and got his doctorate at Stanford. I certainly feel like his level of knowledge is the same as required to get a doctorate in science (my job). There can be a lot more to this job than "tooting in the right spots, and not to loudly to cover up the crooners." As an amateur, I feel lucky to have received a window into what really goes into high level performance. By the way, I am not attempting to make any comment on Ward Stare's abilities or level of knowledge. I don't know anything about him. I am just trying to comment on what it seems to really take to play opera correctly. Andy ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 00:15:23 +0100 From: "Tim Dowling" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <002e01c09937$84816f20$380540d4@xs4all.nl> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit ----- Original Message ----- From: "Craig Parmerlee" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 10:41 PM Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) > > At the risk of exposing my deep curmudgeonly roots, I suggest that while it > does take a lifetime to become a master, it doesn't take so long to be able > to play a handful of opera pieces adequately each season. OK, I guess I'm > not being as respectful for the gentleman or the fine opera company, but > really, how hard can it be? It isn't as if we are asking for a the > composition of a piece of music that will survive the ages. We aren't even > asking for a competent soloist, for the most part. We're simply asking for > a person to toot in the right spots, and not too loudly to cover up the > crooners. I'm afraid that quite a bit of the Opera repertoire is somewhat more demanding than just "tooting in the right spots". Perhaps one may find the trombone parts of Otello, Falstaff, Lohengrin, Ballo in Maschera, Tannhauser, GotterdŠmmerung, Wozzeck, Lulu, Die Frau ohne Schatten, Die Zauberflšte, etc etc slightly more than a mere "tootle". I even got to play the long alto trombone solo from Ambroise Thomas' Hamlet 8 times during my years as an opera trombonist. It's a truly great repertoire believe me. And he'll get to work with some great singers. Tim Dowling Residentie Orchestra The Hague ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 18:54:18 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20010217185043.01e62f80@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 02:41 PM 2/17/2001 -0800, Andrew Michael wrote: Oh my, oh my. I actually study with the principal of the San Francisco Opera Company, and I stand in complete awe of his deep knowledge of the opera repertoire and performance practice. The level of knowledge, in addition to performing ability, required to do the best possible job is truly incredible. Even after many years of performing and having his current position he went back to school and got his doctorate at Stanford. I certainly feel like his level of knowledge is the same as required to get a doctorate in science (my job). There can be a lot more to this job than "tooting in the right spots, and not to loudly to cover up the crooners." As an amateur, I feel lucky to have received a window into what really goes into high level performance. I certainly agree that these intangibles will help. Given a choice between a player who knows how to play the notes correctly and one who also has a deeper knowledge backed by years of intense, dedicated study, one would think the latter would be preferred. But given the many examples of junior players who have landed these jobs, apparently that depth of knowledge and experience are not valued as highly as we might expect them to be. That's the way it looks from the outside anyway. Craig ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:08:32 -0800 From: "Brad Howland" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: New CD - The Brass Connection Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all, There is a new CD available at Lassus Publications: The Brass Connection, A Five Star Edition. "Headlining four of the greatest trombonists in the world, A Five Star Edition also features the apotheosis of the swinging and lyrical sound of The Brass Connection. This is their third album, and it's aimed at delivering some of the best jazz in the business." With Carl Fontana, Ian McDougall, Bill Watrous, and Jiggs Whigham. To hear Real Audio clips of all four players go to: http://www.musicforbrass.com/brasscds.shtml Regards, Brad Howland ----------------------------------------------------------------- Trombone, Web Design, Income Tax, Brass Music "Specialization is for insects." ...Robert Heinlein E Mail: bradhowland@netzero.net or bhowland@islandnet.com Web Site: http://www.musicforbrass.com ----------------------------------------------------------------- ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:44:59 -0800 From: "Rod Ellard" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Clarification (was: Chicago Lyric) Message-ID: <005801c09944$0a5a74a0$85e394d1@ellard> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Assuming, firstly, that one has the chops, isn't about 99% of the information one needs for the job written there on the page (and the remaining 1% can be obtained from the conductor)? Isn't learning to play legit 'bone (orchestrally, anyway) mostly about converting the written music into sound waves as accurately as possible? Congratulations, is what I say. Good on ya! 18 years old, you say. Terrific. One less teenager getting into trouble. But I guess he won't be able to go for a drink after the gig. As far as the rest of his music education is concerned, with all the spare time this kid will have, he can take some music depreciation courses at his local community college (and maybe score some comps for his class-mates. Surefire way to get some A's on the final, I'd say). Rod ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 19:44:45 -0500 From: "Dave Wank" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: CLO Message-ID: <002701c09943$ffaf21e0$a598fea9@computer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0024_01C0991A.145B48A0" Mr. Stare really did stir up a hornets nest, didn't he? Good for him! Dave ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 16:55:45 -0800 From: "Rod Ellard" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: New CD - The Brass Connection Message-ID: <000901c09945$88bc2a40$85e394d1@ellard> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Brad Howland To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 4:08 PM Subject: New CD - The Brass Connection > Hi all, > > There is a new CD available at Lassus Publications: The Brass Connection, A > Five Star Edition. > > "Headlining four of the greatest trombonists in the world, A Five Star > Edition also features the apotheosis of the swinging and lyrical sound of > The Brass Connection. This is their third album, and it's aimed at > delivering some of the best jazz in the business." > > With Carl Fontana, Ian McDougall, Bill Watrous, and Jiggs Whigham. > > To hear Real Audio clips of all four players go to: > http://www.musicforbrass.com/brasscds.shtml > > Regards, > Brad Howland > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > Trombone, Web Design, Income Tax, Brass Music > "Specialization is for insects." ...Robert Heinlein > E Mail: bradhowland@netzero.net or bhowland@islandnet.com > Web Site: http://www.musicforbrass.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 01:03:46 From: "posaune rex" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: CLO results Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed hi, does anyone have any info on who may have made finals or semis? I have heard rumors that Mark Fischer of the CLO was there, and Ko-Ichiro Yamamoto of the Met, and Mahmoud from Juilliard... an all-Juilliard final round, from what I hear. I also heard that Charlie was there and didn't advance. Anyone heard any truth in this, or know otherwise? thanks... stacy http://remember.to/practice _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 21:34:20 -0600 From: "Hal Starkey" To: "Trombone List" Subject: eBay retraction Message-ID: <00b401c0995b$ae1bb920$0c381b41@KSCABLE.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I just now noticed that the sole eBay bidder for the"King trombone previously owned by JJ Johnson" has retracted his bid. Imagine that! The bid was for $14,000. His explanation is "Seller should learn to show respect for the recently deceased." Yeah, right. Sure. Uh huh. You bet. So, the mystery horn goes unsold. Oh, well. Maybe the seller will someday get to sell Pete Fountain's clarinet, or Louie Bellson's sticks, or Myron Floren's squeeze box, etc., etc., etc. Hal ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Fri, 16 Feb 2001 18:12:36 -0600 From: "Richard Zemry Johnson" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <000601c09876$562c98a0$67cf4fd8@zemry> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I'm glad that the bid has been retracted. I just love the feelings of anger and disappointment that the seller must be feeling just about now! One minute $14,000 and a sucker on the line.....the next minute nothing! ----- Original Message ----- From: "Hal Starkey" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 9:34 PM Subject: eBay retraction > I just now noticed that the sole eBay bidder for the"King trombone > previously owned by JJ Johnson" has retracted his bid. Imagine that! > > The bid was for $14,000. His explanation is "Seller should learn to show > respect for the recently deceased." Yeah, right. Sure. Uh huh. You bet. > > So, the mystery horn goes unsold. Oh, well. Maybe the seller will someday > get to sell Pete Fountain's clarinet, or Louie Bellson's sticks, or Myron > Floren's squeeze box, etc., etc., etc. > > Hal > > > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 22:27:34 -0600 From: "Douglas Kilen" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <009801c09963$1f807c20$b612e0d1@mark> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Reeks of shill bidding to me. I'm sure that the seller either knew the bidder or even was the bidder. There's no other way that a bidder could have 7 bid retractions on record in the last 6 months and not have any negative feed back. Make sense? Doug ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Zemry Johnson" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Sent: Friday, February 16, 2001 6:12 PM Subject: Re: eBay retraction > I'm glad that the bid has been retracted. I just love the feelings of anger > and disappointment that the seller must be feeling just about now! One > minute $14,000 and a sucker on the line.....the next minute nothing! > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Hal Starkey" > To: "Trombones and related issues forum." > Sent: Saturday, February 17, 2001 9:34 PM > Subject: eBay retraction > > > > I just now noticed that the sole eBay bidder for the"King trombone > > previously owned by JJ Johnson" has retracted his bid. Imagine that! > > > > The bid was for $14,000. His explanation is "Seller should learn to show > > respect for the recently deceased." Yeah, right. Sure. Uh huh. You > bet. > > > > So, the mystery horn goes unsold. Oh, well. Maybe the seller will > someday > > get to sell Pete Fountain's clarinet, or Louie Bellson's sticks, or Myron > > Floren's squeeze box, etc., etc., etc. > > > > Hal > > > > > > > > ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 23:27:47 -0500 From: "Steve Beck" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <005101c09963$272f57c0$b2300923@cl.msu.edu> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: "Richard Zemry Johnson" > I'm glad that the bid has been retracted. I just love the feelings of anger > and disappointment that the seller must be feeling just about now! Oh get real. If you had a Guitar from John Lennon and had the desire to sell it for 10 times it's worth and did so on December 15th 1980 you would be what? A grave robber? I think anyone who pays $10,000 for any trombone is an idiot. I think cashing in on someone so recently deceased is in bad taste. But show me the cash and I would have sold it also. And so would you. ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sat, 17 Feb 2001 23:59:57 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <4.3.2.7.2.20010217235812.01e52b50@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 06:12 PM 2/16/2001 -0600, Richard Zemry Johnson wrote: I'm glad that the bid has been retracted. I just love the feelings of anger and disappointment that the seller must be feeling just about now! One minute $14,000 and a sucker on the line.....the next minute nothing! I doubt the seller went through those emotions because the seller was most like in collusion with that shill bidder, or possibly they were one in the same person. As I said earlier, if he is a shill bidder, look for him to pull out his bid just before the close so that the seller does not get stuck with big eBay commissions. That is exactly what he did. If he were an independent person just trying to create havoc for people selling instruments of the recently deceased, he would do better by leaving his bid in place. eBay has no way to make him pay and that would have created an extra hassle for the seller. The fact that he pulled his bid out (and has done so 7 times previously) shows that this was a shill scheme going on. Fortunately no innocent people got caught up in this little game. Later, Craig ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 01:28:51 EST From: MasterCoda@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <32.10c6258b.27c0c5a3@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Perhaps this bidder had a real respect for J.J. and was infuriated like the rest of us when he saw this auction, and only placed an insanely high bid in order to raise the sellers hopes, and then to dash them, in a vain attempt to get back at the seller? Just a thought... Peter ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954 Date: Sun, 18 Feb 2001 01:29:19 -0800 From: David Oliver To: Hal Starkey Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: eBay retraction Message-ID: <3A8F95EF.844BC21C@accessnetusa.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit This is real, real fishy. I thought the bidding started out at $10,000 with the sole bidder. If that is the case, he/she won't bid it up normally unless someone else outbids them. Why did it get up to $14K? There's no reason for one bidder to do that. None. It's too bad that ebay is allowing this to happen. I took bidding very seriously, and never retracted one. I thought then that you had to have a darn good reason. I guess not. This is from someone who bought more than few t-bones on ebay before they became the big deal they are now. I remember when you'd just see 3 or 4 pages when you searched on "trombone" (not 9). I got my late 60's 2B, '67 88H, '58 6H, etc. all from ebay. Two of those horns needed no work and were single owner horns (and stored away for a while). I came out even on the 88H after repairs, but the 6H and 2B were great deals. Buying a house finally cured me of the habit - thankgoodness. I also ended up with a nice range of small bore to large bore horns. David Oliver Broomfield, CO BTW, the Denver Concert Band did a "Fietsa" concert tonight doing the expected pieces. It was fun. "Amparito Roca" on 1st or 2nd part is always a kick, and the second movement in "La Fiesta Mexicana" is one of my all time favorite wind ensemble things. Hal Starkey wrote: > I just now noticed that the sole eBay bidder for the"King trombone > previously owned by JJ Johnson" has retracted his bid. Imagine that! > > The bid was for $14,000. His explanation is "Seller should learn to show > respect for the recently deceased." Yeah, right. Sure. Uh huh. You bet. > > So, the mystery horn goes unsold. Oh, well. Maybe the seller will someday > get to sell Pete Fountain's clarinet, or Louie Bellson's sticks, or Myron > Floren's squeeze box, etc., etc., etc. > > Hal ----__ListProc__NextPart____TROMBONE-L__digest_1954--