TROMBONE-L Digest 1680 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Re: tuning slide question....addendum by Earl Needham 2) Re: tuning slide question....addendum by "Tom Izzo" 3) RE: left arm pain by "Richardson, Tim" 4) Syracuse by Jay Heltzer 5) tuning slides by David Molter 6) by David Molter 7) Re: tuning slides by Craig Parmerlee 8) Re: greatness by Craig Parmerlee 9) RE: Does anyone like the Bach 42 BO?!?! by "Bennett, Gordon (Contractor)" 10) Syracuse by Posaune9@aol.com 11) RE: tuning slides by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 12) Re: tuning slide question....addendum by Earl Needham 13) Alabama results? by "posaune rex" 14) Re: by Earl Needham 15) Re: Alabama results? by " Dan Cloutier" 16) Alabama results by Posaune9@aol.com 17) " . . . in the presence of greatness . . ." by "Thomas Smee" 18) RE: left arm pain by "Richardson, Tim" 19) Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve by BassBonist@aol.com 20) RE: left arm pain by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 21) Re: Does anyone like the Bach 42 BO?!?! by E P Lukas 22) My pet hates by "Adrian Drover" 23) Re: My pet hates by Mike Coyle 24) Bass Bone Wanted by TonyC789@aol.com 25) phone numbers.... by Tim 26) Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve by gdmaxwell@lightspeed.net 27) RE: left arm pain by Craig Parmerlee 28) Re: tuning slide question....addendum by "Adrian Drover" 29) Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve by Craig Parmerlee 30) Playing left-handed by Closetbn@aol.com 31) Tommy Dorsey photo by David Molter 32) Wallace practice mutes by Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur 33) Re: left arm pain by Gary Greenhoe 34) Re: Tommy Dorsey photo by Earl Needham 35) Re: My pet hates by Gary Greenhoe 36) Recent travels by Douglas Yeo 37) Brubeck Concerto and Boston Pops by Douglas Yeo 38) Re: Recent travels by Michael & Dava Millar 39) Re: My pet hates by "Adrian Drover" 40) Re: Berlioz (was: Recent travels) by Douglas Yeo 41) Re: My pet hates by Mike Coyle 42) Re: Playing left-handed by "Anthony J. Heins" 43) Presence of greatness? by "Tom Izzo" 44) Re: My pet hates by "Joe L. Norcross" 45) Re: Music Thoughts for the Soul! by "Les Benedict" 46) Arban for Trombone by "Wesley Jacobs" 47) Wolfpak cases by LEICHSENRINM@wartburg.edu 48) Re: Alabama results by " Dan Cloutier" 49) Re: Alabama results by "Adolphus Sprott" 50) Re: left arm pain by "Tom Izzo" 51) Re: My pet hates by "Nanette L. Kappus" 52) Re: Music Thoughts for the Soul! by Mike Coyle From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:34 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 06:20:29 -0600 From: Earl Needham To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: tuning slide question....addendum Message-ID: <4.2.2.20000510061817.00a80580@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 09:46 PM 5/9/00 -0700, Elisabeth Frederick wrote: > >He then glances at my horn and tells me that my tuning slide is too far in. WAITAMINNIT!!!!!!!! You mean he just LOOKED and told you that? And didn't take the time to actually LISTEN to see if you were in tune or not????? Earl Earl Needham, KD5XB mailto:KD5XB@AMSAT.ORG Clovis, New Mexico DM84jk N34d 25.446m W103d 12.700m (or so) PGP Key ID 0x00BF1A39 Pet peeve: breath is a noun, breathe is a verb (When you take a breath, you breathe...) From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:34 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:26:11 -0500 From: "Tom Izzo" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: tuning slide question....addendum Message-ID: <005601bfba83$4fcbc660$7675dfd0@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Earl Needham > At 09:46 PM 5/9/00 -0700, Elisabeth Frederick wrote: > > > >He then glances at my horn and tells me that my tuning slide is too far in. > > WAITAMINNIT!!!!!!!! > > You mean he just LOOKED and told you that? And didn't take the time > to actually LISTEN to see if you were in tune or not????? > Remember Earl, she said he was a Trumpet player! Trumpet players LOOK. :-) Tom > > Earl > > > Earl Needham, KD5XB mailto:KD5XB@AMSAT.ORG > Clovis, New Mexico DM84jk N34d 25.446m W103d 12.700m (or so) > PGP Key ID 0x00BF1A39 > > Pet peeve: breath is a noun, breathe is a verb (When you take a breath, > you breathe...) From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:34 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:38:32 -0400 From: "Richardson, Tim" To: "'Adolphus Sprott'" , Trombone-L Subject: RE: left arm pain Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE28C9424@LEE2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Bach 42's in my opinion are "nose" heavy. If you add a mute it is worse. While traveling I did a lot of playing with a practice mute and found I had to add washers from the hardware store to serve as a counterweight. Big washers, the 5 to a pound size. Once balanced, if you are using your slide correctly the horn stays balanced in any slide position. Your left hand holds the horn, the right hand holds the slide. So this is a test of your slide technique. Suggestion 1: Buy a straight 42 bell section so you can play without the trigger. Why? well, it's nice to have one anyway! but the best part is you can put it together left handed. This gives your arm a rest, develops the body symmetrically, stimulates the right brain (or would if that distinction were really valid. Most great players play classical right handed and jazz left handed, don't they?). Suggestion 2: Put the horn on the stand every 20 minutes, stand up and stretch. The yoga "Salute to the Sun" exercise works great for me when I remember to do it. Suggestion 3: Look into an exercise program. Musicians can't spare a lot of hours for the gym, so you need something efficient. HIT may be the way to go. It seems to be helping me, haven't had a back ache since I started the current program. (and both teams in the NCAA finals were HIT philosophy teams, as list member Tom Izzo could tell you.) Take your time researching it, there are some risks to anything that works you hard enough to do any good. yours, tim richardson > -----Original Message----- > From: Adolphus Sprott [SMTP:weslanke@worldnet.att.net] > Sent: Tuesday, May 09, 2000 4:58 PM > To: Trombone-L > Subject: left arm pain > > Thanks a lot for all of the help. I think I have gotten plenty of great > thoughts on this. I play a Bach 42G (tenor) trombone for those of you who > asked. I will definitely look into the counterweight and see how it > affects > the feel I have when holding the horn. I'm only 17, so I hope this isn't > something to serious (I don't think it is). If it is serious, that would > be > quite a sad way to start my college career. I'm sure I'll be fine. > Thanks > for the help and any more suggestions would be greatly appreciated. > > Weston Sprott > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:34 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 07:53:59 -0500 From: Jay Heltzer To: trombone Subject: Syracuse Message-ID: <39195BE6.7F0480B2@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit So does anyone out there have the results from the Syracuse Bass Trombone audition on Monday? Jay Heltzer From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:35 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:12:37 -0400 (EDT) From: David Molter To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: tuning slides Message-ID: <381480337.957964357648.JavaMail.root@web31.pub01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To Elizabeth & Ken: ken dowdy wrote: "My King 3B needs almost two inches of tuning slide pulled out if I play the hand slide "against the bumpers".>> And so does mine and, from a survey of the guys I know who have 3Bs, it's fairly common of 3Bs. I used to think I played very sharp, but their reassurance, um, reassured me. I have noticed, however, thatKing 2Bs don't need to be pulled out as far, nor does my King 5B. My Bach 36BO is not our nearly as far to be in tune, either, but its 1st position F above tuning Bb tends to be sharp, so out comes the hand slide for that note. No two horns are alike, fer sure, dude ... and dudette. Dave Molter From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:35 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:49:27 -0400 (EDT) From: David Molter To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Message-ID: <384141262.957966567591.JavaMail.root@web28.pub01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ... one last thought on the "presence of greatness" theory of the Bach 42 being played while Christian Lindberg was in the vicinity: In the summer of 1960, while he was running for president, John F. Kennedy was paraded by my house in New Brighton, Pa., seated on the top of the back seat of a red Chevy convertible. He waved at my family. My brother's King 2B was in our house, in its case, at the time. If someone will offer me $10,000 for it on the theory that some of the Kennedy greatness may still be in in it, I'll drive to Michigan and pry it loose from his steely grasp. (OK, I'll really sneak it out of his garage. But he doesn't play anymore, so he'll never miss it.) Of course, we all know about the Kennedy Curse, so if you're afraid that the horn will fall to pieces right after you buy it, consider these too-good-to-be-true options: I also have a bass played in the presence of Barry Oakley (Allman brother's bassist) AND Duane Allman, (both now deceased), and Joe Walsh (James Gang and the Eagles -- (Joe's alive, but both bands are defunct) and a King 5B once owned by the current Ringling Bros. Circus traveling trombonist (the Ringling Brothers are dead, I'm sure). These could be for sale to the right collector. Also, I once played in a band with Ringo Starr's current guitarist, Steve Dudas (alive ... but Ringo was a BEATLE!!!!!!), and used to go see the band in which Sid McGinnis (alive, but on TV), current guitarist in David Letterman's band, played. I also shook hands with not just Emerson, BUT Emerson LAKE AND ... drumroll ... PALMER (all alive, I think) and have interviewed Graham Nash (alive -- but his friend, David Crosby, almost died) and Joe Diffie (alive -- but a country singer, so who would know?). I plan to sell myself to the highest bidder (reserve price is fair) later today on e-bay, but if you hurry, you might be able to talk me into a straight deal. Serious bidders only. Dave "On the Cusp of Greatness" Molter Pittsburgh, PA From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:35 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:02:03 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: tuning slides Message-ID: <4.3.0.20000510085945.00aca290@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 09:12 AM 5/10/00 -0400, David Molter wrote: >ken dowdy wrote: "My King 3B needs almost two inches of tuning slide >pulled out if I play the hand slide "against the bumpers".>> > >And so does mine and, from a survey of the guys I know who have 3Bs, it's >fairly common of 3Bs. I used to think I played very sharp, but their >reassurance, um, reassured me. I have noticed, however, thatKing 2Bs don't >need to be pulled out as far, nor does my King 5B. My Bach 36BO is not our >nearly as far to be in tune, either, but its 1st position F above tuning >Bb tends to be sharp, so out comes the hand slide for that note. No two >horns are alike, fer sure, dude ... and dudette. Some of that may be the mouthpiece. A deeper cup tends to make the instrument flatter. Most people use a fairly shallow cup with a 2B/3B to keep a brighter sound, ergo more tuning slide needed. Just for fun, try the deepest cup you have and see if that changes the pitch on you. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:35 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:07:14 -0500 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: greatness Message-ID: <4.3.0.20000510090609.00af6ec0@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed I feel like my horns have increased in value just being in the presence of your email. Thanks for making me a rich man. :) Craig At 09:49 AM 5/10/00 -0400, David Molter wrote: >... one last thought on the "presence of greatness" theory of the Bach 42 >being played while Christian Lindberg was in the vicinity: > >In the summer of 1960, while he was running for president, John F. Kennedy >was paraded by my house in New Brighton, Pa., seated on the top of the >back seat of a red Chevy convertible. He waved at my family. My brother's >King 2B was in our house, in its case, at the time. If someone will offer >me $10,000 for it on the theory that some of the Kennedy greatness may >still be in in it, I'll drive to Michigan and pry it loose from his steely >grasp. (OK, I'll really sneak it out of his garage. But he doesn't play >anymore, so he'll never miss it.) Of course, we all know about the Kennedy >Curse, so if you're afraid that the horn will fall to pieces right after >you buy it, consider these too-good-to-be-true options: > >I also have a bass played in the presence of Barry Oakley (Allman >brother's bassist) AND Duane Allman, (both now deceased), and Joe Walsh >(James Gang and the Eagles -- (Joe's alive, but both bands are defunct) >and a King 5B once owned by the current Ringling Bros. Circus traveling >trombonist (the Ringling Brothers are dead, I'm sure). These could be for >sale to the right collector. > >Also, I once played in a band with Ringo Starr's current guitarist, Steve >Dudas (alive ... but Ringo was a BEATLE!!!!!!), and used to go see the >band in which Sid McGinnis (alive, but on TV), current guitarist in David >Letterman's band, played. I also shook hands with not just Emerson, BUT >Emerson LAKE AND ... drumroll ... PALMER (all alive, I think) and have >interviewed Graham Nash (alive -- but his friend, David Crosby, almost >died) and Joe Diffie (alive -- but a country singer, so who would know?). > >I plan to sell myself to the highest bidder (reserve price is fair) later >today on e-bay, but if you hurry, you might be able to talk me into a >straight deal. Serious bidders only. > > >Dave "On the Cusp of Greatness" Molter >Pittsburgh, PA > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:35 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:58:53 -0400 From: "Bennett, Gordon (Contractor)" To: "'TBone List'" Subject: RE: Does anyone like the Bach 42 BO?!?! Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" >It's in awsome condition, newly poliched, and lubricated. It was played >in the presence of Chritian Lindberg and Charles Vernon at Michigan State >University. My nephew recently e-mailed to me a photo of him standing next to Maynard Ferguson prior to a recent concert. I plan on bringing that photo up on my computer monitor, holding my old Conn Director up in front of it, then listing the Conn on ebay with an $800 reserve. Gordon Bennett Harris Air Traffic Control Communications "Everything I really needed to know I learned in Kindergarten: If you go to the bathroom in your pants, they will let you go home." - Tony Myers From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 10:31:40 EDT From: Posaune9@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Syracuse Message-ID: <9d.5309b65.264acccc@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit It is my understanding that Jeff Gray from Juilliard won the job. Ryan Johnstone Curtis Institute of Music Philadelphia, PA 215-732-9311 From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:44:13 -0500 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: tuning slides Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Craig suggested: > Some of that may be the mouthpiece. A deeper cup tends to make the > instrument flatter. Most people use a fairly shallow cup with a 2B/3B to > keep a brighter sound, ergo more tuning slide needed. Just for fun, try > the deepest cup you have and see if that changes the pitch on you. > I did that. It worked, for about two weeks. After this, it seems that I "learned" to play just as sharp as I usually do. The tone color stayed a bit "darker", but the intonation went right back to where I started. I'm sure that there is a good explanation for this, but it is beyond me to give it. KSD From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:46:43 -0600 From: Earl Needham To: "Tom Izzo" , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: tuning slide question....addendum Message-ID: <4.2.2.20000510084155.00a36e90@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 08:26 AM 5/10/00 -0500, Tom Izzo wrote: >----- Original Message ----- >From: Earl Needham > > > At 09:46 PM 5/9/00 -0700, Elisabeth Frederick wrote: > > > > > >He then glances at my horn and tells me that my tuning slide is too far >in. > > > > WAITAMINNIT!!!!!!!! > > > > You mean he just LOOKED and told you that? And didn't take the time > > to actually LISTEN to see if you were in tune or not????? > > >Remember Earl, she said he was a Trumpet player! >Trumpet players LOOK. > >:-) Tom, as for me, you can take the smiley off! Why? Because this trumpet playing director is sounding like -- We have a young man in our store who plays guitar and bass guitar. We talk a bit, and play together occasionally. I get the feeling he doesn't think of how a note is supposed to sound, just where to put his fingers. I actually believe he learns various riffs by fingers rather than notes! It took me over two weeks to get across to him that the bass line for "La Bomba" goes DOWN on the sixth note and not UP! And you know what? He still doesn't quite get it... I suppose I should go get a cup of coffee, now! Earl Earl Needham, KD5XB mailto:KD5XB@AMSAT.ORG Clovis, New Mexico DM84jk N34d 25.446 W103d 12.700 (or so) Pet peeve: breath is a noun, breathe is a verb (When you take a breath, you breathe...) From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:03:02 PDT From: "posaune rex" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Alabama results? Message-ID: <20000510150302.86956.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Has anyone posted the results fromt he Alabama symphony audition? Maybe I missed it... if not, can anyone tell me? I will post the result along with others on my website. thanks! stacy http://remember.to/practice ________________________________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free E-mail from MSN Hotmail at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 09:01:22 -0600 From: Earl Needham To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Message-ID: <4.2.2.20000510085206.00a2ed10@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 09:49 AM 5/10/00 -0400, David Molter wrote: > >Also, I once played in a band with Ringo Starr's current guitarist, Steve >Dudas (alive ... but Ringo was a BEATLE!!!!!!), and used to go see the >band in which Sid McGinnis (alive, but on TV), current guitarist in David >Letterman's band, played. I also shook hands with not just Emerson, BUT >Emerson LAKE AND ... drumroll ... PALMER (all alive, I think) and have >interviewed Graham Nash (alive -- but his friend, David Crosby, almost >died) and Joe Diffie (alive -- but a country singer, so who would know?). > >I plan to sell myself to the highest bidder (reserve price is fair) later >today on e-bay, but if you hurry, you might be able to talk me into a >straight deal. Serious bidders only. I'll see that deal and raise! I once met Omar Bradley, the "Soldier's General", famous from World War Two. Met the pilot of the SECOND B-25 on Doolittle's raid into Tokyo. I've also met Chuck Mangione. He was pretty gracious towards me approaching him, too. Played in front of Maynard Ferguson in a college jazz band some 25 years ago! Still have that Duo Gravis...say $20,000 selling price? Hehe! Met Sam Parish, at the time the Chief Master Sergeant of the Air Force. Just a regular guy, BTW. Was in a formation for General Lewis B. Wilson, Commandant of the Marine Corps, in 1981. Youngest son was born on November 10th, too, for all the Marines out there! Went to school with Steve McMichaels, who played football pretty well in high school, college, and pro, and then became "Mongo", the pro wrestler. Ok, OK, scratch this one! AND -- TA-DA! I have Chicago Transit Authority on VINYL! Earl :-) Earl Needham, KD5XB mailto:KD5XB@AMSAT.ORG Clovis, New Mexico DM84jk N34d 25.446 W103d 12.700 (or so) Pet peeve: breath is a noun, breathe is a verb (When you take a breath, you breathe...) From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:10:51 -0700 From: " Dan Cloutier" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Alabama results? Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit posaune rex wrote: >Has anyone posted the results fromt he Alabama >Symphony audition? Maybe I missed it... if >not, can anyone tell me? I will post the >result along with others on my website. I heard that the job was offered to no one. No one's been offered a number of jobs lately. I wonder which one he/she will eventually take. --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- Before you buy. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:12:07 EDT From: Posaune9@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Alabama results Message-ID: <25.57b95ed.264ad647@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There were two finalists, and both of them currently play in the New World Symphony. Bill Thomas, a Curtis Grad, and Donna ?? . No winner was named. Supposedly the orchestra has asked the current principal to play one more season. There should be another audition next year. Ryan Johnstone Curtis Institute of Music Philadelphia, PA 215-732-9311 From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:13:41 -0400 From: "Thomas Smee" To: Subject: " . . . in the presence of greatness . . ." Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I was thinking about the person selling a horn that had been played in the presence of Christian Lindberg and Charlie Vernon. I had an 88h once that also had two amazing things happen to it, but you have to watch it because sometimes it can turn a good horn bad. First, in the late '70s, the 88h was an extra (being held by me) in a Robert Altman movie starring Paul Newman, Burt Lancaster, Joel Grey and Geraldine Chaplin. Never heard of this movie? There's a good reason for that. It was "Buffaloe Bill and the Indians", a real stinker (except for the 5 or 6 seconds that the 88h had his moment of glory, playing in Buffaloe Bill's Cowboy Band in the presence of the aforementioned stars). I found it amusing that they were so intent on getting an 1890's look that they made sure no one had their watch on (to avoid the Spartacus problem) and they made special historically accurate glasses for those who needed them, but no one thought to wonder if that big ole 88h was historically accurate. The other amazing thing that happened to this 88h was at a trombone conference at Snowbird, also in the late '70s. Ralph Sauer was playing and brought only his 8h, so when he wanted to play part of a Bach cello suite, the 88h had his bell section put on RS' slide and made some very wonderful sounds. Displaying the bubbly enthusiasm for which he is so well known, Ralph handed me back the bell, mumbling "Hmmm, not bad. Thanks." I only wish that I had this 88h still, since it must be worth a lot, having had these experiences. Alas, I had to sell it a few years later. Sadly, it developed a real attitude problem after its encounter with Sauer. Every time I opened the case, it would shine brightly for a moment, then dull down right away as if to say, "Oh, . . . you again". That was bad enough, but when it started commenting while I was practising, I'd had enough. "I don't think thats how Ralph would have done it", it would opine with a poorly disguised sneer. I even tried using a Schilke 51 for a while to try to placate it, but in the end I had to admit that it had got the better of me, so I sold it and went to the dark side, buying a Bach 42 and a 5G. So now you know why that person is selling their trombone that was played "in the presence of Christian Lindberg and Charlie Vernon". I'll bet that horn also became insufferable, despite its admirable playing qualities. I won't be buying it. Tom Smee PS. When coming back to the city from the movie set on the bus, I leaned over to strike up a conversation with the guy who was doing the music for the movie. He was a guitar player who also had done the music for the movie, Nashville. I was about to open my mouth when I noticed that he was pondering a question - like, write an F major triad in bass clef - in one of those basic theory books. He didn't know how to read music. I sat right down and stared out the bus window for the rest of the trip back to town. It was a case of 'earn while you learn', as a friend once said. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:36:26 -0400 From: "Richardson, Tim" To: "'Galen Zinn'" Cc: "'bonepost'" Subject: RE: left arm pain Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE28C9428@LEE2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain I guess this has some trombone application. Until I started researching exercise a little, I had no idea how fiercely passionate and vituperative the fanatics are on both sides. There is no middle ground, no moderates, nobody who doesn't fly into a rage and start a flame war. I'm not an expert but here is my understanding. Basically there are volume trainers, traditional bodybuilding type weightlifters who spend lots of hours in the gym every day working every conceivable muscle group. Then the opposing group is HIT, high intensity training advocates, who believe in brief, infrequent, but severe, workouts; compound exercises (never isolation, rarely direct arm work) with heavy weights, generally to failure and sometimes beyond, and meticulous record keeping. There are lots of subgroups of HIT, like Superslow, strong range partials, etc. Both approaches clearly get results but they sure hate each other. Some HIT proponents might work out as little as monthly or less often and show progress - amazing. The theory is if you work hard enough, AND rest long enough, you will add weight every single workout. I do a half hour workout once per week and expect to eventually get to every two weeks. My apologies if I've misrepresented either camp. Cyberpump web site is a good place to start looking for more info. Would this work for trombone practice? No, I don't think so. I think you could keep your strength, maybe even build it - we all know people who can pick up a trombone every couple of weeks and crack off double or triple high F's. But I think trombone playing is more skill than strength, and I don't see how you can retain skill on much less than daily practice. And at my level, I don't dare retain skill - I need to build some first! But daily practice time, plus work and family, doesn't leave a lot of time for gym workouts, and that's what intrigued me about the infrequent approach. yours, tim richardson > -----Original Message----- > From: Galen Zinn [SMTP:zinger@musician.org] > Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2000 10:01 AM > To: richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL > Subject: Re: left arm pain > > on 5/10/00 5:38 AM, Richardson, Tim at richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL wrote: > > > Suggestion 3: Look into an exercise program. Musicians can't spare a > lot > > of hours for the gym, so you need something efficient. HIT may be the > way > > to go. > > "HIT" does not ring any bells with me. Could you please explain what the > letters stand for. Thanks! > > > It seems to be helping me, haven't had a back ache since I started > > the current program. (and both teams in the NCAA finals were HIT > philosophy > > teams, as list member Tom Izzo could tell you.) Take your time > researching > > it, there are some risks to anything that works you hard enough to do > any > > good. > > > Galen Zinn > E-mail: zinger@musician.org > > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:40:33 EDT From: BassBonist@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Elisabeth Frederick wrote: <> Earl Needham then wrote; < WAITAMINNIT!!!!!!!! You mean he just LOOKED and told you that? And didn't take the time to actually LISTEN to see if you were in tune or not????? > Then Tom Izzo chimed in- <> I know this is somewhat tongue-in-cheek but it reminds me of a situation that drives me NUTS and is not limited to just one trumpet player: I have seen (in rehearsals at least) a couple of trumpet players who play with an ELECTRONIC TUNER ON THEIR MUSIC STAND with lights flashing the whole time! In the case of both individuals the reason that they are always out of tune is because they don't LISTEN to what is going on around them but instead, keep their eyes and brain LOCKED on the machine! UGH! Matt Varho From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 11:32:02 -0500 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: left arm pain Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Tim wrote (in part): > Most great players play classical right > handed and jazz left handed, don't they?). > Is this true? The only "great" player that I know that plays left handed is Slide Hampton, and I don't think he plays classical at all. In fact, the only other trombonists that I have ever seen play left handed are a couple of 5th graders that had not had their first lesson yet. Anyway, this brings up a subject that I have wanted to ask about for quite some time. In my area, kids start out with straight tenor trombones. Some kids are naturally left handed, and it seems to me that it would facilitate one's trombone playing if one were allowed to play in the manner most comfortable to them. However, I (and others) have all the kids play right handed because when they get to high grades (depending on the school), some bozo is going to insist that they get a trombone with an F attachment. I have not played one left handed, but it does not look like it would be very comfortable. It seems like a lot depends on the band director. Those that are classical minded tend to be very dogmatic and try to pound the kid into a certain mould. The Jazz minded teachers tend to stress sound and creativity much more, and quite frankly could not care less WHAT you are playing or how, as long as it sounds good. My natural tendency is toward the latter, and if it were up to me, I would have a lefty play left and a righty play right, but I don't want to "ruin" the next Joe Aleisi (not that he would be taking lessons from me anyway). I would be interested in other people's opinions on this matter. KSD From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:36 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:08:41 -0500 From: E P Lukas To: ellard@sprint.ca Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Does anyone like the Bach 42 BO?!?! Message-ID: <39199799.3557AA02@bellsouth.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > Mark wrote regarding his Bach trombone: > > "It was played in the presence of Christian > Lindberg and Charles Vernon at Michigan State > University." My father has THE axe that George Washington used to chop down the cherry tree. Guaranteed to be authentic! I've asked him to leave it to me in his will. It's had the head replaced once and the handle replaced twice, but it's THE REAL THING! From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:48:28 +0100 From: "Adrian Drover" To: "Trombone List" Subject: My pet hates Message-ID: <000101bfbaa3$b924de60$b64e01d5@v4v3j2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike Suter said "As many of you know, I am not a lover of "classical" music. Most of it bores me stiff." David Buckley responded with "Personally most jazz bores me to tears. Everyone to their taste as the old lady said when she kissed the cow." May I join in? My pet hates are country/western singers, operatic sopranos and electronic dirges that pass for underscore in TV drama. In fact I actually prefer a cow's ass to any of these. A. Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk Business: studio@adios.co.uk http://www.adios.co.uk From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:23:27 -0500 From: Mike Coyle To: slide.rule@adios.co.uk Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <200005101724.MAA06361@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" My pet hates when I don't him him. I like all music except rap and French impressionism :) MC At 07:48 AM 5/10/00 , you wrote: >Mike Suter said "As many of you know, I am not a lover of "classical" music. >Most of it bores me stiff." > >David Buckley responded with "Personally most jazz bores me to tears. >Everyone to their taste as the old lady said when she kissed the cow." > >May I join in? My pet hates are country/western singers, operatic sopranos >and electronic dirges that pass for underscore in TV drama. In fact I >actually prefer a cow's ass to any of these. > >A. > >Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) >Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk >Business: studio@adios.co.uk >http://www.adios.co.uk > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:38:16 EDT From: TonyC789@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Bass Bone Wanted Message-ID: <8.4cf6d8a.264af888@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sorry about the repeat, I deleted all my email. DOH! One-valve bass bone wanted. Bach 50B, Conn, etc. 9 1/2" bell, .562 bore. Tony Clements From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 18:47:07 +0100 (GMT Daylight Time) From: Tim To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: phone numbers.... Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Does anyone on the list have the Telephone Number for 'The Valve' trombone shop in London England? I have tried to get in contact with them via email to no avail, and I have lost their buisness card. If anyone does have the number could they reply to me please? ta tim ---------------------- Tim Budd " ... the chief objection to playing wind instruments is that it prolongs the life of the player beyond all reasonable limits. If you want to become phthisis-proof, drink-proof, cholera-proof, and, in short, immortal, play the trombone well and play it constantly." From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 10:55:39 +0800 From: gdmaxwell@lightspeed.net To: BassBonist@aol.com, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve Message-ID: <3919a29b.646e.0@lightspeed.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit >I know this is somewhat tongue-in-cheek but it reminds me of a situation that >drives me NUTS and is not limited to just one trumpet player: I have seen (in >rehearsals at least) a couple of trumpet players who play with an ELECTRONIC >TUNER ON THEIR >MUSIC STAND with lights flashing the whole time! In the case of both >individuals the reason that they are always out of tune is because they don't >LISTEN to what is going on around them but instead, keep their eyes and brain >LOCKED on the machine! We, from time to time, use a particular trumpet player who does the same type thing, except in place of the Electrotuner, he does everything for attention. Plays loud, plays high, plays fast. You all know him. Our Principal Trumpet handles him pretty well by suddenly becoming him. He never says a word, just throws in little mimicks, periodically. An out of tune note/phrase, some sort of 'something' during an at rest moment, an exact duplication of the way he played his last section, any number of things. If any of you have ever had the privelige of performing with Charles Brady, you know his quiet intimidation handles all situations. He doesn't need ego. He's got the proof. Trombone related? Yeah, I've had the good fortune to have sit in back of him for the past 30 years. You ought to hear his trombone impersonation when I, or any of the section, get too far outta hand. (:>)) Gary Maxwell Bass Trombone Bakersfield Symphony Orchestra > >UGH! > >Matt Varho > > > > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:19:48 -0300 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: left arm pain Message-ID: <4.3.0.20000510141455.00ab6a00@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:32 AM 05/10/2000 -0500, you wrote: >Tim wrote (in part): > > > Most great players play classical right > > handed and jazz left handed, don't they?). > > > Is this true? The only "great" player that I know that plays left >handed is Slide Hampton, and I don't think he plays classical at all. In >fact, the only other trombonists that I have ever seen play left handed are >a couple of 5th graders that had not had their first lesson yet. The story I heard about Slide comes from someone who went to school with him and still plays in his bands on occasion, so I think it is at least a little factual. The story goes that his father was pushing each of the kids to take up some instrument. The father had found a used trombone at a pawn shop. Nobody in the family knew anything about the trombone. When his father assembled it, he put it together left-handed, although Slide is right-handed. By the time Slide figured out that this was backwards, he was already pretty good playing with his left hand, and the rest is history. Even if it isn't a true story, I'm still going with it. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 18:33:43 +0100 From: "Adrian Drover" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: tuning slide question....addendum Message-ID: <007701bfbaa9$b2f80020$b64e01d5@v4v3j2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Tom Izzo To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2000 2:26 PM Subject: Re: tuning slide question....addendum > Remember Earl, she said he was a Trumpet player! > Trumpet players LOOK. Some Trumpet players look terrible. A. Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk Business: studio@adios.co.uk http://www.adios.co.uk From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:43:25 -0300 From: Craig Parmerlee To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: tuning slide question....Pet Peeve Message-ID: <4.3.0.20000510143305.00aff220@acticalc.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 11:40 AM 05/10/2000 -0400, BassBonist@aol.com wrote: >I know this is somewhat tongue-in-cheek but it reminds me of a situation that >drives me NUTS and is not limited to just one trumpet player: I have seen (in >rehearsals at least) a couple of trumpet players who play with an ELECTRONIC >TUNER ON THEIR >MUSIC STAND with lights flashing the whole time! In the case of both >individuals the reason that they are always out of tune is because they don't >LISTEN to what is going on around them but instead, keep their eyes and brain >LOCKED on the machine! Well, that would still be an improvement in most cases. In one group I regularly play with, the trumpets (all 10 of them) always play almost a quarter step above the woodwinds. If the trumpeters were using a pitch machine, maybe I could infiltrate their section during a break and adjust their machine to the pitch used by the rest of the band. Perhaps the trumpets begin with the same pitch on cold instruments, but they end up way off after things get warm. This causes a difficult balancing act where the trombones adjust to the trumpet pitch when they have the lead and likewise for when the woodwinds have the lead. This gets pretty exciting when the trumpets and clarinets alternate lines each measure. If I had perfect pitch, I would go mad, and I wish the conductor would stop the group and make them tune it up. But he doesn't, and it is not my place to offer such a suggestion. Instead, I use it as a study to carefully hear the different pitches and make instantaneous decisions about which of the pitches is most musically important at each instant, and match up to that. In truth, I think this cornucopia of pitches actually helps my ear. Other than the second-rate intonation, this group really plays very well. Too bad they are missing one of the basics. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:38:20 EDT From: Closetbn@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Playing left-handed Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 5/10/2000 9:33:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time, kdowdy@oppd.com writes: << Is this true? The only "great" player that I know that plays left handed is Slide Hampton, and I don't think he plays classical at all. In fact, the only other trombonists that I have ever seen play left handed are a couple of 5th graders that had not had their first lesson yet. Anyway, this brings up a subject that I have wanted to ask about for quite some time. In my area, kids start out with straight tenor trombones. Some kids are naturally left handed, and it seems to me that it would facilitate one's trombone playing if one were allowed to play in the manner most comfortable to them. However, I (and others) have all the kids play right handed because when they get to high grades (depending on the school), some bozo is going to insist that they get a trombone with an F attachment. I have not played one left handed, but it does not look like it would be very comfortable. It seems like a lot depends on the band director. Those that are classical minded tend to be very dogmatic and try to pound the kid into a certain mould. The Jazz minded teachers tend to stress sound and creativity much more, and quite frankly could not care less WHAT you are playing or how, as long as it sounds good. My natural tendency is toward the latter, and if it were up to me, I would have a lefty play left and a righty play right, but I don't want to "ruin" the next Joe Aleisi (not that he would be taking lessons from me anyway). I would be interested in other people's opinions on this matter. KSD >> I think I remember Slide Hampton saying that he played left-handed because nobody had shown him how to put a trombone together, so he just taught himself. Remember that most French Horn players are right-handed and are playing what is essentially a left-handed instrument - so I don't see how it's going to slow down left-handed trombone students that much if they learn to play right-handed. Also, pianists and percussionists have pretty equal facility with either hand. Come to think of it, string-players are doing some pretty complicated work with their left hand as well. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:57:20 -0400 (EDT) From: David Molter To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Tommy Dorsey photo Message-ID: <383726923.957985040791.JavaMail.root@web30.pub01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I can't recall who was looking for a picture of Tommy Dorsey last wek, but there's one up for auction on e-bay, fairly cheap, at this address: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325359370 Dave Molter From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 12:44:36 -0700 (PDT) From: Peter Collins & Sara Wilbur To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Wallace practice mutes Message-ID: <15088390.957987879281.JavaMail.imail@chilly.excite.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Everybody, I have heard so much about the Wallace Practice Mutes that I want to buy one now but need one very soon. I called Osmun and unfortunately they are out of stock. Could someone recommend another source that could ship to Toronto quickly? Please contact me privately at either: sarapete@excite.com or sarapete@sprint.ca I am on the digest format of the trombone-l and sometimes it is a day or so before I see responses. Thanks for your help. Peter Collins _______________________________________________________ Get 100% FREE Internet Access powered by Excite Visit http://freelane.excite.com/freeisp From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 15:22:29 -0500 From: Gary Greenhoe To: kdowdy@oppd.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: left arm pain Message-ID: <3919C505.CCCF3A66@greenhoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit HI Kenneth, I am a lefty..and for the heck of it (mostly for entertainment) I used to reverse my "Olds Ambassador" ....which, BTW, has been around many great teachers and players.. ;-) ...and I still have it, if anyone is interested...about a 1953 vintage. (a list of who's who will be mailed to anyone interested, privately) Sorry....back to the lefty thing... I find that playing the trombone "right-handed" is actually more better...Guess I've had too much coffee today! But seriously, look at all of these posts discussing sore arms from holding this "tube of agony"....if they were left handed, they wouldn't be complaining! So, although I've played the horn left and right..I find no problem going right. My conclusion: don't worry about messing up lil' Joey! Warm Regards, lefty....ah..mean...Gary "DOWDY, KENNETH S" wrote: > > Tim wrote (in part): > > > Most great players play classical right > > handed and jazz left handed, don't they?). > > > Is this true? The only "great" player that I know that plays left > handed is Slide Hampton, and I don't think he plays classical at all. In > fact, the only other trombonists that I have ever seen play left handed are > a couple of 5th graders that had not had their first lesson yet. > > Anyway, this brings up a subject that I have wanted to ask about for > quite some time. In my area, kids start out with straight tenor trombones. > Some kids are naturally left handed, and it seems to me that it would > facilitate one's trombone playing if one were allowed to play in the manner > most comfortable to them. However, I (and others) have all the kids play > right handed because when they get to high grades (depending on the school), > some bozo is going to insist that they get a trombone with an F attachment. > I have not played one left handed, but it does not look like it would be > very comfortable. It seems like a lot depends on the band director. Those > that are classical minded tend to be very dogmatic and try to pound the kid > into a certain mould. The Jazz minded teachers tend to stress sound and > creativity much more, and quite frankly could not care less WHAT you are > playing or how, as long as it sounds good. My natural tendency is toward > the latter, and if it were up to me, I would have a lefty play left and a > righty play right, but I don't want to "ruin" the next Joe Aleisi (not that > he would be taking lessons from me anyway). I would be interested in other > people's opinions on this matter. > > KSD From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:27:52 -0600 From: Earl Needham To: kingbone@earthlink.net, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Tommy Dorsey photo Message-ID: <4.2.2.20000510142737.00a37e60@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed At 02:57 PM 5/10/00 -0400, David Molter wrote: >I can't recall who was looking for a picture of Tommy Dorsey last wek, but >there's one up for auction on e-bay, fairly cheap, at this address: > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325359370 > >Dave Molter That was me, thanks for the info. Earl Earl Needham, KD5XB mailto:KD5XB@AMSAT.ORG Clovis, New Mexico DM84jk N34d 25.446 W103d 12.700 (or so) Pet peeve: breath is a noun, breathe is a verb (When you take a breath, you breathe...) From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 15:30:31 -0500 From: Gary Greenhoe To: astro@pconline.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <3919C6E7.93FF6D2C@greenhoe.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Mike, Does that mean what I think it means???? I'd stick to cows! And Adrian, I live in the country here in Wisconsin, where the cows are plentiful! Any time ya feel a longing for some nice "sounds" or whatever....these dairy cows deliver a powerful punch...especially the Guernseys... And ...they love to listen to the trombone. Best damn audience one could ask for! Come on over! Gary Mike Coyle wrote: > > My pet hates when I don't him him. > > I like all music except rap and French impressionism :) > > MC > > At 07:48 AM 5/10/00 , you wrote: > >Mike Suter said "As many of you know, I am not a lover of "classical" music. > >Most of it bores me stiff." > > > >David Buckley responded with "Personally most jazz bores me to tears. > >Everyone to their taste as the old lady said when she kissed the cow." > > > >May I join in? My pet hates are country/western singers, operatic sopranos > >and electronic dirges that pass for underscore in TV drama. In fact I > >actually prefer a cow's ass to any of these. > > > >A. > > > >Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) > >Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk > >Business: studio@adios.co.uk > >http://www.adios.co.uk > > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:37 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 16:33:01 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Recent travels Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" ; format="flowed" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit I returned yesterday from a short Boston Symphony tour to Paris (1 week, 3 concerts) and Cologne/K�ln (3 days, 2 concerts). Much to report, but a few items which might be of particular interest. I was in Paris during the annual Musicora music fair, wow, what a remarkable event. Every manufacturer of instruments was there, as well as publishers and retailers. Four antique instrument dealers were there as well and I got to try many serpents, Russian bassoons and ophicleides. I was on a mission to purchase an ophicleide and successfully did so - made in 1850 by Roehn and Co. in Paris, in C, 9 keys. It has been beautifully restored and plays evenly and in tune (notwithstanding that poem on the ophicleide which has been going around, the ophicleide has a beautifully sweet tone - the poet obviously never heard one played well!). I also tried a valve trombone in C made by Adolphe Sax, a real treat to hold an instrument made by that great pioneer. I spent a whole day at the Musee de Musique which has a spectacular collection of instruments including trombones of every shape and size, and a beautiful buccine (over the shoulder dragon shaped trombone, like the ITA logo). It really became clear to me how the world of brass playing was in incredible evolution in the 19th century, with so many things being invented, improved, discarded and modified (saxhorns, sarrousophones, ophicleides, etc). I highly recommend the museum if you are in Paris (closed on Mondays). The Museum also has a research and documentation center which provided me with hours of fun researching the serpent. Some may have seen the print I have on my website of Amiens Cathedral (http://www.yeodoug.com/amiens.html); I was fortunate enough to get to go there by train and I was also able to get into the choir stalls (pictured on the print). It was stunning to see, carved into the stall where the serpentist on the south side (right) of the choir is standing, graffiti of a serpent! I took many photos and will put some up on my site in the coming weeks. One highlight was a combined concert with the Boston Sym and the Orchestra de Paris, held outside near the Eiffel Tower. Among the things we played was the Berlioz Hungarian March from "Damnation of Faust" and it really hit me how differently Berlioz' music sounds with a large orchestra. His unison and octave writing is so effective with multiply doubled parts, and to be in Paris playing that music in such an effective setting (not far from Napolean's tomb) with such history (our hotel was a few blocks from the Bastille monument) has given me much to think of. When I returned home, the copy of the Berlioz Grand symphonie funebre et triomphale I ordered from amazon.com was waiting for me, performed by the Wallace Collection (Nimbus NI 5175) with Dudley Bright (principal trombone of the Philharmonia Orch) as soloist in the 2nd movement. I remember the thread we had on this piece before I left on tour. The point was made, arguably, that the work is not among Berlioz best. But as I listened to this fine recording today, along with other ceremonial and patriotic music written for or about the French Revolutions of 1789 and 1830 (including Gossec's arrangement of Rouget de Lisle's "Hymne a la Liberte" better known as "La Marseillaise"), I couldn't help but noting in my mind that how we evaluate pieces must take into account the context of them. Patriotic music is not very much in fashion these days, and ceremonial music seems to be limited in our time to the newest John Williams fanfare for an occasion. When we recall the purpose of Berlioz Symphonie, and how the premiere came not in a concert hall, but in a parade celebrating the 10th anniversary of the 1830 Revolution (with Berlioz conducting while walking backwards!) with over 200 musicians playing, we may begin to understand what Wagner meant when he said, "I am convinced that this symphony will last and exalt the hearts of men as long as there lives a nation called France." It is our expectations of a piece which sometimes color our thinking about it, whether is is "great" or "less great" and context is something which is terribly important. I recall a private discussion I had with a list member who said, and I quite agree, that he has difficulty separating some music from its context - for instance this friend said that to listen to Bach's church music on a CD player just doesn't "do it" for him, that to divorce it from the church environment and its context in a service is to leave out a very important part of the musical experience. Likewise with the Berlioz. Having stood at the Place de la Bastille earlier this week, and with the memory of that memorial column fresh in my mind, to hear Berlioz Symphonie, with its words, "Glory! All glory and triumph to these our Heroes!" leaves me with quite a different impression than I had before I left on the tour. In any case, there is much to think about as a result of this trip. And it is nice to be back to the list. -Doug Yeo ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 16:35:20 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Brubeck Concerto and Boston Pops Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" While on tour, I got word that the Boston Pops has added an additional performance of the finale of Chris Brubeck's "Bass Trombone Concerto" ("James Brown in the Twilight Zone"). I will be playing it both on May 26 AND May 30 in Symphony Hall in Boston. Both concerts are being taped for the Public Broadcasting System series "Evening at Pops" for broadcast sometime this summer. Tickets can be ordered online through the BSO website at http://www.bso.org -Doug ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:27:31 -0700 From: Michael & Dava Millar To: yeo@yeodoug.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Recent travels Message-ID: <3919D443.2EE13CD6@earthlink.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Douglas Yeo wrote: > I got to try many serpents, Russian bassoons > and ophicleides. I seem to recall that Berlioz, in his "Treatise on Instrumentation," expressed an opinion of the Russian bassoon that was negative to the point of being humorous. I don't have a copy handy at the moment for the exact quote. Mike Millar From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 22:57:05 +0100 From: "Adrian Drover" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <003801bfbaca$d467dd40$066f01d5@v4v3j2> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Gary Greenhoe To: Trombones and related issues forum. Sent: Wednesday, May 10, 2000 9:30 PM Subject: Re: My pet hates > Adrian, I live in the country here in Wisconsin, where the cows are > plentiful! Any time ya feel a longing for some nice "sounds" or > whatever....these dairy cows deliver a powerful punch...especially the > Guernseys... And ...they love to listen to the trombone. Best damn > audience one could ask for! Maybe, but where there's cows there's cowboys, and where there's cowboys there's............ Oh well, I suppose that's preferable to operatic sopranos. But you're right, cows do have a fondness for brass players. My dad (89 in June) likes to practice on his cornet in the fields, and he always gathers a bovine audience. A. Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk Business: studio@adios.co.uk http://www.adios.co.uk From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:58:26 -0500 From: Douglas Yeo To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Berlioz (was: Recent travels) Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed" At 2:27 PM -0700 5/10/00, Michael & Dava Millar wrote: > >I seem to recall that Berlioz, in his "Treatise on Instrumentation," >expressed an opinion of the Russian bassoon that was negative to the >point of being humorous. I don't have a copy handy at the moment for the >exact quote. Berlioz ran hot and cold with the serpent, ophicleide and Russian bassoon (which is neither Russian nor a bassoon, but a straightened out serpent in the shape of an ophicleide usually with a dragon headed bell). The quotation Mike refers to regarding Berlioz and the Russian bassoon in his Treatise is: "In my opinion [the Russian bassoon] might be dropped from the family of wind instruments without the least injury to art...It is to be hoped that they will disappear forever..." Berlioz, of course, often wrote music with specific players in mind (such as Dieppo in the 2nd movement of his Symphonie I referenced earlier today). But it's also true that at the time he was writing, bass winds were in a remarkable period of flux. In his lifetime, he saw the bass of the wind band and orchestra move from the serpent to ophicleide to sax horn to bombardon to tuba. Because instruments were coming in and out of favor so rapidly, and makers like Sax and Halary were turning out new ideas as fast as your mom bakes apple pies, it was difficult for a composer to know how to score a piece, as while he might have, say, a tuba player for one performance, another might only have an ophicleide. Berlioz' disparaging remarks about the serpent and Russian bassoon were made at the time of transition when serpent playing was at a low as makers were putting multiple keys on the instrument in (vain) hope of improving its inherent instability - performers took the keys as the "solution" and actually stopped practicing as much - disaster on any instrument. The ophicleide (literally "ophis" = serpent, "kleis" = keys or covers - hence a keyed serpent) was a dramatic improvement over the serpent in terms of stability and lent itself more appropriately to the every growing orchestra of which Berlioz was in the process of developing on his own. Interestingly, in his "Messe solennelle" of 1824, he writes parts for both ophicleide AND serpent (and buccine as well) when he could have just as well written for one or the other. However, his serpent writing (which includes a solo as well as blending with bassoons) is very skillful, and obviously at that time he knew players who would play the part with skill. Likewise, the original version of the Symphonie Fantastique (1831) included a part for two ophicleides in the 4th movement, and one ophicleide and one serpent in the 5th (when he could have just as easily kept the 2 ophicleides). A later version dropped the serpent and still later he exchanged the ophicleides for tuba. All part of the evolution, but in the process, something got missed along the way as well. There is a world of difference between a serpent, ophicleide and tuba and each lends a totally different character to the piece. We have to remember that other instruments were undergoing a similar evolution as well - the 2 valve cornet was being used, for instance, and when the Symphonie is played with 4 trumpets instead or cornets and truments, life is very different, etc. In the end, most of the bass winds which came and went through the remarkable 19th century (particularly in France and England) which, in addition to those listed above include the serpent Forville and English bass horn, when played by an accomplished player, have a very characteristic sound and can lend their unique color to ensembles for which they were designed. -Doug Yeo ********************************************** * Douglas Yeo * * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * * yeo@yeodoug.com * * http://www.yeodoug.com * * <>< * ********************************************** From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:24:59 -0500 From: Mike Coyle To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <200005102226.RAA17245@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" HAHAHAHAHA Oops, I meant to say "my pet hates when I don't FEED him"!!!!!!!!!! I'm so busy these days my mistake quotient is sky rocketing!!!! Drag. mc At 03:30 PM 5/10/00 , you wrote: >Mike, >Does that mean what I think it means???? I'd stick to cows! And >Adrian, I live in the country here in Wisconsin, where the cows are >plentiful! Any time ya feel a longing for some nice "sounds" or >whatever....these dairy cows deliver a powerful punch...especially the >Guernseys... And ...they love to listen to the trombone. Best damn >audience one could ask for! >Come on over! >Gary > >Mike Coyle wrote: >> >> My pet hates when I don't him him. >> >> I like all music except rap and French impressionism :) >> >> MC >> >> At 07:48 AM 5/10/00 , you wrote: >> >Mike Suter said "As many of you know, I am not a lover of "classical" music. >> >Most of it bores me stiff." >> > >> >David Buckley responded with "Personally most jazz bores me to tears. >> >Everyone to their taste as the old lady said when she kissed the cow." >> > >> >May I join in? My pet hates are country/western singers, operatic sopranos >> >and electronic dirges that pass for underscore in TV drama. In fact I >> >actually prefer a cow's ass to any of these. >> > >> >A. >> > >> >Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland) >> >Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk >> >Business: studio@adios.co.uk >> >http://www.adios.co.uk >> > > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 19:07:09 -0400 From: "Anthony J. Heins" To: Trombones and related issues forum Subject: Re: Playing left-handed Message-ID: <3919EB9D.C980A67A@stratos.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit West Coasters, Did I hear that Hoyt Bohannon played left handed? If he did, too bad, he probably could have gotten steady work in Hollywood. And to think he ended up in his garage! T.H. Closetbn@aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 5/10/2000 9:33:05 AM Pacific Daylight Time, > kdowdy@oppd.com writes: > > << Is this true? The only "great" player that I know that plays left > handed is Slide Hampton, and I don't think he plays classical at all. In > fact, the only other trombonists that I have ever seen play left handed are > a couple of 5th graders that had not had their first lesson yet. > > Anyway, this brings up a subject that I have wanted to ask about for > quite some time. In my area, kids start out with straight tenor trombones. > Some kids are naturally left handed, and it seems to me that it would > facilitate one's trombone playing if one were allowed to play in the manner > most comfortable to them. However, I (and others) have all the kids play > right handed because when they get to high grades (depending on the school), > some bozo is going to insist that they get a trombone with an F attachment. > I have not played one left handed, but it does not look like it would be > very comfortable. It seems like a lot depends on the band director. Those > that are classical minded tend to be very dogmatic and try to pound the kid > into a certain mould. The Jazz minded teachers tend to stress sound and > creativity much more, and quite frankly could not care less WHAT you are > playing or how, as long as it sounds good. My natural tendency is toward > the latter, and if it were up to me, I would have a lefty play left and a > righty play right, but I don't want to "ruin" the next Joe Aleisi (not that > he would be taking lessons from me anyway). I would be interested in other > people's opinions on this matter. > > KSD > >> > > I think I remember Slide Hampton saying that he played left-handed because > nobody had shown him how to put a trombone together, so he just taught > himself. Remember that most French Horn players are right-handed and are > playing what is essentially a left-handed instrument - so I don't see how > it's going to slow down left-handed trombone students that much if they learn > to play right-handed. Also, pianists and percussionists have pretty equal > facility with either hand. Come to think of it, string-players are doing > some pretty complicated work with their left hand as well. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 19:33:07 -0500 From: "Tom Izzo" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Presence of greatness? Message-ID: <00df01bfbae0$7ae91700$7675dfd0@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > > Mark wrote regarding his Bach trombone: > > > > "It was played in the presence of Christian > > Lindberg and Charles Vernon at Michigan State > > University." > > My father has THE axe that George Washington used > to chop down the cherry tree. Guaranteed to be > authentic! I've asked him to leave it to me in his > will. It's had the head replaced once and the > handle replaced twice, but it's THE REAL THING! hahahahahahaahah SURE!!!!!!! What about that axe is original, anymore.?? Listen folks, I've had the extreme pleasure of e-mailing with ALL OF YOU on the Trombone-L for the past 5 years. I've also MET a lot of you in person, during & before that time. That's my big claim to "fame". And I'm still (like every other human being) only worth about 98 cents (US). It's a pleasure to participate in this forum, but it doesn't improve my worth, just my outlook. Tom From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 16:49:17 -0700 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <026f01bfbada$5dc08c40$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Orchestra Managers that don't know a trombone or any instrument from a hole in the ground ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba: Sequoia Winds and Visalia, CA British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg,CA, City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 17:59:41 -0700 From: "Les Benedict" To: "Trombone List" Subject: Re: Music Thoughts for the Soul! Message-ID: <00ed01bfbae4$312855a0$f96d1d26@LesBenedict> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have enjoyed this thread and would like to share this thought from Dr. Lewis Thomas [ _The Medusa and the Snail_ ,The Viking Press, New York,1979], in his essay, "The Youngest and Brightest Thing Around." "...I believe fervently in our species and have no patience with the current fashion of running down the human being as a useful part of nature. On the contrary, we are a spectacular, splendid manifestation of life. We have language and can build metaphors as skillfully and precisely as ribosomes make proteins. We have affection. We have genes for usefulness, and usefulness is about as close to a 'common goal' for all of nature as I can guess at. And finally, and perhaps best of all, we have music. Any species capable of producing, at this earliest, juvenile stage of its development -- almost instantly after emerging on the earth by any evolutionary standard -- the music of Johann Sebastian Bach, cannot be all bad." Les Benedict lesbenedict@earthlink.net http://expage.com/page/goldrushband From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 22:03:43 -0400 From: "Wesley Jacobs" To: "Trombone List" Subject: Arban for Trombone Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit There WILL be a new Arban Complete Method for Trombone by Mr. Joseph Alessi. The book is due to be released in late June or early July, 2000. I have been receiving mail and telephone calls with questions concerning the book, its release date and other details. You may NOT order the book at this time. The details: An all new and very complete Arban's. 394 pages. This will be the first really complete Arban book for Trombone. It includes ALL of the Arban method and the Solos, Art of Phrasing, Duets, etc. etc. etc. The text for Trombone is by Mr. Joseph Alessi, Principal Trombone of the New York Philharmonic. There is also a complete text for Euphonium by the renowned soloist Dr. Brian Bowman. I will announce the release date on this list as soon as that date becomes known to me. Also, you may watch our website for information (there is NO information there--about the Arban Trombone book--at this time). http://www.encoremupub.com Thanks Wes Jacobs Encore Music Publishers From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 21:32:13 -0500 From: LEICHSENRINM@wartburg.edu To: TROMBONE-L@LISTS.MISSOURI.edu Subject: Wolfpak cases Message-ID: <000510213213.2326d591@wartburg.edu> hola list people, Does anyone have a Wolfpak case or know of anystores (in the U.S.) that has one on hand? I had ordered one from WW & BW in January(they said they were definately getting them in even though Wolfpak was being bought out...liars! ) and now i'm out of luck. Any help on this is greatly appreciated. Reply directly unless you think that others might want the same info. Thanks in advance. Matt Leichsenring Wartburg College From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 19:54:58 -0700 From: " Dan Cloutier" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Alabama results Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Language: en Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit On Wed, 10 May 2000 11:12:07 Posaune9 wrote: >Supposedly the orchestra has asked the current >principal to play one more season. There >should be another audition next year. Mm-hmm. So, the current Principal Trombonist is good enough to play with the Alabama Symphony for yet another year (making a total of three?), but not good enough to play with them for a career? Personally, I think he oughta tell 'em to take a flying leap. --== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- Before you buy. From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 22:10:05 -0500 From: "Adolphus Sprott" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: Re: Alabama results Message-ID: <000801bfbaf6$6f549ac0$3bf6490c@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Was he asked by the orchestra to leave? -----Original Message----- From: Dan Cloutier To: Trombones and related issues forum. Date: Wednesday, May 10, 2000 9:57 PM Subject: Re: Alabama results >On Wed, 10 May 2000 11:12:07 Posaune9 wrote: >>Supposedly the orchestra has asked the current >principal to play one more season. There >should be another audition next year. > > > >Mm-hmm. So, the current Principal Trombonist is good enough to play with the Alabama Symphony for yet another year (making a total of three?), but not good enough to play with them for a career? Personally, I think he oughta tell 'em to take a flying leap. > > > > > > >--== Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ ==-- >Before you buy. > From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:38 2000 Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 00:21:28 -0500 From: "Tom Izzo" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: left arm pain Message-ID: <01cd01bfbb08$c374afc0$7675dfd0@oemcomputer> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > You typed: > Anyway, this brings up a subject that I have wanted to ask about for > quite some time. In my area, kids start out with straight tenor trombones. > Some kids are naturally left handed, and it seems to me that it would > facilitate one's trombone playing if one were allowed to play in the manner > most comfortable to them. However, I (and others) have all the kids play > right handed because when they get to high grades (depending on the school), > some bozo is going to insist that they get a trombone with an F attachment. Are you sure? I've heard most directors say LARGE BORE, assuming F attach, but not specifically attachment-specific. > I have not played one left handed, but it does not look like it would be > very comfortable. There are several people that adapt F attachments for left handers. Todd Clontz, being one of them But, yes, normal F attachments are played with the left hand. Tom From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:39 2000 Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 00:23:13 -0400 From: "Nanette L. Kappus" To: joetuba@lightspeed.net Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: My pet hates Message-ID: <391A35B1.7640CF8A@eznet.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi Joe, "Managers" is the key word here. Too bad they aren't musicians huh? Nanette BiNaK 495 "Joe L. Norcross" wrote: > Orchestra Managers that don't know a trombone or any instrument from a hole > in the ground > ______________________________________ > Joe L. Norcross > Tuba: Sequoia Winds and Visalia, CA British Brass Band > Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg,CA, City Band > joetuba@lightspeed.net From ???@??? Fri May 12 08:13:39 2000 Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 00:16:09 -0500 From: Mike Coyle To: "Les Benedict" Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Music Thoughts for the Soul! Message-ID: <200005110516.AAA13490@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Really great quotation, Les, thanks. I was listening to Gould play the English Suites earlier today and at one point it occurred to me again (for the millionth time) that Bach, unlike most human beings, achieved perfection regularly. MC At 07:59 PM 5/10/00 , you wrote: >I have enjoyed this thread and would like to share this thought from Dr. >Lewis Thomas [ _The Medusa and the Snail_ ,The Viking Press, New York,1979], >in his essay, "The Youngest and Brightest Thing Around." > >"...I believe fervently in our species and have no patience with the current >fashion of running down the human being as a useful part of nature. On the >contrary, we are a spectacular, splendid manifestation of life. We have >language and can build metaphors as skillfully and precisely as ribosomes >make proteins. We have affection. We have genes for usefulness, and >usefulness is about as close to a 'common goal' for all of nature as I can >guess at. And finally, and perhaps best of all, we have music. Any species >capable of producing, at this earliest, juvenile stage of its development -- >almost instantly after emerging on the earth by any evolutionary standard -- >the music of Johann Sebastian Bach, cannot be all bad." > >Les Benedict >lesbenedict@earthlink.net >http://expage.com/page/goldrushband >