TROMBONE-L Digest 1633

Topics covered in this issue include:

  1) Singing and playing
	by "Jerry Hou" <jhou49@hotmail.com>
  2) Classical music quotes
	by "Dick Sleeman" <d.sleeman@hccnet.nl>
  3) Re:George Roberts Models
	by MikeSuter@aol.com
  4) slide positions/vibrato
	by David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
  5) Blessing B88
	by David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
  6) Re: Playing sharp
	by Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
  7) finger "tips"
	by David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
  8) George Roberts models
	by David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
  9) Re: Playing sharp
	by Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
 10) Re: Blessing B88
	by "Douglas Kilen" <dkilen@pressenter.com>
 11) Recital in the Chicago Area
	by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu>
 12) Re: Classical Music Quotes
	by Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
 13) Re: Playing Sharp
	by Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
 14) Re:Singing and Playing
	by Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
 15) RE: Classical music quotes
	by "Wessner, John" <jwessner@towson.edu>
 16) Singing and playing
	by Roger Karren <rkarren@s-vision.com>
 17) RE: Singing and playing
	by "Richardson, Tim" <richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL>
 18) picture of young George Roberts
	by Charles <chardy@totcon.com>
 19) Re: Singing and playing
	by Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
 20) Re: Playing Sharp
	by Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
 21) RE: Tempesto? Hurricaneo????
	by Eric Burger <burger2go@compuserve.com>
 22) RE: Singing and playing
	by "Daniel Pliskin" <daniel_pliskin@hotmail.com>
 23) Re: George Roberts models
	by "Paul Hill" <pdhill@email.msn.com>
 24) Great Horns I have Sold
	by Thomas Nelson <TNelson@tipton.k12.ia.us>
 25) Warm Breath - Small Aperture
	by David Fetter <davidf@peabody.jhu.edu>
 26) Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
	by Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
 27) RB double trombone bag review
	by SFTrombone@aol.com
 28) Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
	by "Stewart M. Crane" <smcrane@esper.com>
 29) Brahms 4 and Bach
	by Douglas Yeo <yeo@yeodoug.com>
 30) Re: Classical Music Quotes
	by AlRobnett@aol.com
 31) Re: 1998 Julliard Trombone Choir?
	by Larry & Carol Bronisz <bronisz@trail.com>
 32) Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
	by Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
 33) (no subject)
	by Tbcwes@aol.com
 34) Galliard Sonatas
	by "Bryce McGrew" <brycemc@jps.net>
 35) Re: Galliard Sonatas
	by Atlbrvsnt@aol.com
 36) Workloads in music schools
	by Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
 37) Re: Finger on the bell
	by "Adrian Drover" <slide.rule@adios.co.uk>
 38) Re: jazz/improv
	by "Adrian Drover" <slide.rule@adios.co.uk>
 39) Mute matters
	by "Sharon Rustemier" <sharon_rustemier@lineone.net>
 40) Re: Workloads in music schools
	by Angie Brunk <angie@cybersolvers.com>




From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 05:06:04 PST
From: "Jerry Hou" <jhou49@hotmail.com>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Singing and playing
Message-ID: <20000323130604.14150.qmail@hotmail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

<x-flowed>Listers,

I need some advice and help. I have a beginner student who has equated 
singing with playing. Everytime he plays, he sings the pitches he plays as 
well as playing them on his horn. He has a lot of tension in his throat as a 
result of it. I've tried everything I can think of to get him to simply blow 
and not use his throat/voice in any manner. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Jerry Hou
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com


</x-flowed>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 14:09:48 +0100
From: "Dick Sleeman" <d.sleeman@hccnet.nl>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum" <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Classical music quotes
Message-ID: <007d01bf94c9$53122a60$057dadc1@dick>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Listmates,

The following might have been on the list before but being a member for only a short time, I wouldn't know.  I am interested in quotes of melodies or parts thereof from the realm of classical music into jazz music. Not like the rendering of Debussy's Afternoon of a Faun by Jack Teagarden, but like Bobby Hacket's "The Lamp is Low" on his "With Strings" series: "A Time for Love".

"The Lamp is Low" is credited to P. DeRose, B Shefter and M. Parish with no reference to the actual composer of the melody, Ravel. For the first 2X8 bars are an exact quote from his "Pavane pour une Infante DŽfunte", including the key. 

Anyone out there who could add more examples?

Dick Sleeman, Lelystad, Holland.


















From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:15:45 EST
From: MikeSuter@aol.com
To: ddsbstrb@cfanet.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Re:George Roberts Models
Message-ID: <a.1d28f7c.260b7301@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi Guys,

<< . . . George was a clinician for Olds for a while in the 1960's, he also 
played a George Roberts- Holton Bass Trombone for a while in the 70's, might 
have used a Yamaha Single Valve for a while, and went back to Conn in the 
1990's. >>

And for a very short period between the Holton and Yamaha (2 or 3 months), he 
played an open wrap Bach. 

BTW, the Holton he played, the TR183, complete with the 9" bell, is still in 
the Holton catalog.

MS




From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:21:31 -0500 (EST)
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Cc: basstbn@waageworks.com
Subject: slide positions/vibrato
Message-ID: <385114255.953817691835.JavaMail.root@web112-wrb.mail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Chris Waage wrote ... Why mark the slide positions? Any string player could tell you that you use vibrato to cover the fact you have no idea what note you're playing . . . .
 
Chris:

This reminds me very much of a singer I played bass guitar for in the late 60s. he had no concept of pitch. On ballads, he would cinsistently hit the not almost a half step flat, then slide up until he found the note and use vibrato like crazy. He called it style. I still cringe when I hear our tapes.

Dave Molter
 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:50:38 -0500 (EST)
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Cc: dkilen@pressenter.com
Subject: Blessing B88
Message-ID: <381925696.953819438811.JavaMail.root@web31.pub01>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

For Doug Kilen and anyone else considering the Blessing B88:

I have experience with both the B88 and the King 3B. They are quite different animals. Doug, you didn't say if you've ever played a large bore horn, but if you're coming over to a large bore from the 3B -- especially a 3B VALVE bone -- be ready for a shock.  The Blessing will take more air and, if you're like me, your upper range (above G, three lines above the bass clef staff) will disappear for a while until your chops adjust. The large bore also demands maximum efficiency in air use. 

That said, here are some facts about the Blessing: For roughly $750, it is a very good large bore horn.  I had the open wrap, but I've also played a closed wrap version and I've found it to play just as well as the open. Finish was flawless, but I found the valve linkage to be noisy no matter what I did.  The slide worked fine out of the box for about three days but then gummed up so badly that I finally had to have it aligned and chemically treated locally (I bought it from Woodwind & Brasswind). I found the B88 slide heavy compared to a Conn 88H, but not nearly so heavy overall as the King 4B and 5B (heavier but better balanced). You may have noticed that I'm referring to the B88 in the past tense -- that's because I sold it after about six months and bought a King 3B-F. This was only my giving in to the fact that I didn't have the time to spend to rebuild my range (or so I thought. ) In general, I found the 4B to be better made, better balanced and more pleasing to the ear !
(brighter yet darker sound at the same time, which seems impossible but is true). I now play a 5B for large bore, which I like even better than the 4B.

After struggling to make the Blessing play high (it ws NOT the fault of the horn), I switched to the 3B-F concert. This was a nice change because it allowed me to pop high notes and matched well with the horns in my wind ensemble, all of which are small bores. I used that as my main horn until about six weeks ago, when I picked up a used Bach 36BO (medium bore).  The Bach has solved 95% of my problems and meets 99% of my needs. It has more guts than the 3B and isn't as stuffy.  It's actually easier to play high on the the Bach than on the 3B, despite the larger bore. About the only negative thing I can say about the Bach is that it doesn't do well when asked to work as a bass bone, which is to be expected. But I have the 5B for that if needed.

The best advice I can offer is to try the Blessing before you buy, especially if you're thinking of making the move to large bore full time. Be prepared to woodshed on it until your range reappears -- and it WILL. If you're willing to spend a bit more, you might be able to shake loose a new Conn 88H for about $1000 if you know where to look. Unless you will be ostracized by the large bore crowd you play with, you might also look into the King 607F or 608F, both .525 bore horns that cost about as much as the Blessing.  Conn also just came out with the 52H, a large bore tenor witha a .525/.547 slide that I haven't played but is probably better made than the Blessing. And of course there's the Bach 36B, whcih will be more expensive than any of the other mid bores but just about as much as an 88H.

If you don't need the trigger but would like a slightly darker sound from you 3B, I'd suggest getting a slide for it (I'm pretty sure a stock 2B slide will work as well, but I may be wrong)  and trying either the Stork or Bach Megatone mouthpieces. The Megatone will defintely cut some of the edge off the 3B. The Stork also will darken the tone but will have less effect overall than the Megatone.

Dave Molter
Pittsburgh, PA

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:35 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:54:20 -0500 (EST)
From: Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
To: SFTrombone@aol.com
Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Playing sharp
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000323083140.18652B-100000@kate.ucs.indiana.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

You have to consider that there are situations where you _would_ play
usually "out of tune" notes like the 5th, 6th, and 7th partials in
"regular" positions.  Like when you're playing lip slurs whose key is
clearly the same as the fundamental of the position you're using.  Lots of
people adjust for each note in lip slurs that clearly tonicize Bb (for
ex.), but (unless the horn has major pitch discrepancies b/t overtones),
according to just intonation, all of those the notes would be pretty much
in tune if you didn't adjust at all.  Add to this the fact that in bands
BbMA is a pretty popular key as well.  Also consider the Tuba Mirum
situation: in the first arpeggiated figure the V7 (Bb D F Ab) chord of
EbMA is clearly intended. Now Bb is the fundamental of 1st position, and,
theoretically, you shouldn't have to adjust at all (even play the infamous
Ab (the 7th) in first!) because all of the justly tempered intervals are
inherent to the instrument if the key corresponds with the fundamental
of whatever position you are using. However, I think many people are used
to hearing that Ab (horrendously) sharp and would probably do a 
double-take if they heard it justly tuned (or, horror of horrors, saw
someone play the Ab in 1st!).

Just a few thoughts to ponder-
Beth Lewis

On Thu, 23 Mar 2000 SFTrombone@aol.com wrote:

> This has been covered before, but I thought I might post a little about the 
> harmonic series and extended poisitions.  
> 
> When I hear a trombonist playing a bit sharp, I often see that they aren't 
> really playing with accurate positions.  It's easy to get into the habit of 
> playing 5th, 6th, or 7th a little sharp in order to avoid having to reach 
> farther than might be comfortable.  We have to remember that these positions 
> are longer than we'd like, so we have to get used to it and REACH.
> 
> Also, many players play 1st position all the way in.  That may work for 
> students, but as we improve our playing, we must play more accurately in 
> tune, and we must remember that the harmonic series is not exactly in tune, 
> so each partial must be adjusted accordingly, even when in 1st position.  For 
> example, F above middle C is quite sharp on most horns, so if you play it all 
> the way in, you won't be very in tune.  Remember in the method books when it 
> says that D above middle C can be played in 1st or flat 4th?  Well, that flat 
> 4th is in the same partial as the 1st position F above it, so if you play D 
> flat 4th, play flat 3rd, 2nd, and 1st for the notes above it in that partial 
> too.
> 
> Also, D above middle C in 1st position tends to be a little flat, so if all 
> the other 1st position notes are all the way in, the D can't be easily played 
> in tune.  I make a point of playing with extended positions; that is, all 1st 
> positions are a bit out so all can be adjusted either way if needed.  My "1st 
> position roadmap" might look something like this, though it's different on 
> each of my horns:
> 
> Starting from highest to lowest, showing amount of slide extension in 1st 
> position:
> 
> D +1/4"
> C +1/2"
> Bb +1/2"
> F +1"+
> D +1/4"
> Bb +1/2"
> F +1"
> Bb +1/2"
> Bb (pedal) +1/2"
> 
> Notice, all the Bb's are about the same place, the F's are a bit out, and the 
> D's are in a little.  As usual, your mileage (and horn) may vary.  But, give 
> it a try.  Push your tuning crook in about 1/2", or even all the way, and 
> just continue to play in tune by playing longer positions overall, and 
> listen. And of course, no fingers touching the bell.  Hope it gives some food 
> for thought.  All the best,
> 
> Steve Ferguson
> 
> 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:56:43 -0500 (EST)
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: finger "tips"
Message-ID: <385111678.953819803216.JavaMail.root@web112-wrb.mail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Pete Soukup wrote ... 
   
  I took some tin snips and removed the portion of
   the bell ..


Darn! I took some tin snips and removed the tip of my finger. Why didn't you post sooner????

Dave Molter
Pittsburgh, PA
 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:00:52 -0500 (EST)
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: George Roberts models
Message-ID: <381014393.953820052270.JavaMail.root@web30.pub01>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

>From what I have gleaned in reading the Trombone-L archives, George Roberts played mostly the Conn 70H, but also commissioned a George Roberts Model Olds and, when Yamaha introduced it single trigger bass, Roberts apparently adverstised for tyhem saying that it was basically the same horn as the 70H. If you visit Tony Brusseau's website (www.brusseau.com) and search the Trombone-L archives for George Roberts, you'll find the things I found.

Dave Molter
Pittsburgh, PA
 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:02:37 -0500 (EST)
From: Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Playing sharp
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000323090106.18652C-100000@kate.ucs.indiana.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII



On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Beth Lewis wrote:

> You have to consider that there are situations where you _would_ play
> usually "out of tune" notes like the 5th, 6th, and 7th partials in
> "regular" positions.  Like when you're playing lip slurs whose key is
> clearly the same as the fundamental of the position you're using.  Lots of
> people adjust for each note in lip slurs that clearly tonicize Bb (for
> ex.), but (unless the horn has major pitch discrepancies b/t overtones),
> according to just intonation, all of those the notes would be pretty much
> in tune if you didn't adjust at all.  Add to this the fact that in bands
> BbMA is a pretty popular key as well.  Also consider the Tuba Mirum
> situation: in the first arpeggiated figure the V7 (Bb D F Ab) chord of
> EbMA is clearly intended. 

Sorry, I should have wrote "in the second arpeggio of the trombone part"

Beth
Now Bb is the fundamental of 1st position, and,
> theoretically, you shouldn't have to adjust at all (even play the infamous
> Ab (the 7th) in first!) because all of the justly tempered intervals are
> inherent to the instrument if the key corresponds with the fundamental
> of whatever position you are using. However, I think many people are used
> to hearing that Ab (horrendously) sharp and would probably do a 
> double-take if they heard it justly tuned (or, horror of horrors, saw
> someone play the Ab in 1st!).
> 
> Just a few thoughts to ponder-
> Beth Lewis
> 
> On Thu, 23 Mar 2000 SFTrombone@aol.com wrote:
> 
> > This has been covered before, but I thought I might post a little about the 
> > harmonic series and extended poisitions.  
> > 
> > When I hear a trombonist playing a bit sharp, I often see that they aren't 
> > really playing with accurate positions.  It's easy to get into the habit of 
> > playing 5th, 6th, or 7th a little sharp in order to avoid having to reach 
> > farther than might be comfortable.  We have to remember that these positions 
> > are longer than we'd like, so we have to get used to it and REACH.
> > 
> > Also, many players play 1st position all the way in.  That may work for 
> > students, but as we improve our playing, we must play more accurately in 
> > tune, and we must remember that the harmonic series is not exactly in tune, 
> > so each partial must be adjusted accordingly, even when in 1st position.  For 
> > example, F above middle C is quite sharp on most horns, so if you play it all 
> > the way in, you won't be very in tune.  Remember in the method books when it 
> > says that D above middle C can be played in 1st or flat 4th?  Well, that flat 
> > 4th is in the same partial as the 1st position F above it, so if you play D 
> > flat 4th, play flat 3rd, 2nd, and 1st for the notes above it in that partial 
> > too.
> > 
> > Also, D above middle C in 1st position tends to be a little flat, so if all 
> > the other 1st position notes are all the way in, the D can't be easily played 
> > in tune.  I make a point of playing with extended positions; that is, all 1st 
> > positions are a bit out so all can be adjusted either way if needed.  My "1st 
> > position roadmap" might look something like this, though it's different on 
> > each of my horns:
> > 
> > Starting from highest to lowest, showing amount of slide extension in 1st 
> > position:
> > 
> > D +1/4"
> > C +1/2"
> > Bb +1/2"
> > F +1"+
> > D +1/4"
> > Bb +1/2"
> > F +1"
> > Bb +1/2"
> > Bb (pedal) +1/2"
> > 
> > Notice, all the Bb's are about the same place, the F's are a bit out, and the 
> > D's are in a little.  As usual, your mileage (and horn) may vary.  But, give 
> > it a try.  Push your tuning crook in about 1/2", or even all the way, and 
> > just continue to play in tune by playing longer positions overall, and 
> > listen. And of course, no fingers touching the bell.  Hope it gives some food 
> > for thought.  All the best,
> > 
> > Steve Ferguson
> > 
> > 
> 
> 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:28:48 -0600
From: "Douglas Kilen" <dkilen@pressenter.com>
To: <kingbone@earthlink.net>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Blessing B88
Message-ID: <004401bf94d4$1c261a60$2112e0d1@mark>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

THANK YOU for the letting me know what your experience with this horn has
been.  Actually, I primarily play euphonium and bass trombone, so I'm pretty
used to the larger bores.  Lately, I find myself playing more tenor trombone
in jazz band, orchestra, and trombone quartet.  The 3B valve is a lot of
fun, but it just doesn't blend well with slide trombones.  I've got an old
reynolds medalist and an older cleveland superior, but frankly they just
don't cut it.  I picked up this 3B really cheap hoping to find a slide for
it that would fit my budget, but that's beginning to look like wishful
thinking.  I'm considering putting my 3B up for sale or trade or possibly
ebay, to get into a better slide trombone.  Anyone interested?  I've since
played a B88 and realized that it's an awesome student horn, but just not
quite what I need.
Douglas Kilen
Superior, WI
----- Original Message -----
From: "David Molter" <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 7:50 AM
Subject: Blessing B88


> For Doug Kilen and anyone else considering the Blessing B88:
>
> I have experience with both the B88 and the King 3B. They are quite
different animals. Doug, you didn't say if you've ever played a large bore
horn, but if you're coming over to a large bore from the 3B -- especially a
3B VALVE bone -- be ready for a shock.  The Blessing will take more air and,
if you're like me, your upper range (above G, three lines above the bass
clef staff) will disappear for a while until your chops adjust. The large
bore also demands maximum efficiency in air use.
>
> That said, here are some facts about the Blessing: For roughly $750, it is
a very good large bore horn.  I had the open wrap, but I've also played a
closed wrap version and I've found it to play just as well as the open.
Finish was flawless, but I found the valve linkage to be noisy no matter
what I did.  The slide worked fine out of the box for about three days but
then gummed up so badly that I finally had to have it aligned and chemically
treated locally (I bought it from Woodwind & Brasswind). I found the B88
slide heavy compared to a Conn 88H, but not nearly so heavy overall as the
King 4B and 5B (heavier but better balanced). You may have noticed that I'm
referring to the B88 in the past tense -- that's because I sold it after
about six months and bought a King 3B-F. This was only my giving in to the
fact that I didn't have the time to spend to rebuild my range (or so I
thought. ) In general, I found the 4B to be better made, better balanced and
more pleasing to the ear !
> (brighter yet darker sound at the same time, which seems impossible but is
true). I now play a 5B for large bore, which I like even better than the 4B.
>
> After struggling to make the Blessing play high (it ws NOT the fault of
the horn), I switched to the 3B-F concert. This was a nice change because it
allowed me to pop high notes and matched well with the horns in my wind
ensemble, all of which are small bores. I used that as my main horn until
about six weeks ago, when I picked up a used Bach 36BO (medium bore).  The
Bach has solved 95% of my problems and meets 99% of my needs. It has more
guts than the 3B and isn't as stuffy.  It's actually easier to play high on
the the Bach than on the 3B, despite the larger bore. About the only
negative thing I can say about the Bach is that it doesn't do well when
asked to work as a bass bone, which is to be expected. But I have the 5B for
that if needed.
>
> The best advice I can offer is to try the Blessing before you buy,
especially if you're thinking of making the move to large bore full time. Be
prepared to woodshed on it until your range reappears -- and it WILL. If
you're willing to spend a bit more, you might be able to shake loose a new
Conn 88H for about $1000 if you know where to look. Unless you will be
ostracized by the large bore crowd you play with, you might also look into
the King 607F or 608F, both .525 bore horns that cost about as much as the
Blessing.  Conn also just came out with the 52H, a large bore tenor witha a
.525/.547 slide that I haven't played but is probably better made than the
Blessing. And of course there's the Bach 36B, whcih will be more expensive
than any of the other mid bores but just about as much as an 88H.
>
> If you don't need the trigger but would like a slightly darker sound from
you 3B, I'd suggest getting a slide for it (I'm pretty sure a stock 2B slide
will work as well, but I may be wrong)  and trying either the Stork or Bach
Megatone mouthpieces. The Megatone will defintely cut some of the edge off
the 3B. The Stork also will darken the tone but will have less effect
overall than the Megatone.
>
> Dave Molter
> Pittsburgh, PA
>


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:25:10 -0600
From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu>
To: "'trombone-l'" <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Recital in the Chicago Area
Message-ID: <E6199363662DD31182E600A024488B2649228E@marshall.jmls.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain


>                           RECITAL
>              MEMBERS OF THE PRAIRIE BRASS BAND
>                   DAVID GUION, TROMBONE
>                   CROZET DUPLANTIER, TUBA
>                  THE PRAIRIE BRASS QUINTET
> 
>  Performing music of Bassett, Berghmans, Calvert, Gregson,
>             Grondahl,  Rachmaninoff, and Vivaldi
> 
>                      SATURDAY, APRIL 1
>                           8:00 PM
>                              AT
>                     THE BEAUTIFUL SOUND
>                    120 BURR RIDGE PARKWAY
>                          BURR RIDGE
> 
===============

The Beautiful Sound is located just south of the County Line Rd. exit off 
I-55. Going south on County Line Rd., turn left (east) on Burr Ridge Parkway
(which, I think, is the first traffic light). The Beautiful Sound is located
near the east end of the first strip mall on the south side of the street.
It's been a couple of years since I have been in that direction, so I don't
remember what else is in the area, but it's not hard to find.

^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^
David Guion, Cataloger
John Marshall Law School
315 S. Plymouth Ct.
Chicago, IL   60604
Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552  Fax; (312) 427-8307

"Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog,
it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx

^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^



From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:32:46 -0500
From: Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Classical Music Quotes
Message-ID: <38DA2B07.C5B8D3BF@bestweb.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit



Dick Sleeman wrote:

> Listmates,
>
> The following might have been on the list before but being a member for only a short time, I wouldn't know.  I am interested in quotes of melodies or parts thereof from the realm of classical music into jazz music. Not like the rendering of Debussy's Afternoon of a Faun by Jack Teagarden, but like Bobby Hacket's "The Lamp is Low" on his "With Strings" series: "A Time for Love".
>
> "The Lamp is Low" is credited to P. DeRose, B Shefter and M. Parish with no reference to the actual composer of the melody, Ravel. For the first 2X8 bars are an exact quote from his "Pavane pour une Infante DŽfunte", including the key.
>
> Anyone out there who could add more examples?
>
> Dick Sleeman, Lelystad, Holland.

Dick-
A few tunes came to mind, like "Stranger in Paradise", based on one of the Polovetsian Dances by Borodin, Billy Joel "wrote" a tune called (I think) "This Night Is Mine" which is from the slow mvt. of Beethoven's Pathetique Sonata. And who could forget Elvis Presley's "I Can't Help Falling In Love With You", the A section of which is the immortal "Plaisir d'Amore"by the equally
immortal composer, Padre Giovanni Battista Martini. (Hmmm, a priest writing a song about the Pleasures of Love...???) Thinking back to "Stranger in Paradise", I think that it was from a show, "Kismet", which is all Borodin tunes!
Walter Barrett
Yamaha Artist/Clinician


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:08:13 -0500
From: Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Playing Sharp
Message-ID: <38DA3353.7D0B1BFD@bestweb.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit



Beth Lewis wrote:

>  However, I think many people are used
> to hearing that Ab (horrendously) sharp and would probably do a
> double-take if they heard it justly tuned (or, horror of horrors, saw
> someone play the Ab in 1st!).
>

Folks-
When I went to ITW in Nashville back in 1983 (Gee, that makes me sound like an old
fart!), I had the pleasure of hearing Rudy Josel from the Vienna Philharmonic give
a recital and lecture/demo. According to Rudy, a LOT of European players use the
first position Ab, and lip it up. (He did it in his recital, which was how the
topic came up.) He said that he did it a lot, but NOT when he was tired. I have a
student who uses first position Ab on the fast Bb7 arpeggios in the David
Concertino, but does them in the "normal" positions for slower stuff. (This kid
got a NYSSMA Level 6 rating of 98 out of 100 on his first ever audition! I don't
teach him as much as point him in the right direction...)
Remember what Duke Ellington said- "If it sounds good, it IS good!"

Walter Barrett
Yamaha Artist/Clinician


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:26:49 -0500
From: Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re:Singing and Playing
Message-ID: <38DA37AC.92DF61EF@bestweb.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii; x-mac-type="54455854"; x-mac-creator="4D4F5353"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit



Jerry Hou wrote:

> Listers,
>
> I need some advice and help. I have a beginner student who has equated
> singing with playing. Everytime he plays, he sings the pitches he plays as
> well as playing them on his horn. He has a lot of tension in his throat as a
> result of it. I've tried everything I can think of to get him to simply blow
> and not use his throat/voice in any manner. Any suggestions?
>
> Thanks,
> Jerry Hou
>

Jerry-
It sounds like this kid is stuck doing what Doctors and Arnold Jacobs call the
"Valsalva Maneuver". (Sounds like a Star Trek title...) You take a deep breath,
close your throat and push. Some of my students did this until I explained that
there are only two reasons for doing this: Giving birth, or Defecating. If you
do it while playing, it sounds like you're going potty. (Sorry, I have a 3 year
old, it rubs off on you...) Sometimes, the explanation is all it takes. You
might also try having him inhale and exhale through a 3/4-1 inch hard plastic
tube, to experience what an open throat is supposed to feel like. Once he's got
that, move on to inhaling with the tube, then buzzing on the mpce. Don't let
him store up the air, e.g. take a breath, wait, wait, wait, then play. It
should be- Inhale, Buzz, with NO pause.

Hope this helps,
Walter Barrett
Yamaha Artist/Clinician


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:42:59 -0500
From: "Wessner, John" <jwessner@towson.edu>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: RE: Classical music quotes
Message-ID: <38074DD5B6CCD2119C8F0000D11C17BD024C08E7@exchange.towson.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

For the record (maybe):  "The Lamp is Low" was the primary theme in movie
starring Kim Novak called "Bell, Book, and Candle."  I saw it when I was in
my teens and I'm still madly inflamed by her!
john w.

-----Original Message-----
From: Dick Sleeman [mailto:d.sleeman@hccnet.nl]
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 8:10 AM
To: Trombones and related issues forum.
Subject: Classical music quotes


Listmates,

The following might have been on the list before but being a member for only
a short time, I wouldn't know.  I am interested in quotes of melodies or
parts thereof from the realm of classical music into jazz music. Not like
the rendering of Debussy's Afternoon of a Faun by Jack Teagarden, but like
Bobby Hacket's "The Lamp is Low" on his "With Strings" series: "A Time for
Love".

"The Lamp is Low" is credited to P. DeRose, B Shefter and M. Parish with no
reference to the actual composer of the melody, Ravel. For the first 2X8
bars are an exact quote from his "Pavane pour une Infante DŽfunte",
including the key. 

Anyone out there who could add more examples?

Dick Sleeman, Lelystad, Holland.

















From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:48:27 -0700
From: Roger Karren <rkarren@s-vision.com>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Singing and playing
Message-ID: <6E031E06378BD311AEF20090273CE1BA3E1577@el-postino.s-vision.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain

Wow!  Multi-phonics already?  Could this be a prodigy?

j/k

Roger

 -----Original Message-----
From: 	Jerry Hou [mailto:jhou49@hotmail.com] 
Sent:	Thursday, March 23, 2000 6:06 AM
To:	Trombones and related issues forum.
Subject:	Singing and playing

Listers,

I need some advice and help. I have a beginner student who has equated 
singing with playing. Everytime he plays, he sings the pitches he plays as 
well as playing them on his horn. He has a lot of tension in his throat as a

result of it. I've tried everything I can think of to get him to simply blow

and not use his throat/voice in any manner. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Jerry Hou
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:01:56 -0500
From: "Richardson, Tim" <richardt@LEE.ARMY.MIL>
To: "'rkarren@s-vision.com'" <rkarren@s-vision.com>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: RE: Singing and playing
Message-ID: <21E592FA8BA7D311B5B100062B001FE2082FA6@LEE2>

Must be, I can't sing at all.  or do I?
Nice to be back on the list after 3 weeks traveling.

Two thoughts (I've never been short of wacko theories):  One, he doesn't
hear himself.  I don't think the experienced folk on the list always
remember how hard it is for a beginner to hear his own sound, to include
whether he is singing or not.  I think this is worse for trombone because of
the way the bell is forward and off center from your ear.  If true, this
hinders his progress in other ways also.  You have to have the concept in
your head, but also compare the actual with the concept, and a fair number
of people can only hear one sound at a time - internal or external, but not
both.  The answer is probably good recordings - but that can be painful to a
beginner.  (also to me <grin>)  He can learn to feel the difference by
singing without buzzing (easy to do) and playing without singing (hard).
One way of doing the latter is having him play in a range he can't sing,
either too low or high.  Of course, this might just produce someone with a
phenomenal singing range.

Two, get him to a voice teacher and learn to sing with a relaxed throat.  If
he could do that, why would you care?

yours,
tim richardson

> -----Original Message-----
> From:	Roger Karren [SMTP:rkarren@s-vision.com]
> Sent:	Thursday, March 23, 2000 10:48 AM
> To:	Trombones and related issues forum.
> Subject:	Singing and playing
> 
> Wow!  Multi-phonics already?  Could this be a prodigy?
> 
> j/k
> 
> Roger
> 
>  -----Original Message-----
> From: 	Jerry Hou [mailto:jhou49@hotmail.com] 
> Sent:	Thursday, March 23, 2000 6:06 AM
> To:	Trombones and related issues forum.
> Subject:	Singing and playing
> 
> Listers,
> 
> I need some advice and help. I have a beginner student who has equated 
> singing with playing. Everytime he plays, he sings the pitches he plays as
> 
> well as playing them on his horn. He has a lot of tension in his throat as
> a
> 
> result of it. I've tried everything I can think of to get him to simply
> blow
> 
> and not use his throat/voice in any manner. Any suggestions?
> 
> Thanks,
> Jerry Hou
> ______________________________________________________
> Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:15:55 -0500
From: Charles <chardy@totcon.com>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: picture of young George Roberts
Message-ID: <1.5.4.32.20000323151555.006e7a88@totcon.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

: c:\eudora\attach\grobts.jpg

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 10:16:23 -0600
From: Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
To: Trombone-L <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Singing and playing
Message-ID: <v04220806b4fff33d5eaf@[206.52.159.95]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

<x-flowed>The odds are the kid is trying to force the sound from the instrument 
- I found myself doing this when I was in woodwind methods and 
couldn't make the *%&$ tenor saxophone play!

Here's an exercize I have used in the past for this one:

1.  Have him take a deep yawning breath, then exhale it onto the back 
of his hand.  The air will feel warm.
2.  Have him take another deep yawning breath, then exhale it through 
a very small apeture, or even free-buzzing onto the back of his hand. 
It will feel cold.
3.  Work for a combination of warm air/small apeture.

Chris

>  -----Original Message-----
>From: 	Jerry Hou [mailto:jhou49@hotmail.com]
>Sent:	Thursday, March 23, 2000 6:06 AM
>To:	Trombones and related issues forum.
>Subject:	Singing and playing
>
>Listers,
>
>I need some advice and help. I have a beginner student who has equated
>singing with playing. Everytime he plays, he sings the pitches he plays as
>well as playing them on his horn. He has a lot of tension in his throat as a
>
>result of it. I've tried everything I can think of to get him to simply blow
>
>and not use his throat/voice in any manner. Any suggestions?
>
>Thanks,
>Jerry Hou
>______________________________________________________
>Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

_____________________________________________
Chris Waage            basstbn@waageworks.com
       Visit The Mouthpiece Exchange at
          http://www.waageworks.com
_____________________________________________

</x-flowed>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 11:42:14 -0500 (EST)
From: Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
To: Walter Barrett <wbarrett@bestweb.net>
Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Playing Sharp
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000323112528.18652D-100000@kate.ucs.indiana.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Walter, 
I think you may have missed my point about situations where the flat 7th
partial would be desirable.  I don't have exact figures, but from what I
recall the 7th in a dominant 7th chord (like Bb D F Ab) is _supposed_ to
be flat by around 30% to really be in tune, approximately how flat that
partial (7th partial coincidentally) is on the horn (isn't the overtone
series great?). So theoretically if you wanted to play a truly in tune
minor 7th (like Ab over Bb) theoretically with notes like like Ab in
first, you wouldn't have to move the slide OR "lip up." Try it some time.
It definitely not something most people are accustomed to playing and
don't expect to hear (bad intonation has a way of establishing itself
after a long time), but it'll open up your ears.  The extemely
good intonation of groups like the CSO trombone section and countless
others would not be possible without a thorough knowledge of this system
of tuning.

Beth

On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Walter Barrett wrote:
> 
> Folks-
> When I went to ITW in Nashville back in 1983 (Gee, that makes me sound like an old
> fart!), I had the pleasure of hearing Rudy Josel from the Vienna Philharmonic give
> a recital and lecture/demo. According to Rudy, a LOT of European players use the
> first position Ab, and lip it up. (He did it in his recital, which was how the
> topic came up.) He said that he did it a lot, but NOT when he was tired. I have a
> student who uses first position Ab on the fast Bb7 arpeggios in the David
> Concertino, but does them in the "normal" positions for slower stuff. (This kid
> got a NYSSMA Level 6 rating of 98 out of 100 on his first ever audition! I don't
> teach him as much as point him in the right direction...)
> Remember what Duke Ellington said- "If it sounds good, it IS good!"
> 
> Walter Barrett
> Yamaha Artist/Clinician
> 
> 


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 21:33:18 +-100
From: Eric Burger <burger2go@compuserve.com>
To: "'Daniel Pliskin'" <daniel_pliskin@hotmail.com>,
        "trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu" <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: RE: Tempesto? Hurricaneo????
Message-ID: <01BF95BD.326683C0@fra-pci-lah-vty120.as.wcom.net>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

There are a few sections in the salsa tune (I'll try to keep this straight) 
1. Intro & body - these have names I forgot.
2. Coro - this is the 'chorus' - usually a repeated section that has a vocal refrain. 
3. Mambo - this is the first open section - usually new material or a solo - a change. The rhythm in the percussion changes on this section.
4. Mona (with a ~ over n -pronounced monya) another unique rhythmic section or solo. The rhythm in the percussion changes on this section
5. Montuna - a two or four bar harmonic section for solo or interlude.
6. Coda

Now the form is much looser than we play - some arrangements have coros repeated after every mambo, mona, etc. some have two different mambos , three mona - no coro... etc.
Eric




----------
From: 	Daniel Pliskin[SMTP:daniel_pliskin@hotmail.com]
Sent: 	Tuesday, March 21, 2000 10:50 PM
To: 	trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: 	Tempesto? Hurricaneo????

Dear list,

I was listening to an interview of a Cuban jazz player, who was talking 
about that particular form of jazz.  In United Statesian jazz, it's common 
for a group the play the head, do some jamming in 12-bar blues and only 
return to the head at the end of the piece.

In Cuban jazz, tunes are more likes to jam on a two or three chord riff, 
that I recall has a name that sounds like some sort of storm, with an "o" 
added to the end.  'Problem is, I can't, for the life of me, recall what 
storm that was.  Now, I know it wasn't a tornado, 'cause that already has an 
"o" at the end, but was it a "tempesto"?

Anyone know?

Thanks, in advance,

DanP

______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com





From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 09:12:14 PST
From: "Daniel Pliskin" <daniel_pliskin@hotmail.com>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: RE: Singing and playing
Message-ID: <20000323171214.86709.qmail@hotmail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed

<x-flowed>>One, he doesn't
>hear himself.

Have him wear ear plugs.  Singing comes in loud and clear with ear plugs.  
He'll also be able to hear his buzzing with ear plugs.

DanP
______________________________________________________
Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com


</x-flowed>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 08:27:07 -0900
From: "Paul Hill" <pdhill@email.msn.com>
To: <kingbone@earthlink.net>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: George Roberts models
Message-ID: <006001bf94ed$043363e0$eefafea9@navak-n01n>

I participated in a major music festival in 1976 in which George was the
featured artist.  At that time, he was endorsing the Olds P-24 and P-24G
(dual, in-line).

I purchased a P-24G in 1977 (with the hideous but effective D crook) for
$795...played it through college and several years beyond.  It was a
terrific horn, never gave me any problems and sounded great.  If you can
find one in good condition, give it a try! (I used to stay up late to
watch/listen to Ernie Tack play his P-24G on the Tonight Show...and do his
"crazy Ernie dance").

I sold it (in pristine condition) about five years ago for $500
...STUPID...STUPID...STUPID!

(disclaimer...there is probably someone out there who hated this horn.  I
was very impressed with it and would still be playing it...if..).

Please do not blame me if this starts a new thread, "great horns I have
sold". I will whine all over you for the 62H I sold!

Best Regards,
Paul Hill
Bass Tbn
Juneau Symphony

-----Original Message-----
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: Trombones and related issues forum. <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Date: Thursday, March 23, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: George Roberts models


>>From what I have gleaned in reading the Trombone-L archives, George
Roberts played mostly the Conn 70H, but also commissioned a George Roberts
Model Olds and, when Yamaha introduced it single trigger bass, Roberts
apparently adverstised for tyhem saying that it was basically the same horn
as the 70H. If you visit Tony Brusseau's website (www.brusseau.com) and
search the Trombone-L archives for George Roberts, you'll find the things I
found.
>
>Dave Molter
>Pittsburgh, PA
>
>




From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:36 2000
Date: 23 Mar 2000 12:13:00 -0500
From: Thomas Nelson <TNelson@tipton.k12.ia.us>
To: "Tromb and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>,
        <pdhill@email.msn.com>, <owner-trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Great Horns I have Sold
Message-ID: <-1258308922TNelson@tipton.k12.ia.us>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-Ascii"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Thanks to Paul for providing such a great thread idea!!


 Great Horns I have Sold:

A Conn 6H and a Holton Model 69 Bass Trombone. 
I then got an Olds Redcording Model Straight Tenor and an Edwards Bass Trombone, though definetly NOT  with the same paycheck!


-- 
Thomas L. Nelson
Band Director, Tipton High School, Tipton, Iowa  
"Gig Guy" & Bass Trombonist Eastern Iowa Brass Band                
Check out the Eastern Iowa Brass Band at: 
http://soli.inav.net/~eibb/more.html



On Friday, May 12, 1939, Paul Hill <pdhill@email.msn.com> wrote:
I participated in a major music festival in 1976 in which George was the
featured artist.  At that time, he was endorsing the Olds P-24 and P-24G
(dual, in-line).

I purchased a P-24G in 1977 (with the hideous but effective D crook) for
$795...played it through college and several years beyond.  It was a
terrific horn, never gave me any problems and sounded great.  If you can
find one in good condition, give it a try! (I used to stay up late to
watch/listen to Ernie Tack play his P-24G on the Tonight Show...and do his
"crazy Ernie dance").

I sold it (in pristine condition) about five years ago for $500
...STUPID...STUPID...STUPID!

(disclaimer...there is probably someone out there who hated this horn.  I
was very impressed with it and would still be playing it...if..).

Please do not blame me if this starts a new thread, "great horns I have
sold". I will whine all over you for the 62H I sold!

Best Regards,
Paul Hill
Bass Tbn
Juneau Symphony

-----Original Message-----
From: David Molter <kingbone@earthlink.net>
To: Trombones and related issues forum. <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Date: Thursday, March 23, 2000 5:01 AM
Subject: George Roberts models

>>From what I have gleaned in reading the Trombone-L archives, George
Roberts played mostly the Conn 70H, but also commissioned a George Roberts
Model Olds and, when Yamaha introduced it single trigger bass, Roberts
apparently adverstised for tyhem saying that it was basically the same horn
as the 70H. If you visit Tony Brusseau's website (www.brusseau.com) and
search the Trombone-L archives for George Roberts, you'll find the things I
found.
>
>Dave Molter
>Pittsburgh, PA
>
>




From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 13:12:26 -0500 (EST)
From: David Fetter <davidf@peabody.jhu.edu>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000323112635.12279D-100000@gigue.peabody.jhu.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII



On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Chris Waage wrote:

> Here's an exercize I have used in the past for this one:
> 
> 1.  Have him take a deep yawning breath, then exhale it onto the back 
> of his hand.  The air will feel warm.
> 2.  Have him take another deep yawning breath, then exhale it through 
> a very small apeture, or even free-buzzing onto the back of his hand. 
> It will feel cold.
> 3.  Work for a combination of warm air/small apeture.
> 
> Chris


This is EX-CEL-LENT!

David Fetter
Associate Dean for Performance Activities and Placement
Conservatory and Preparatory Trombone Faculty
Peabody Institute
1 East Mt. Vernon Place
Baltimore, MD 21202
410 659-8149 or 8138, fax 410 783-8562
home page:  www.peabody.jhu.edu/~davidf/




From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 12:24:28 -0600
From: Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
To: David Fetter <davidf@peabody.jhu.edu>,
        Trombone-L <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
Message-ID: <v04220806b50011b28710@[206.52.159.95]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

<x-flowed>Thank you!

I wish I could take credit for this, but the original was pounded 
into my head by Steve Seward, tubist with the Kansas City Symphony.

Chris

>On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Chris Waage wrote:
>
>  > Here's an exercize I have used in the past for this one:
>  >
>  > 1.  Have him take a deep yawning breath, then exhale it onto the back
>  > of his hand.  The air will feel warm.
>  > 2.  Have him take another deep yawning breath, then exhale it through
>  > a very small apeture, or even free-buzzing onto the back of his hand.
>  > It will feel cold.
>  > 3.  Work for a combination of warm air/small apeture.
>  >
>  > Chris
>
>
>This is EX-CEL-LENT!
>
>David Fetter
>Associate Dean for Performance Activities and Placement
>Conservatory and Preparatory Trombone Faculty
>Peabody Institute
>1 East Mt. Vernon Place
>Baltimore, MD 21202
>410 659-8149 or 8138, fax 410 783-8562
>home page:  www.peabody.jhu.edu/~davidf/

_____________________________________________
Chris Waage            basstbn@waageworks.com
       Visit The Mouthpiece Exchange at
          http://www.waageworks.com
_____________________________________________

</x-flowed>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 15:51:45 EST
From: SFTrombone@aol.com
To: Trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: RB double trombone bag review
Message-ID: <68.2071bb0.260bdde1@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

I got my Reunion Blues new double trombone gig bag today, and in the interest 
of those like me who have too many horns, I got out a bunch of horns, 
including some unusual ones, to see what combinations would really fit.  
Here's a sample of what I tried and works:

Fit:
Conn 62H bass and Bach 16M
Conn 62H bass and Bach 36 (no valve)
Conn 70H bass (single valve) and Conn 88H
Conn 88H and Bach 36
Getzen bass trumpet and Bach 36
Getzen bass trumpet and F. Holton alto horn
Conn 62H alone

Didn't fit:
Conn 62H bass and Conn 88H
Conn 88H and Getzen bass trumpet

Didn't try, but should fit:
Bass and alto trombone
Large tenor and alto trombone
Any trombone and an extra slide and extra F-attachment

So it looks like you can have a two valve horn and a no-valve horn, or two 
horns with one valve each, or you can carry one of the weird horns (bass tpt, 
alto horn) and a no valve tenor trombone.  The 88H with the 8.5" bell fit 
fine in the small end of the case, even though it is rated for an 8" bell on 
that end.  The larger end of the case doesn't fit a bell larger than 9.5".

I didn't have my alto trombone with me to try, but as it's about the same 
size as a small tenor trombone, just shorter, it should fit fine.  I don't 
have a Thayer or K-valve bass trombone to try either, but they should fit, 
though the fit might be a slight bit tighter.

Your horns will fit tightly, as this bag isn't really much bigger than one of 
their single bags.  I had to press the sides of the bag together a little to 
get the zipper closed.  I didn't see any problems because of the tight fit 
though, and it may help to keep things from bouncing around.  Do make sure 
that the spit valves on your slides aren't right next to the bell though, to 
avoid the possibility of a dent.  Just turn the slide over and it's out of 
the way.  This case is also the perfect size for just carrying one bass 
trombone, so I think it's worth the extra money over a single trombone case 
even if you don't always carry two horns. 

Both ends have a padded wooden bell protection disk, and the smaller one is 
removable to get horns out easier.  Both slides go inside the bag, between 
the horns, with a padded rigid piece of wood between them.  The bag has 
double shoulder straps like a tuba bag, and comes in leather or cordura.  It 
includes two padded mouthpiece/accessory pouches.  The double bag can be 
found at any RB dealer, or I can sell them direct.

Steve Ferguson

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 15:19:47 -0500
From: "Stewart M. Crane" <smcrane@esper.com>
To: <basstbn@waageworks.com>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
Message-ID: <00ac01bf9525$7a1cf570$0101a8c6@stewart>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Assuming that the throat is open, how is the warm air produced through the
small aperture? By slowing the speed of the airstream?

Stewart Crane

----- Original Message -----
From: "Chris Waage" <basstbn@waageworks.com>
To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 1:24 PM
Subject: Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture


> Thank you!
>
> I wish I could take credit for this, but the original was pounded
> into my head by Steve Seward, tubist with the Kansas City Symphony.
>
> Chris
>
> >On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Chris Waage wrote:
> >
> >  > Here's an exercize I have used in the past for this one:
> >  >
> >  > 1.  Have him take a deep yawning breath, then exhale it onto the back
> >  > of his hand.  The air will feel warm.
> >  > 2.  Have him take another deep yawning breath, then exhale it through
> >  > a very small apeture, or even free-buzzing onto the back of his hand.
> >  > It will feel cold.
> >  > 3.  Work for a combination of warm air/small apeture.
> >  >
> >  > Chris
> >
> >
> >This is EX-CEL-LENT!
> >
> >David Fetter
> >Associate Dean for Performance Activities and Placement
> >Conservatory and Preparatory Trombone Faculty
> >Peabody Institute
> >1 East Mt. Vernon Place
> >Baltimore, MD 21202
> >410 659-8149 or 8138, fax 410 783-8562
> >home page:  www.peabody.jhu.edu/~davidf/
>
> _____________________________________________
> Chris Waage            basstbn@waageworks.com
>        Visit The Mouthpiece Exchange at
>           http://www.waageworks.com
> _____________________________________________


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:24:04 -0500
From: Douglas Yeo <yeo@yeodoug.com>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Brahms 4 and Bach
Message-ID: <v0310280db50019fdd432@[168.122.11.62]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit

Some time ago, we had a thread on Brahms and Bach.  I thought I'd follow up
with some information I've just learned (the info isn't new, just new to me
and probably to many others).

Brahms' 4th Symphony is remarkable for so many things, not the least that
it's one of his few pieces (and his only symphony) which begins in minor
which ends in minor as well.  No moving from darkness to light here (as in
Beethoven 5, or Brahms 1). Many scholars see Brahms making a statement with
that - composed when he was 53, Brahms clearly saw himself at the end of a
long line of German symphonists, even composers (SchŸtz, Bach, Haydn,
Mozart, Beethoven Schubert and Schumann).  The defiance of the e minor
ending signals the end of an era, for sure.

Among the fascinating aspects of the Brahms 4 is the chaconne which makes
up the finale (trombone content: there are 3 trombones in this movement).
I read in recent Boston Symphony Orchestra program notes by Jan Swafford
that the chaconne was inspired by Bach. I got curious to find out more, and
today I got a hold of Swafford's book "Johannes Brahms: a biography,"
published by Alfred Knopf, 1997, ISBN 0-679-42261-7 which tells which Bach
cantata Brahms was thinking of. Swafford writes:

"It appears that the immediate inspiration for the finale came out during a
conversation among Brahms, [Hans von] BŸlow and conductor Siegfried Ochs in
1880.  The subject of Bach cantatas came up and Brahms perdictably knew
that repertoire better than his friends.  He went to the piano and played
for them the climactic chaconne of the then-unpublished Cantata 150, 'Nach
Dir, Herr, verlanget mich' [NB - Swafford is incorrect in that the complete
edition of Bach's works was in fact published in 1844].  Singling out the
repeated bass line on which the movement was erected, he speculated, "What
would you think of a symphonic movement written on this theme someday? But
it's too clunky, too straighforward.  It would have to be chromatically
altered somehow."

Ironically, Bach's text for this movement is the anthesis of Brahms dark
foreboding:

Meine Tage in dem Leide
Endet Gott dennoch zur Fruede

(English poetic rendering:)
Days which here are filled with sadness
God at last will turn to Gladness

The Bach Chaconne is the finale of the Cantata (a choral movement), a real
masterstroke (today I purchased Gustav Leonhardt's recording with the
Leonhardt-Consort on Teldec - 6 discs, plenty to learn there!) - a 5 bar
phrase in B minor.  In 3/2 time, it is made of 7 notes over 5 bars, which,
when transposed to E minor (to match Brahm's symphony movement) are:

E    |    F#    |    G    |    A		    B	       B    |    E

Brahms stretched the theme to encompass 8 bars with one note per bar and
added his "chromatic alteration, an A#) to come up with:

E    |    F#    |    G    |    A    |    A#    |    B	  |    B    |    E

And now you know the rest of the story. Yet another musician inspired by
the genius of Bach...

-Doug Yeo


                  **********************************************
                  *                Douglas Yeo                 *
                  * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra *
                  * Music Director, The New England Brass Band *
                  *              yeo@yeodoug.com               *
                  *           http://www.yeodoug.com           *
                  *                    <><                     *
                  **********************************************
                                       



From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:26:03 EST
From: AlRobnett@aol.com
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Re: Classical Music Quotes
Message-ID: <de.2bdc1f0.260c101b@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

While it might be a stretch to call it jazz, I have always wondered why "I'm 
Always Chasing Rainbows" is credited to Harry Carroll (1918) with no mention 
of the fact that the melody is lifted straight out of Chopin's Fantasy 
Impromptu op. 66.

In the '40's, I remember a popular song called "Our Love" which was taken 
from the love theme of Tschaikowsky's "Romeo and Juliet". Of course, the 
original question pertained to quoting of classical works, as opposed to 
wholesale appropriation.
Allen

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 17:53:05 -0700
From: Larry & Carol Bronisz <bronisz@trail.com>
To: tbneplyer@mindspring.com,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: 1998 Julliard Trombone Choir?
Message-ID: <4.1.20000323175027.00cf3e40@mail.trail.com>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Quite a while ago - At 12:36 PM 2/27/00 -0800, Chad Horsley wrote: 
>
> What was there program in Boulder?
>  
> Thanks
> ----------------------------------------------------
> Chad Horsley
> <mailto:tbneplyer@mindspring.com>tbneplyer@mindspring.com
> AIM....tbneplyer


I found notes from the '98 ITF on the Julliard Bone choir program:

Julliard Trombone Choir Program 5/28/98:
1. Ewazen: fantasy & double fugue for octet
2. John Stevens: The Chief
Dave Taylor - Bass Trombone
3. Franz Biehl: Ave Maria arr. Lumpkin
4. Derek Bourgeois: Scherzo Funebre Op 86
5. Joseph T. Spaniola: Crossroads w/ Joe Alessi soloist  (world premiere)
6. D. Ellington: Africa Flower (arr Steve Allee)
7 encore: Gabet? Orig. bone & orch

- Larry

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 19:34:08 -0600
From: Chris Waage <basstbn@waageworks.com>
To: "Stewart M. Crane" <smcrane@esper.com>,
        Trombone-L <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
Message-ID: <v04220800b5007652c9e3@[199.240.146.180]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

<x-flowed>It's more of a conceptual thing - if you focus on opening the airway 
as you will for a "yawn" breath while blowing through the small 
apeture, that will give the desired result (with lots of practice . . 
. )

Chris

>Assuming that the throat is open, how is the warm air produced through the
>small aperture? By slowing the speed of the airstream?
>
>Stewart Crane
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: "Chris Waage" <basstbn@waageworks.com>
>To: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
>Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 1:24 PM
>Subject: Re: Warm Breath - Small Aperture
>
>
>  > Thank you!
>  >
>  > I wish I could take credit for this, but the original was pounded
>  > into my head by Steve Seward, tubist with the Kansas City Symphony.
>  >
>  > Chris
>  >
>  > >On Thu, 23 Mar 2000, Chris Waage wrote:
>  > >
>  > >  > Here's an exercize I have used in the past for this one:
>  > >  >
>  > >  > 1.  Have him take a deep yawning breath, then exhale it onto the back
>  > >  > of his hand.  The air will feel warm.
>  > >  > 2.  Have him take another deep yawning breath, then exhale it through
>  > >  > a very small apeture, or even free-buzzing onto the back of his hand.
>  > >  > It will feel cold.
>  > >  > 3.  Work for a combination of warm air/small apeture.
>  > >  >
>  > >  > Chris
>  > >
>  > >
>  > >This is EX-CEL-LENT!
>  > >
>  > >David Fetter
>  > >Associate Dean for Performance Activities and Placement
>  > >Conservatory and Preparatory Trombone Faculty
>  > >Peabody Institute
>  > >1 East Mt. Vernon Place
>  > >Baltimore, MD 21202
>  > >410 659-8149 or 8138, fax 410 783-8562
>  > >home page:  www.peabody.jhu.edu/~davidf/
>  >
>  > _____________________________________________
>  > Chris Waage            basstbn@waageworks.com
>  >        Visit The Mouthpiece Exchange at
>  >           http://www.waageworks.com
>  > _____________________________________________

_____________________________________________
Chris Waage            basstbn@waageworks.com
      Visit the Mouthpiece Exchange at
          http://www.waageworks.com
_____________________________________________


</x-flowed>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 21:37:38 EST
From: Tbcwes@aol.com
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: (no subject)
Message-ID: <e0.2934bcd.260c2ef2@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

Hi guys,

How much would you guys/gals expect to pay for a mint condition Elkhart 88h?

-Wes

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 19:08:02 -0800
From: "Bryce McGrew" <brycemc@jps.net>
To: Trombone L <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Galliard Sonatas
Message-ID: <200003240307.TAA23004@smtp6.jps.net>
Mime-version: 1.0
Content-type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit

    Can anyone recommend a recording of the Galliard Sonatas?  Particularly
#'s 1-3.  Looking to perform a one (or a few) sometime soon.

      Bryce McGrew
        brycemc@jps.net

            Trombone players do it in 7 positions :)


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 22:14:28 EST
From: Atlbrvsnt@aol.com
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Re: Galliard Sonatas
Message-ID: <ad.1b30e1a.260c3794@aol.com>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

In a message dated 3/23/00 10:08:32 PM Eastern Standard Time, brycemc@jps.net 
writes:

> Can anyone recommend a recording of the Galliard Sonatas?  Particularly
>  #'s 1-3.  Looking to perform a one (or a few) sometime soon.
>  
>        Bryce McGrew
>          brycemc@jps.net

I'd like this also, so please let me in on it too....I've been performing 1 
and plan on performing 2 soon, and I'd just like to hear someone else's 
interpretation of them.  Thanks!
-Tommy Cox

From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 02:24:03 -0500 (EST)
From: Beth Lewis <ealewis@indiana.edu>
To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu
Subject: Workloads in music schools
Message-ID: <Pine.GSO.3.96.1000324011832.18652E-100000@kate.ucs.indiana.edu>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII

Hi all,

Something that I've been thinking about lately is the demand that schools
sometimes place on music majors.  I'll try not to turn this into a 'gripe
session,' but I feel it's necessary to share my experiences so that y'all
know where I'm coming from.  Personally, I have anywhere between three and
five hours of homework every day (including the weekend), and I'm a 
performance major (a program that's supposed to leave time for practice!).
That, combined with everything else I have to do, leaves little time to
sleep, much less practice as much as I need to, study scores, and expect
to make any real, consistent improvement on the horn (forget any semblance
of a social life). Add to that the fact that during the week I only have
reasonable assurance of finding a practice room at night and in the
morning (and of course the buildings conveniently close at 11 or 12 PM).
trombone-related content: I miss practicing and studying recordings (that
aren't part of a music theory assignment).

Do any music perf. majors at other schools have this problem? Are some
schools just trying to train "performance majors" to be over-educated
concert-goers/CD buyers? This is a source of great frustration for me and
I'd really appreciate hearing any experiences anyone may have with this.

Beth Lewis
Freshman, Indiana U.
PS: I know that getting through a degree program is supposed to teach you
a lot about commitment, organization, and all that, but if one's goal
(whether corresponding with one's major or not) is being pushed aside just
to get that piece of parchment, a.k.a. degree, what good is it?


From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:06:43 -0000
From: "Adrian Drover" <slide.rule@adios.co.uk>
To: <dynamicmusic@btinternet.com>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Finger on the bell
Message-ID: <000401bf9564$0b8e3300$15479fd4@v4v3j2>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----- Original Message -----
From: Dynamic Music <dynamicmusic@btinternet.com>
To: Trombones and related issues forum. <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Sent: Thursday, March 23, 2000 7:45 AM
Subject: Re: Finger on the bell


> Did I ever tell the story of a trombone instructor in Glasgow who had
given
> the child a trombone home for the first time?
>
> The following week the pupil turned up for his second lesson and announced
> that his father had "mended" the instrument. Knowing that the trombone was
> in a fine condition when it had been issued, the instructor asked "what do
> you mean?"
>
> The father had drilled a hole through the two slides and attached a nut
and
> bolt to "stop it moving about" !!!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Dave (yup, still lurking away)

Well, after that story, maybe you should go back into lurk mode  ;-)

A.

Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland)
Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk
Business: studio@adios.co.uk
http://www.adios.co.uk



From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 20:08:01 -0000
From: "Adrian Drover" <slide.rule@adios.co.uk>
To: "Sam Burtis" <sabutin@mindspring.com>,
        "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: jazz/improv
Message-ID: <000501bf9564$0cb32b00$15479fd4@v4v3j2>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain
Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit

----- Original Message -----
From: <sabutin@mindspring.com>
To: Trombones and related issues forum. <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Sent: Wednesday, March 22, 2000 7:24 PM
Subject: Re: jazz/improv

>    Actually, "Giant Steps" is one of the LEAST "aimless" chord sequences
in
> all of jazz.
>
>    It's based on three major keys a major third apart...hence the "Giant
> Steps" title...in the original key, they are B, G, and Eb.
>
>     It's a masterpiece of harmonic construction, first going down in major
> thirds (from B to G to Eb), then up a major third and down again in major
> thirds (G to Eb to B), then going back up in major thirds (Eb to G to B)
> until it comes to a momentary rest at Eb (its ostensible key), and then
the
> whole pattern begins again.

Maybe "aimless" was a bad choice of word.  The fact that it contains a
II-V-I (in fact, six of them) gives it a sense of direction.  But as soon as
it hits a cadence, it's off again on another excursion.  It's like a bunch
of changes in search of a key.  Don't quite understand why you say that Eb
is its ostensible key though.  It rests momentarily (very momentarily) in
all three of its keys.  These three keys, being a maj.3rd apart give it the
flavour of an augmented triad, a chord that could have any of three roots.

>    An amazing piece, almost a harmonic sculpture.

Yes Sam, and undoubtedly a jazz classic.

Interestingly enough, "Central Park West", another Coltrane tune has the
same turnaround (C#m7-F#7-B^7), though this time it hurtles through four
keys (B, D, Ab and F).  And once again these tonal centres build a chord
with equi-distant intervals, a diminished 7th chord (any note could be the
root).  To be fair though, this tune does come to rest in the key of B for
five measures.

A.

Adrian Drover (ADIOS Scotland)
Personal: adrian@adios.co.uk
Business: studio@adios.co.uk
http://www.adios.co.uk






From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 09:07:26 -0800
From: "Sharon Rustemier" <sharon_rustemier@lineone.net>
To: "Trombone Forum" <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Mute matters
Message-ID: <009201bf95b3$93664160$c558fea9@vaio>
MIME-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;
	boundary="----=_NextPart_000_008F_01BF9570.5FEFF3A0"

<x-html><!x-stuff-for-pete base="" src="" id="0"><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" http-equiv=Content-Type>
<META content="MSHTML 5.00.2919.6307" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi there!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I've enjoyed reading the notices on the list and 
wondered if anyone has any suggestions about the best way to manage quick mute 
changes? I'm playing in a production of Westside Story which calls for straight, 
cup, and plunger mutes, sometimes with only a couple of beats (should I say 
counts?) for the changeover. I'm managing by not quite fixing the mute in the 
bell but holding it with my left hand so that I can quickly change. However, I'm 
pretty sure this must affect the sound quality. I'd be grateful for any 
tips!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Sharon Rustemier</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Trombonist</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>UK</FONT></DIV></BODY></HTML>

</x-html>
From ???@??? Fri Mar 24 10:56:37 2000
Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 03:35:10 -0600
From: Angie Brunk <angie@cybersolvers.com>
To: ealewis@indiana.edu
Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." <trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu>
Subject: Re: Workloads in music schools
Message-ID: <a04310103b500e32b923e@[216.206.211.86]>
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" ; format="flowed"

<x-flowed>At 2:24 AM -0500 3/24/00, Beth Lewis wrote:
<snip stuff about the typical workload of college students>

	Beth,

	From what I have seen observing music students at two schools 
(Baker U and Indiana) what you describe is pretty typical.  I 
seriously tried to get a music minor as an undergrad.  I was taking 
music theory, ear training, and class piano as well as my voice 
lessons, ensembles (jazz band and choir).  This was on top of my full 
load as a poli sci major, editorial position on the newspaper and 
various and sundry other small committments.  Don't ask me when I 
slept. :-/  I ended up dropping the piano and ear training for 
several reasons, not the least of which was the fact that I was 
spending more time studying (in all its forms) for my minor than I 
was spending on the classes in my major, and poli sci is not know as 
a haven for light weights. (The fact that I had sprained my ankle 
severly, and was in a fair bit of pain most of the time was also a 
contributing factor.)
	I don't know how the music majors, especially ed majors, did 
it without having a nervious breakdown. Unfortunately, many schools 
still expect students to complete a music degree in four years, 
usually by cutting off all financial aide at that time.  If it is 
possible for you to stretch it out over five years, consider it.  You 
might be able to carry a more human workload and practice.  Good 
luck, and remeber, Caffeine is your friend until you start to twitch. 
:-)
-- 
Angie Brunk
MLS Indiana University 1999
"For years, we've been bludgeoned with the cliche "infrmation is power."  But
information isn't power.  After all, who's got the most information in your
neighborhood?  Librarians.  And they're famous for having no power at all.
And who has the most power in your community?  Politicians.  And they're
notorious for being ill-informed."--Clifford Stoll

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