TROMBONE-L Digest 1606 Topics covered in this issue include: 1) Fwd: Meinl Weston/Melton by JFBermann@aol.com 2) Re: New Mute by Zemry@aol.com 3) Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece by daboneman 4) Re: Arthur Pryor by Zemry@aol.com 5) Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece by "Joe L. Norcross" 6) Slide tuning design questions by sabutin@mindspring.com 7) Best Concert Times by Jim Jaffe 8) Re: memorization by sabutin@mindspring.com 9) RE: arthur pryor by David Molter 10) Re: Mouthpiece Buzzing by sabutin@mindspring.com 11) RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing by sabutin@mindspring.com 12) RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing by sabutin@mindspring.com 13) Slide Doctor by Thomas Cox 14) Re: Slide tuning design questions by BassBonist@aol.com 15) RE: Slide tuning design questions by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 16) Re: Meinl Weston/Melton by Beth Lewis 17) gold plating (was Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece) by Closetbn@aol.com 18) RE: arthur pryor by Mike Coyle 19) RE: gold plating (was Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece) by "DOWDY, KENNETH S" 20) RE: Best Concert Times by "Jim O'Briant" 21) Re: Slide tuning design questions by "Joe L. Norcross" 22) Re: New Mute by Trmbman@aol.com 23) Tuba Mute on Ebay by Larry Zaidan 24) Sackbutts in the Capital by JoshuaSL@aol.com 25) RE: arthur pryor by "posaune rex" 26) Trombone-elbow update by John and Robin Renegar 27) Re: Slide tuning design questions by "Dynamic Music Publications" 28) Re: Best Concert Times by "Gary Maxwell" 29) Re: Best Concert Times by "Kenneth Dowdy" 30) Re: Slide tuning design questions by Bob Koester 31) Re: Best Concert Times by "Gary Maxwell" 32) scholarships by "Adolphus Sprott" 33) ISO: Tbn related content in SLC, UT by Jkink14714@aol.com 34) Re: Slide tuning design questions by sabutin@mindspring.com 35) RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing by "Lawrence Borden" 36) RE: Trombone-elbow update by "Kevan Lomas" 37) Re: Slide tuning design questions by Randy Campora 38) Rimsky-Korsakov Concerto by j.grisham@pmail.net (Josh Grisham) 39) Antique King FS by "R Miller" 40) Re: scholarships by Zemry@aol.com 41) RE: Rimsky-Korsakov Concerto by "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> 42) RING?!?!?!?!? by Philip Brink 43) Re: Mouthpiece Buzzing by "Daniel Pliskin" 44) Re: Slide tuning design questions by sabutin@mindspring.com 45) Re: Trombone-elbow update by "Daniel Pliskin" 46) F attachment Bass Trombone for sale by BassBonist@aol.com 47) Re: Slide tuning design questions by "Jeffrey Diehl" 48) Euph ? by Trmbman@aol.com 49) Re: RING?!?!?!?!? by Philip Brink 50) Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece by "Aaron Roth" 51) Re: Euph ? by "Talley, Brian Lee" From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:26:22 EST From: JFBermann@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Fwd: Meinl Weston/Melton Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="part1_cb.24e4aa6.25e539fe_boundary" Return-path: JFBermann@aol.com From: JFBermann@aol.com Full-name: JFBermann Message-ID: Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:25:06 EST Subject: Re: Meinl Weston/Melton To: ealewis@indiana.edu MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Mailer: AOL 4.0 for Windows 95 sub 228 Getzen has bought Meinl Weston. Go on there website, and you'll see two bass trumpets listed, one of which does not have a picture yet. Jim Bermann From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:46:34 EST From: Zemry@aol.com To: gdmaxwell@lightspeed.net, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: New Mute Message-ID: <3e.13724f6.25e53eba@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/22/00 11:29:04 PM Central Standard Time, gdmaxwell@lightspeed.net writes: > Why buy a plunger mute. Purchase a large, rubber, toilet plunger for about > a buck and then have money left over for a down payment on a wah-wah, or a > case of Guinness, which ever comes first. Thanks for the advice, Gary....That Guinness sure sounds awfully good! Richard Z. Johnson, Jr. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 07:47:54 -0600 From: daboneman To: yeo@yeodoug.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece Message-ID: <38B3E50A.ECD5EE4F@mciworld.com> MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit I personnally like the feel of gold... but to a college or high school student that doesn't have a lot of money the silver might be a good option to start with AND to see if they really like it. It's not for all players... I like it, it's the best mouthpiece I've ever had (and I've gone through a bunch before this one). I'll just say this... if this one gets destroyed somehow... I'll buy the one with gold. Dean McCarty freelance trombonist, Houston area Douglas Yeo wrote: > At 5:20 PM -0500 2/22/00, JFBermann@aol.com wrote: > > >Dear Chris, Chuck and Colleagues, > >When I found out that Doug's mouthpiece and others in the signature > >series were going to made available in a less expensive silver plated > >version I was frankly quite disapointed in Yamaha. > > Not to worry, Jim. The mouthpiece will now be available in > silverplate only AND the originally gold/silver plated version. > > >I've known Doug > >for many years and am confident in what he says as gospel. It's my > >understanding that Doug's mouthpiece is expensive because of the > >way it is plated, in addition to development and production costs. > >The premise behind the mouthpiece being plated as it is, has to do > >not with the cosmetics of the mouthpiece, but the belief that the > >gold plating inside the cup and inner shank makes a better path > >for the airstream to follow, actually making it move faster. This > >feature along with the physical specs all contribute to the idea > >the mouthpiece originally intended to follow. > > Yes, that is certainly a big part of why I like the mouthpiece, and, > in addition, the feel of the gold plated rim. > > >I'm curious myself > >to see how differently the NEW AFFORDABLE Yeo Mouthpiece > >plays than its original version. Doug, hope I didn't open up any > >cans of worms. :o) > > No worms. The original model in gold is rather expensive - may > people have purchased it and like it. However, the cost is more than > a little stretch for many people who otherwise might buy a Schilke 60 > or Bach 1G instead. By offering the mouthpiece in silverplate at a > lower price, Yamaha is making the mouthpiece available to a whole > different marketplace. For those wanting all the benefits of the > original design, that will still be available. For those whom price > is a significant deciding factor, the new all silverplate model is an > option which I think will still compare favorably with other > mouthpieces of similar sizes. > > -Doug Yeo > > ********************************************** > * Douglas Yeo * > * Bass Trombonist, Boston Symphony Orchestra * > * Music Director, The New England Brass Band * > * yeo@yeodoug.com * > * http://www.yeodoug.com * > * <>< * > ********************************************** > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:49:02 EST From: Zemry@aol.com To: MikeSuter@aol.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Arthur Pryor Message-ID: <48.1fa4570.25e53f4e@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit In a message dated 2/22/00 11:50:40 PM Central Standard Time, MikeSuter writes: > Probably not very well. But you have to keep in mind he'd be about 128 years > old. > > All The Best, Mike Suter Hmmm......Maybe he kept his chops up! From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 06:29:29 -0800 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece Message-ID: <02e801bf7e0a$65d517a0$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The great advantage to the Doug Elliott system is that you can fine tune the mouthpiece. I use the same rim and cup on several horns. All use a different backbore and in some cases a different taper on the shank. Few of you realize that the backbore can really make a difference ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba: Sequoia Winds and Visalia, CA British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg,CA, City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net Snip > and still be under the cost of a custom Schilke or a Doug Elliott. > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 09:37:32 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Cc: jjjohnson-list@list.sirius.com Subject: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <200002231437.JAA26144@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Hi... I have a question for all the equipment design thinkers out there. Slide tuning instruments generally play in a way I like better than bell tuning ones, but the heaviness and expense of the resulting slide is a serious drawback. It can be dealt with, but in this time of technological breakthroughs it shouldn't have to be. I have a Conn valve section that tunes at the crook on the bottom of the slide, and that crook seems to me to be a much lighter piece of equipment that the cumbersome upper slide systems on all the other slide tuning horns I own. Can anyone think of a reason that the horn manufacturers in the heyday of slide tuning horns...the '20s + '30s...didn't use a crook on the bottom of the slide? While we're at it...does Edwards still offer slide tuning as an option, has anyone played an Edwards slide tuning slide, and is anyone else making slide tuning horns anywhere in the world? Thanks... S. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 06:53:13 -0800 From: Jim Jaffe To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Best Concert Times Message-ID: MIME-version: 1.0 Content-type: text/plain Content-transfer-encoding: 7bit Our brass quintet, Brassafrass, www.brassafrass.com, is giving a Sunday concert April 30 at a local SF Bay Area church and we have been having a debate wrt to what time of the day would be best to attract the biggest audience. The arguments have been: 1) afternoon is not good because Californians spend their time outdoors on the weekends 2) Evening is not good because older people like to go to bed early etc., etc. I would like any ideas. Thanks, Jim Jaffe From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 09:56:05 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: memorization Message-ID: <200002231456.JAA23560@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 08:42 AM 2/21/00 -0500, you wrote: >I agree that it is best to memorize. From my limited experience, music is >more musical when memorized. One can concentrate on the nuances of the music >as opposed to reading notes. > ======================== There's been a long thread here on memorization...here's my 2 cents. Memorization appears to me to simplify the path the music takes to get to the playing stage. Reading music entails using the eyes, which then send nerve impulses to some part of the brain, which translates them to another nerve language, which then internally "hears" the music. Then THAT information is sent to the playing centers, which again translate it into performance data. Memorizing eliminates the first action, and things happen in a less complicated manner as a result. Quicker, smoother, w/more energy left over to be applied to the making of the music. It's like eliminating one computer from a string of three, all using different computer languages. If you've ever had to transfer information from a Mac to a PC. you know how slow that can be (used to be, anyway...). Memorization gets rid of that one step. To put it another way, there's a feeling you get when improvising (and a feeling you often get when LISTENING to improvised music) that is hard to define...a feeling that the music is taking a direct path from somewhere else directly out of the instrument and into the listeners' ears. I have never been able to get that feeling while reading music, no matter how well I might know a piece, but I can and do get it consistently once I memorize a piece...even parts in an ensemble. Memorization's really not that hard, especially in "tonal" music (even "tonal" music that's very out...Bartok, etc.) I find 12 tone or badly written tonal music much harder...they just doesn't seem to reside in the same memory banks the same way. Mozart, Bach...they're just so right they lock right in on some sub-atomic level. Later... S. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:16:28 -0500 (EST) From: David Molter To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: arthur pryor Message-ID: <383136759.951318988735.JavaMail.root@web24.pub01> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit To those wondering how Arthur Pryor would stack up against the current crop of virtuosos .. virtuosi? ... virtuosities?... people who play trombone real good --- there's a recording of Pryor available through Giradinelli Music in New York --www.giardinelli.com (use search and type in Pryor). It's an $11 cassette. I have no idea of the quality, but a cornetist in my brass band ordered the Herbert Clarke cassette and was pleased with it. I believe the same distributor advertises in the ITA Journal. Incidentally, after watching the Sousa biopic "Stars and Stripes Forever" recently, I was shocked to find out that it was Robert Wagner who invented the Sousaphone. I mean ... he was great in "Hart to Hart" and "Austin Powers," but who knew?? And Sousa looked just like Clifton Webb!! ;-) Dave Molter Pittsburgh, PA From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:18:51 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: c568667@showme.missouri.edu Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Mouthpiece Buzzing Message-ID: <200002231519.KAA15501@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:56 PM 2/21/00 -0600, you wrote: >I am interested in knowing finding out two things: what are the benefits >of buzzing or not buzzing? and if you buzz how much time does it take up >in your daily practice routine? > >Seth Merenbloom ========================= Once again...to buzz or not to buzz, that is the question. I have a couple of articles on the Online Trombone Journal that address this issue. For a fairly thorough investigation of some of the uses and techniques of buzzing, go to: <http://www.trombo ne.org/articles/library/nyletters2.asp> <http://www.t rombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-1.asp> <http://www.t rombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-2.asp> Dan Maslowski also suggested in this thread that buzzing helps you hear what you want to play more clearly...another advantage... Later... S. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:29:48 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: 8guion@jmls.edu Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Message-ID: <200002231530.KAA04634@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit At 08:55 AM 2/22/00 -0600, you wrote: >Dan Maslowski wrote, > >> What are the benefits of buzzing?Ź Well, simply....if I'm >> having trouble with my physical side of playing, like not being able to >> focus a certain note or lick on the trombone, then I make it even more >> basic by buzzing it.Ź If you can hear it, then you can get to buzzing >> it...if you can buzz it, you can begin to play it.Ź That may seem >> confusing, but if you read it as it is written I think you understand >> where I am coming from.Ź If I can say anything more about buzzing...use >> it to focus individual notes or licks that may be giving you a hard time >> on the horn then...put it to the horn.Ź >> >Funny this should turn up inŹ my mailbox this morning! Just last night, I >was having trouble with a passage that had accented notes in the >upper-middle register. At the volume marked, all ot the notes cracked when I >tried to accent them. So---I took the mouthpiece out of the horn, got my >trusty twelve inches of plastic tubing and decided to buzz it. I could not >buzz those notes. Not any of them. I could buzz lower. I could buzz higher. >But I could not buzz the notes from about d' or e' to g'-sharp. So I set >about glissing through that register and eventually made it work, but by >that time I was wondering if I was doing something weird with my embouchure >and put my mouthpiece back in my trombone. I immediately tongued the passage >cleanly and loudly. Maybe it workedŹ :-) ================ Of course it worked. You were caught between two settings, and you connected them. Again, take a look at my OTJ articles at: <http://www.trombo ne.org/articles/library/nyletters2.asp> <http://www.t rombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-1.asp> <http://www.t rombone.org/articles/library/outofthecase5-2.asp> for some plausible explanations for what and why this happens. ================= > >It occurs to me as I write that I probably would not have had any trouble >with those notes without the plastic tubing. I got it to help me buzz low. >But what's going on? =============== You can profitably lose the tubing in the low register too, if you so desire...it's just providing a resistance that you can and should be able to provide w/your own chops. Later... S. > >^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ >David Guion, Cataloger >John Marshall Law School >315 S. Plymouth Ct. >Chicago, ILŹŹ 60604 >Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552Ź Fax; (312) 427-8307 > >"Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog, >it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx > >^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 10:40:29 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: demaslo@ilstu.edu Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Message-ID: <200002231540.KAA04146@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 10:21 AM 2/22/00 -0600, you wrote: ---snip--- > >I like to buzz with just my mouthpiece...no tubing attached. But even >better than that, I like to use a mouthpiece that I had cut, so that >only half of the cup is still present while both the shank and rim >stayed in tack. This I found to be even more helpful in actually >"seeing" (if I go in front of a mirror) what is going on with my >embouchure, but more importantly, to make myself blow air to make a >sound. With half the cup still present, it gives you a little bit of >resistance (the kind you might feel when buzzing on your mouthpiece >alone), while with half of the cup gone, makes it feel more like a free >buzz of sorts. ================= You might also look into using a cutoff rim to buzz and also real freebuzzing. You're correct in your feeling that the less resistance, the more benefit, but even w/a cutoff rim, you're still relying on the rim to provide an artificial musculature. If you're careful, you can develop ways of playing based on the compromises that can be made among free buzzing, rim (or m'pce) buzzing, and playing the horn that can have astoundingly good playing results. (Careful w/the free buzzing, though. Too much w/out relating it to how you play WITH a rim can really unsettle your system) ============================ >Soo...what am I getting at? There is no right or wrong. >Yeah, you can buzz and buzz and still not get the sound or the accuracy >you desire, but I think that comes from too much tension. If you relax, >listen to the sound in your head and buzz to that...then eventually you >should be able to become more accurate. Again, I'm not a scientist, and >this isn't the RIGHT or the WRONG way...just some ideas that I found out >when playing, buzzing, whatever. Just so long as you can keep yourself >relaxed and still keep "your" embouchure, then buzzing helps. Wow, I >might have gone off on a big tangent there...there is just SO much when >it comes to this and really one word could give a person the wrong idea >about what I'm REALLY trying to say. If anyone on the list would like >to reply back to me privately for more detail or if they are confused, >PLEASE DO SO. Like I said, don't want to send the wrong message. > -Dan Maslowski ==================== You're sending a very good message, Dan. Everybody's different; everybody has to find what works for them; and anyone who wants to help has to suggest what's helped for them personally (or helped their students). Doing so w/out the "My way or the highway" approach is what I'm hearing from your posts. Sounds right to me... S. > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 11:05:38 -0500 From: Thomas Cox To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Slide Doctor Message-ID: <5FA575D78630D3118B2E0090276DC89F0241B600@merc08.us.sas.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain OK, just in case you've been in a cave for a while, here's another unsolicited testamonial for John Upchurch a.k.a. The Slide Doctor. Web site at http://www.slidedr.com/ I recently bought an old Conn 4H on eBay, knowing it would need some work. When it arrived, the bell section was in very good condition, but I feared the slide would need major surgery.The bow was partially collapsed and the tubes were warped, dinged and corroded. I sent it to John expecting to replace at least the inner tubes, and possibly the whole thing. I got it back in under a week, working better than new, for just the price of a standard slide setup...and I still have an all-original '40 Elkhart 4H. The time he has taken corresponding with me - a rank amateur WRT trombones - and the quality of work performed simply astounded me, *especially* since it was less money than the local shops would charge to run a dent ball through it and wipe it with a damp rag. Folks, if there is a registry of National Treasures out there somewhere, let me know where to submit a nomination. Thomas Cox Triangle Wind Ensemble ( http://www.vast.net/twe ) Sackbut Lunch ( an ad-hoc trombone ?-tet ) From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:41:49 EST From: BassBonist@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <19.15e0358.25e575dd@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit sabutin writes: << Slide tuning instruments generally play in a way I like better than bell tuning ones,>> For me, too. <> The weight of a standard weight Bach 50 bass trombone (outer) handslide is about 9.5 ounces (275 grams) and my Conn 62H outer slide with tuning weighs in at 10.2 ounces (290 grams). On a tenor, the difference could be similar but maybe even less. To me, less than an ounce of difference is not a drawback. I laugh when some players look at my slide and shake their heads in dismay, "I bet that heavy slide is a real drag, huh?" <> I have seen instruments other than Conn that have a movable crook, so it was a viable idea at the time and still is. The "shift" in design may have been precipitated by players themselves. I can just imagine lunkheaded players resting their slides on the floor and inadvertently going sharp and complaining about having to reach down to pull the crook tuning slide out again. "Gee, if they could just solder this section and put the tuning UP HERE." Brass players are a fickle lot. What some manufacturers don't like to spend money on is RETOOLING to be able to make a "new" style of component. (Even if it is a viable, older design.) The construction of a slide with tuning is not that different from a slide without. If you compare one with a non-tunable slide you can see the only differences are: the outer sleeves on the tunable version are not soldered to the tubes (and are both slightly longer) and there is a threaded screw with stop nuts to lock the tubes in place. "Modern" slides use the shortest possible nickel-silver sleeves to add stability in the area of the handbrace, but try to keep the added "weight" to a minimum. After all, this is what the market has dictated. As long as the outer sleeves are both of sufficient length and have a small length of sleeve soldered below the moveable sleeves, a slide with tuning can be built by any competent brass technician with the right sizes of tubing, for only a few dollars more than a typical slide. The problem is that manufacturers are just not motivated to do this for those of us who know the plus side of slide tuning instruments. Matt Varho From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:03:58 -0600 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Hey, I'm with you guys on this one. I, too, would like to be able to have slide tuning on my tenor. My valve bone tunes like Sam's, and I have always liked the sound that I get with the "rear slide" all the way in and the tuning done with the tuning slide for the valves. I can't understand the manufacturer's reluctance to build slides with tuning crooks. Just think, they should be able to recover all their tooling costs by selling slide tuning crooks made of different metals to those who really think it makes a difference :-) Ken Dowdy > -----Original Message----- > From: BassBonist@aol.com [SMTP:BassBonist@aol.com] > Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 11:42 AM > To: Trombones and related issues forum. > Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions > > sabutin writes: > > << Slide tuning instruments generally play in a way I like better than > bell > tuning ones,>> > > For me, too. > > < serious drawback. It can be dealt with, but in this time of technological > breakthroughs it shouldn't have to be.>> > > The weight of a standard weight Bach 50 bass trombone (outer) handslide is > > about 9.5 ounces (275 grams) and my Conn 62H outer slide with tuning > weighs > in at 10.2 ounces (290 grams). On a tenor, the difference could be > similar > but maybe even less. To me, less than an ounce of difference is not a > drawback. I laugh when some players look at my slide and shake their > heads > in dismay, "I bet that heavy slide is a real drag, huh?" > > <> > > I have seen instruments other than Conn that have a movable crook, so it > was > a viable idea at the time and still is. The "shift" in design may have > been > precipitated by players themselves. I can just imagine lunkheaded players > > resting their slides on the floor and inadvertently going sharp and > complaining about having to reach down to pull the crook tuning slide out > again. "Gee, if they could just solder this section and put the tuning UP > > HERE." Brass players are a fickle lot. > > What some manufacturers don't like to spend money on is RETOOLING > to be able to make a "new" style of component. (Even if it is a viable, > older > design.) > > The construction of a slide with tuning is not that different from a slide > > without. > If you compare one with a non-tunable slide you can see the only > differences > are: the outer sleeves on the tunable version are not soldered to the > tubes > (and are both slightly longer) and there is a threaded screw with stop > nuts > to lock the tubes in place. "Modern" slides use the shortest possible > nickel-silver sleeves to add stability in the area of the handbrace, but > try > to keep the added "weight" to a minimum. > After all, this is what the market has dictated. > > As long as the outer sleeves are both of sufficient length and have a > small > length of sleeve soldered below the moveable sleeves, a slide with tuning > can > be built by any competent brass technician with the right sizes of tubing, > > for only a few dollars more than a typical slide. The problem is that > manufacturers are just not motivated to do this for those of us who know > the > plus side of slide tuning instruments. > > Matt Varho From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 13:16:56 -0500 (EST) From: Beth Lewis To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Meinl Weston/Melton Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII This seems somewhat strange to me, as Melton's website lists Getzen as a distributor, not an owner. I've been assuming that Getzen and Meinl Weston bass trumpets are different instruments made by totally different firms. Can anyone tell me if that's right? Thanks, Beth Lewis On Wed, 23 Feb 2000 JFBermann@aol.com wrote: > Getzen has bought Meinl Weston. Go on there website, > and you'll see two bass trumpets listed, one of which > does not have a picture yet. > > Jim Bermann > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 13:17:47 EST From: Closetbn@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: gold plating (was Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit << Now hold it, boys and girls. I can buy a silver mouthpiece for sixty bongos, and have my jeweler do heavy gold plate for $25 or so. Where do the other hundred and ten bongos go? Into my pocket? It CAN'T be that expensive to do gold plating in Japan ... can it? Dennis L. Clason >> Wow! Who's your jeweler? I've never heard of anyone doing it for less than $45. Am I paying too much? From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:47:05 -0600 From: Mike Coyle To: kingbone@earthlink.net Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: arthur pryor Message-ID: <200002231848.MAA22868@newton.pconline.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Dave wrote: >there's a recording of Pryor available through Giradinelli Music in >New York --www.giardinelli.com (use search and type in Pryor). It's an $11 >cassette. ================= There is a widely available CD of Pryor from Crystal Records (CD461). Check out Tap Music (tapmusic.com). The question as to how Pryor would hold up today is not really a fair question. Given the vast difference in playing styles and technical advances (players and horns) it is rather like asking how well Babe Ruth would hold up against great ball players today. Or how well Lindbergh could handle a plane as opposed to today's pilots. Actually frequently find myself musing on the opposite question about different instruments. I wonder how today's pianist, for instance, would hold up against Moriz Rosenthal or Josef Hoffmann. One thing I am relatively sure of, however, is that most of today's players would not hold up too well in terms of artistic expression and risk taking. The CD mentality has really had a devastatingly bad effect on music. Because we can now achieve perfection in the studio NO ONE wants to take the risk of doing anything that might interfere with that robotic perfection in a live situation. I recently acquired a recording of Edith Vogel playing some of Beethoven's last piano sonatas. In terms of perfection it would pale by comparison to many recordings I can think of (except the bad Cortot recordings), but, in terms of expression and musical meaning I have never heard anything like it. Yes, it is nice to hear a good balance between accuracy and expression, but I always lean in the direction of expression as that is what its all about anyway! If you have a flawless technique, that's great, but if you can't play a musical phrase it is useless. Listen to Pryor play "Thoughts of Love". There is such fluidity and grace in the phrasing. It would be laughed at today and considered self indulgent and grossly romanticized. But, I have yet to hear anyone play that piece with as much feeling, whimsy, or simplicity. Mike Coyle At 09:16 AM 2/23/00 , you wrote: >To those wondering how Arthur Pryor would stack up against the current crop >of virtuosos .. virtuosi? ... virtuosities?... people who play trombone real >good --- there's a recording of Pryor available through Giradinelli Music in >New York --www.giardinelli.com (use search and type in Pryor). It's an $11 >cassette. I have no idea of the quality, but a cornetist in my brass band >ordered the Herbert Clarke cassette and was pleased with it. I believe the >same distributor advertises in the ITA Journal. Incidentally, after >watching the Sousa biopic "Stars and Stripes Forever" recently, I was >shocked to find out that it was Robert Wagner who invented the Sousaphone. >I mean ... he was great in "Hart to Hart" and "Austin Powers," but who >knew?? And Sousa looked just like Clifton Webb!! ;-) > >Dave Molter >Pittsburgh, PA > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:49:46 -0600 From: "DOWDY, KENNETH S" To: "'Closetbn@aol.com'" , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: gold plating (was Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece) Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain > Wow! Who's your jeweler? I've never heard of anyone doing it for less > than > $45. Am I paying too much? > Yes, unless you are having them do the buffing for you. Anderson Silver Plating will gold plate a ready to plate trombone mouthpiece for $27.70. There is also a minimum handling charge of $2.00. Their phone number is 219-294-6447. BTW, $45.00 is the going rate for jewelers in Omaha, too. That is why I don't use them. The difference is probably in volume. Anderson does a lot of plating. If you have a US built mouthpiece, chances are that Anderson plated it. Ken Dowdy From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:36 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:28:48 -0800 From: "Jim O'Briant" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Best Concert Times Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim Jaffe wrote: > Our brass quintet, Brassafrass, > www.brassafrass.com, is giving a Sunday > concert April 30 ... ...what time of the > day would be best to attract the biggest > audience. The arguments have been: > > 1) afternoon is not good because > Californians spend their time outdoors > on the weekends > 2) Evening is not good because older people > like to go to bed early etc., etc. The success of your concert and the size of your audience will depend more on your advertising and publicity than on whether it's in the afternoon or the evening. (And in the Bay Area, it will also depend on whether it happens to rain that weekend. Attendance will even depend on whether there's an accident on a critical freeway on the way to the church.) If you get the word out (or distribute tickets to a lot of people), then you'll get a lot of listeners. If the concert is free, then print tickets anyway and give them away. If there is an admission charge, then advance ticket sales will make a big difference. And of course, if you schedule it on of the Annual Wine Tasting at the Columbia Hotel in Columbia State Park, for which I already have tickets (and which you have done), then unfortunately I won't be able to be there to hear you. Jim O'Briant Bayside Music Press Gilroy, CA From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 11:09:25 -0800 From: "Joe L. Norcross" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <03b101bf7e43$b301a000$04000005@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit The biggest drawback for the novice player is that it is easy to get the slide misaligned, Still a great idea for the advanced player who treats his horn with respect ______________________________________ Joe L. Norcross Tuba: Sequoia Winds and Visalia, CA British Brass Band Tuba and Announcer, Kingsburg,CA, City Band joetuba@lightspeed.net -----Original Message----- From: DOWDY, KENNETH S To: Trombones and related issues forum. Date: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 10:05 AM Subject: RE: Slide tuning design questions >Hey, I'm with you guys on this one. I, too, would like to be able to have >slide tuning on my tenor. p[ From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 17:34:18 EST From: Trmbman@aol.com To: Zemry@aol.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: New Mute Message-ID: <4c.20b702f.25e5ba6a@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit What about one of the Harmon Mutes? Trombone and Euphonium Player Visit my Webpage at Http://Wactrm.tripod.com or contact me at Trmbman@aol.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 17:35:08 -0500 From: Larry Zaidan To: tubaeuph@onelist.com, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Tuba Mute on Ebay Message-ID: <3.0.6.32.20000223173508.008ebc50@127.0.0.1> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" For those of you who are interested, I have just put up a Ron Apperson mute on ebay. The mute is in good shape. Check it out at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=267889901 Ciao! From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 17:56:23 EST From: JoshuaSL@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Sackbutts in the Capital Message-ID: <13.1d3f518.25e5bf97@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey all, been away for a while but the muse struck me so I'm back on the list to see if I can maybe learn something. Anyways, here's the innaugural question of this go around (pardon my spelling). Does anyone know of an active early music consort/group in the Washington D.C. metro area that might be able to use a sackbutt? I acquired one a couple of years ago and am itching to use it for more than my own entertainment. Thanks, Joshua Bass Trombone, Northern Virginia Community College Community Orchestra @ Annandale From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 15:22:06 PST From: "posaune rex" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RE: arthur pryor Message-ID: <20000223232206.81472.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Mike Coyle said: >Listen to Pryor play "Thoughts of Love". There is such fluidity and grace >in the phrasing. It would be laughed at today and considered self >indulgent and grossly romanticized. But, I have yet to hear anyone play >that piece with as much feeling, whimsy, or simplicity. I'd just like to throw out my opinion of the best contemporary Pryor interpreter: Jim Erdman, professor of trombone at Lebanon Valley College/former soloist with the "President's Own". I studied with Mr. Erdman in high school and I must say he has an amazing ability to hold any listener's attention. Indeed, Erdman takes chances and plays in a style true to his heart: this being marked by fast vibrato and quite a bit of rubato (considered by many to be out-dated). But there has not been a single time when I've heard him play that I have not been enthralled for the entire performance. Erdman made a recording with the Lebanon Valley Band of some Pryor pieces as well as the Guilmant and Rimsky-Korsakov. In particular, his performance of "Thoughts of Love" is unbelievable. I would HIGHLY recommend to take a listen if you ever get the opportunity. (I'm not sure if its available through any distributors). Mike Clayville Eastman School of Music http://remember.to/practice ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 16:43:32 -0800 From: John and Robin Renegar To: TROMBONE-L@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: Trombone-elbow update Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Follow up from last November-December. I'm still having major problems with my left forearm. I've been through cortizone shots, icing, 2400 mg. Motrin per day, brace, rest, physical therapy. I still can't hold the horn up for more than 5 minutes per day. I've been referred to an orthopoedic surgeon to see if they need to go in and scrape it out. Right now it seems like a good thing that I teach English for a living. How would a pro cope with this? John Renegar renegar@mindspring.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 01:02:22 -0000 From: "Dynamic Music Publications" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <006801bf7e62$dea65240$9b9101d5@p8d3q> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit ----- Original Message ----- From: Sent: 23 February 2000 14:37 > I have a question for all the equipment design thinkers out there. > > Slide tuning instruments generally play in a way I like better than bell > tuning ones, ....etc A sort of related question. Is there a reason or even advantages or disadvantages in the position of the tuning slide. Trombone tuning slides are near to the bell, trumpets are closer to the mouthpiece, flugels are actually at the mouthpiece and tubas, well even tubists don't know where the the tuning slides are!! Cheers, Dave Dave Hankin, Hamilton, Scotland - DYNAMIC MUSIC PUBLICATIONS Specialists in Trombone Ensemble Music - www.btinternet.com/~dynamicmusic Adrian Drover/Dave Hankin Big Band - www.btinternet.com/~dynamicmusic/bigband From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 17:33:36 -0800 From: "Gary Maxwell" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Best Concert Times Message-ID: <000701bf7e67$2c9a3c60$fd02a5d1@maxwells> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Jim and all, I'm glad you brought this up. Even though it is not "trombone related", it most certainly is relevant to all of us. The orchestra I play in is looking at other performance options also, and I would like to hear ideas of "Best Concert Times". We presently perform on Sunday afternoons from 4:00 to 6:00 ish, but are hearing that there are "many?" interested in attending, but do not want to give up their last bit of the weekend. We just tried a Saturday evening that did, actually seem better attended and in years past we held our performances on Monday evenings, which is a pain to many of the musicians who are daytime workers in other careers that fulltime musicians. What are suggested times and days, for concerts? Help Jim and me out. All the best, Gary Maxwell Bass Trombone Bakersfield Symphony Orchestra ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ -Original Message- From: Jim Jaffe Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 6:53 AM Subject: Best Concert Times > Our brass quintet, Brassafrass, www.brassafrass.com, is giving a Sunday > concert April 30 at a local SF Bay Area church and we have been having a > debate wrt to what time of the day would be best to attract the biggest > audience. The arguments have been: > > 1) afternoon is not good because Californians spend their time outdoors on > the weekends > 2) Evening is not good because older people like to go to bed early > etc., etc. > > I would like any ideas. > > Thanks, > > Jim Jaffe > > > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 20:11:56 -0600 From: "Kenneth Dowdy" To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Best Concert Times Message-ID: <002301bf7e6c$87c0f200$9d1c0f3f@default> Gary, Most of the concerts that I have played in were on Sunday afternoon. All were very sparsely attended (maybe it has to do with my playing). The concerts that I usually attend are on Friday nights. This works the best for me because there is nothing that caps a week off and puts a good spin on the weekend like a concert. Just my opinion. Ken -----Original Message----- From: Gary Maxwell To: Trombones and related issues forum. Date: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 7:35 PM Subject: Re: Best Concert Times >Jim and all, > > I'm glad you brought this up. Even though it is not "trombone related", >it most certainly is relevant to all of us. > > The orchestra I play in is looking at other performance options also, >and I would like to hear ideas of "Best Concert Times". > > We presently perform on Sunday afternoons from 4:00 to 6:00 ish, but are >hearing that there are "many?" interested in attending, but do not want to >give up their last bit of the weekend. > > We just tried a Saturday evening that did, actually seem better attended >and in years past we held our performances on Monday evenings, which is a >pain to many of the musicians who are daytime workers in other careers that >fulltime musicians. > > What are suggested times and days, for concerts? Help Jim and me out. > >All the best, >Gary Maxwell >Bass Trombone >Bakersfield Symphony Orchestra >++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ >-Original Message- >From: Jim Jaffe Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 6:53 AM >Subject: Best Concert Times > > >> Our brass quintet, Brassafrass, www.brassafrass.com, is giving a Sunday >> concert April 30 at a local SF Bay Area church and we have been having a >> debate wrt to what time of the day would be best to attract the biggest >> audience. The arguments have been: >> >> 1) afternoon is not good because Californians spend their time outdoors on >> the weekends >> 2) Evening is not good because older people like to go to bed early >> etc., etc. >> >> I would like any ideas. >> >> Thanks, >> >> Jim Jaffe >> >> >> >> > > From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 20:57:24 -0600 From: Bob Koester To: TROMBONE-L@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <3.0.1.32.20000223205724.006c56d4@mail.spidertel.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 09:37 AM 2/23/2000 -0500, you wrote: >Sabutin wrote in part: > Can anyone think of a reason that the horn manufacturers in the heyday >of slide tuning horns...the '20s + '30s...didn't use a crook on the bottom >of the slide? I've always preferred the way slide tuning instruments play too. In the mid '60's, I asked both Bob Giardinelli and Peppy why that tuning slide construction fell out of favor. Each had the same answer (although expressed in different words). The answer was that most busy players didn't pay sufficient attention to lubricating the tuning slides. So, with use and lack of lubrication, the tuning slides got tighter, adjusting them became more difficult, and consequentially, undue stress (causing impaired action) was put on the hand slides. Sabutin's question wonders about '20's and '30's vintage trombone makers. Given the above I suspect that the manufacturers recognized that it was much cheaper (and more reliable from a marketing perspective) to make horns with bell tuning Hope this helps. Best to all, Bob > > While we're at it...does Edwards still offer slide tuning as an option, >has anyone played an Edwards slide tuning slide, and is anyone else making >slide tuning horns anywhere in the world? > > Thanks... > > S. > > > _______________________ bob koester mediation services, inc. bkoester@fixbusinessdebt.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 19:34:17 -0800 From: "Gary Maxwell" To: , "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Best Concert Times Message-ID: <000d01bf7e78$08a26920$d402a5d1@maxwells> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit From: Kenneth Dowdy Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 6:11 PM Subject: Re: Best Concert Times > Gary, > > Most of the concerts that I have played in were on Sunday afternoon. All > were very sparsely attended (maybe it has to do with my playing) I was beginning to think the same way, but with my tuning in the slide, gold plated mpc, Teflon treated slide, and laquerless bell, that just couldn't be! Could it? (:>)) I agree with the Friday night concert, if I'm not the one concretizing. After a week of middle schoolers, I would have a terrible time even picking up my ax, errr.. that too! All the best Gary Maxwell From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 23:30:16 -0600 From: "Adolphus Sprott" To: "Trombone-L" Subject: scholarships Message-ID: <000301bf7e88$4af0a480$4ef6490c@default> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Does anyone know of any musical (trombone) scholarships that are available for high school seniors? I am desperately looking for ways to pay for college next year. Any help would be appreciated. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 00:33:57 EST From: Jkink14714@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: ISO: Tbn related content in SLC, UT Message-ID: <46.1fc3355.25e61cc5@aol.com> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hi all! I happen to be in Salt Lake City for a few months on business, and was wondering if anyone out there would know of anything musically interesting happening in the general area. I'm specifically looking for blues/jazz jam sessions or rehearsal bands, somewhere that I could get some playing time while I'm on the road. I only have a small-bore tenor with me, so any bass playing is out. Any information would be most appreciated. thanks Jim Kinkella From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 11:00:08 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: BassBonist@aol.com Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <200002241600.LAA00800@smtp7.atl.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:41 PM 2/23/00 -0500, you wrote: >sabutin writes: > ><< Slide tuning instruments generally play in a way I like better than bell > tuning ones,>> > >For me, too. > > < serious drawback. It can be dealt with, but in this time of technological > breakthroughs it shouldn't have to be.>> > >The weight of a standard weight Bach 50 bass trombone (outer) handslide is >about 9.5 ounces (275 grams) and my Conn 62H outer slide with tuning weighs >in at 10.2 ounces (290 grams). On a tenor, the difference could be similar >but maybe even less. To me, less than an ounce of difference is not a >drawback. I laugh when some players look at my slide and shake their heads >in dismay, "I bet that heavy slide is a real drag, huh?" > > <>================== Matt... Well, it isn't a drag 99% of the time. I find it IS a drag during REALLY fast jazz playing, and also when you try to use slide vibrato. ======================== > >I have seen instruments other than Conn that have a movable crook, so it was >a viable idea at the time and still is. The "shift" in design may have been >precipitated by players themselves. I can just imagine lunkheaded players >resting their slides on the floor and inadvertently going sharp and >complaining about having to reach down to pull the crook tuning slide out >again. "Gee, if they could just solder this section and put the tuning UP >HERE." Brass players are a fickle lot. ================== Yeah, makes sense...I had to break myself of that habit w/my valve trombone. ======================= > > What some manufacturers don't like to spend money on is RETOOLING >to be able to make a "new" style of component. (Even if it is a viable, older >design.) ===================== I know. I've talked to a number of manufacturers and always gotten a variation on "Well, how many of these horns can you GUARANTEE we'll sell if we do this?" ========================= > >The construction of a slide with tuning is not that different from a slide >without. >If you compare one with a non-tunable slide you can see the only differences >are: the outer sleeves on the tunable version are not soldered to the tubes >(and are both slightly longer) and there is a threaded screw with stop nuts >to lock the tubes in place. "Modern" slides use the shortest possible >nickel-silver sleeves to add stability in the area of the handbrace, but try >to keep the added "weight" to a minimum. >After all, this is what the market has dictated. > >As long as the outer sleeves are both of sufficient length and have a small >length of sleeve soldered below the moveable sleeves, a slide with tuning can >be built by any competent brass technician with the right sizes of tubing, >for only a few dollars more than a typical slide. The problem is that >manufacturers are just not motivated to do this for those of us who know the >plus side of slide tuning instruments. > >Matt Varho > =================== I know...I'll probably end up spending a lot of money top have someone custom fabricate some slide tuning slides to go w/the wonderful old no tuning slide bells I've accumulated over the past several years. I just keep hoping ... S. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 09:21:50 -0600 From: "Lawrence Borden" To: Cc: "Trombone-L" Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Al, Let me tell you about my alto mp epiphany. I was playing a Mozart Requiem and was unhappy with the sound. At the time I was playing a Yamaha Alto with a Bach 7c. It just didn't sound very light and vocal. It sounded like a small tenor. At the suggestion of someone I tried a 12c, but that didn't seem to make much difference. Then Susan Smith suggested I try a 15c. I balked - I mean, come on... a 15c??? Well I was very surprised - it sounded wonderful. This mouthpiece not only made the Yamaha sound lighter and brighter, it also seemed to improve the basic intonation of the horn. After that I did several swaps back and forth, but always decided the 15c sounded best by far. Since I moved to an Edwards alto I have found that the 12c is a better fit for sound and intonation. The 15c just doesn't work on that horn very well. I have used the 12c ever since. As for the "keep the rim" POV. Well, we are at an each-to-his-own point here. I understand the philosophy of keeping the rim and changing the depth for the maintenance of the musculature of the embouchure, but I also think we are more flexible than that. I seem to have no trouble swapping between the 12c and my Greg Black 5G-4G. Now, I might have a different opinion if I had to switch very quickly between instruments, but usually there is time to play a few notes - and that is all it seems to take for my body to adapt. Besides the differing "feel" of having an alto in your hands (as opposed to the tenor) is a very powerful stimulus for recall of the physical responses that need adapting. I have a point about the alto sound here that I want to come back to. That is stream segregation. If we are playing music in which the vertical structure moves homophonically, like a hymn or a choral, then we probably don't want to be playing different sizes of trombones, or even different brands if possible. We want the *Chord* to be heard instead of the individual lines. We want to make stream segregation difficult for the listener. However, if we are playing music in which each instrument is functioning contrapuntally, and Mozart Requiem is a great example, we would want to enable the chorus members and the audience to be able to follow individual lines. To facilitate this, we need to uses different sounding instruments on each of the three parts. Alto, small tenor, large tenor is a pretty good way to go and allows us to sound beautiful in chords, but helps the listener with the stream segregation task. Just had to get that off my chest... Larry Lawrence Borden Nashville Symphony Orchestra Vanderbilt University -----Original Message----- From: Al MacDonald [mailto:almacdonald@att.net] Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 11:23 PM To: 'Lawrence Borden' Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Larry, The Nashville Symphony in Carnegie Hall - well, shucks! That should be good fun. I was actually asking what round trombone-l is up to on slide lubricants, because of your comment on round XXIII of celebrity death buzzing. It was a lame joke. Still, I use SOM also. It's particularly good if you're lazy (as Ted Foreman pointed out) - the lack of buildup helps if you don't clean the slide as often as you should. Ted, btw, has been advanced in the Singapore Symphony auditions and is going to Germany at the beginning of April for the next round (semi-final, finals in Singapore, unless somebody really stands out). You mentioned altos recently in relation to the Equali - I've been getting a lot of alto parts lately (Schumann 4, Elijah) and have started messing around with a borrowed alto (actually a reasonably well done cut-down tenor). I have a Yamaha alto on order - curious about your thoughts on alto mouthpieces. Greg Black tells me that a lot of guys use the same rim as tenor with a shallow cup, I'm on a GB 5G for tenor, so would use a small shank 5C, for example. He tells me Alessi uses an "Alessi 1" rim even on the alto (somewhere between a Bach 2 and 3 rim!!). Others say to use a "real" alto mp. Just curious about your opinion. btw, just because you sold me a horn doesn't mean you have to dispense free advice. I do find your opinions reasonable, though, and enjoy our conversations if you don't mind the time. Al -----Original Message----- From: Lawrence Borden [SMTP:Lawrence.Borden@home.com] Sent: Wednesday, February 23, 2000 11:15 PM To: almacdonald@att.net Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Al, No we haven't been anywhere near Colorado. We are going to New York - Carnegie Hall in September though. Big doings for us! As for slide lube. I am a Slide-O-Mix fan. It doesn't build up and makes my slide slicker than any other product I've tried. I'm sure it doesn't last as long, but... who cares? It's fast! Larry -----Original Message----- From: Al MacDonald [mailto:almacdonald@att.net] Sent: Tuesday, February 22, 2000 11:24 PM To: 'Lawrence.Borden@home.com' Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing Larry, I got a shock a couple of days ago when I heard on NPR that "the Nashville Symphony Orchestra" had all its funding cut off. Finally figured out that they were talking about the South African "National Symphony Orchestra". Whew. By the way, didn't Nashville to a tour that came through Colorado recently? Were you on board? And since you're keeping track, what round are we up to on slide lubricants? Cheers, Al -----Original Message----- From: Lawrence Borden [SMTP:Lawrence.Borden@home.com] Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 11:45 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: RE: Mouthpiece Buzzing And now: Round XXIII of Celebrity Death buzzing. Who will win this time around? Lawrence Borden Vanderbilt University Nashville Symphony Orchestra -----Original Message----- From: owner-trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu [mailto:owner-trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu]On Behalf Of c568667@showme.missouri.edu Sent: Monday, February 21, 2000 10:57 PM To: Trombones and related issues forum. Subject: Mouthpiece Buzzing I am interested in knowing finding out two things: what are the benefits of buzzing or not buzzing? and if you buzz how much time does it take up in your daily practice routine? Seth Merenbloom From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 16:01:59 -0000 From: "Kevan Lomas" To: "Trombone list" Subject: RE: Trombone-elbow update Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit > John Renegar > renegar@mindspring.com > wrote on the Subject: Trombone-elbow update > > > Follow up from last November-December. I'm still having major > problems with my left forearm. ...... How would a pro cope with this? > > John/list Check out the Rath trombone web site http://www.rathtrombones.com/ and follow the link to repairs and customisation. The page shows details of a trombone stand which takes the weight of the 'bone and allows the left hand to work the triggers. There is a photo on the page and email address if you want more details. The stand was built for Ian Davies of the English Northern Philharmonia Orchestra who had to stop playing after developing problems with his left arm, thanks to this stand he is now playing again. Regards Kevan Lomas Bass Trombone Warrington England kevan.lomas@virgin.net remember: Nil significat, nisi oscillat. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 00:50:06 -0500 From: Randy Campora To: bkoester@fixbusinessdebt.com, "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <4.2.0.58.20000224003002.009af880@mail.telephonet.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed Seems like to get full benefit out of tuning in the slide, you would need to go back and eliminate the tuning slide in the bell. The Edwards tuning in the slide was available as of a year ago, it was 100.00USD more than the normal slide, as I recall. It is a tempting idea, but if you are going to plop it on a horn that still has the other tuning slide it seems like you don't gain much. I was talking (more like dreaming out loud) with Todd Clontz recently about a sort of half measure: tuning would still be in the bell, but it would be two pieces, not three as it comes out of the valves, i.e. one piece would start at the neck pipe and go all the way to the start of the bell flare with a constant taper, where the ferrule (sp?) would be, then the bell flare would be the second piece. You eliminate the first ferrule but keep the second one, and the tuning mechanism would be made by moving the bell in or out along slotted, screwed-down braces attached to the main bell braces running parallel to the bell. So you have more tapered tubing and less straight ferrules, but you still have one ferrule. The questions I have about my idea are: 1) Would it really be any advantage over the present three-piece design (neckpipe, tuning slide, bell flare), and 2) Would it be a pain to have the bell in a slightly different spot when the tuning changed? Personally, I don't move my tuning slide much at all, because I play with the same people under the same conditions 98% or the time. So mine would pretty much stay put. One advantage would be for in-line basses, which, because of the space the valves take up, lose the tapered neck pipe (I am thinking mostly of Thayer valves, but also rotaries have the same problem). The one-piece tuning slide would be sort of make up for the lack of a neck pipe like the tenor has. Dependent horns don't have the neck-pipe problem. I betcha a horn would play better if you could find somebody to make tuning in the bottom crook of the slide (and find a way not to make it too bottom heavy in terms of balance) and make a one piece like the old Conns. If I could get a Bach 50 version of that with a couple of Thayers, I might never miss a note for the rest of my life...and I might play so musically that young grandmothers would fling themselves onto the stage from the terrace just to be near me, or at least to inspect my tuning-in-the-slide contraption... Oh, a brass player's lot is quite a thing... -Randy Campora ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Randy Campora, Bass Trombonist Baltimore Symphony Orchestra Peabody Conservatory of Music campora@peabody.jhu.edu 410-461-1984 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 11:27:36 -0600 From: j.grisham@pmail.net (Josh Grisham) To: TROMBONE-L@LISTS.MISSOURI.EDU Subject: Rimsky-Korsakov Concerto Message-ID: <200002241727.LAA12618@po.missouri.edu> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" Last Saturday, Joseph Silverstein (sp?) guest conducted the Amarillo Youth Symphony Orchestra for a rehearsal to help us out and so that we would be able to get a good experience out of the deal. Well, anyway, he was telling us about one of his old friends who was a Russian pianist, and he told us that the way his friend stayed "in shape" and "up to par" was by promising himself that he would practice at least 4 hours a day, every day, and any that he missed, he would owe to himself the next day. Well, I've recently decided to promise myself that I will practice at least 2 1/2 hours a day, in the same manner. It will probably be increased whenever I get to college, but for now, this seems like a good amount of time. Anyway, with all this extra time, and with no more big auditions really coming up for me, I kind of ran out of stuff to play. So, I decided to work up the Rimsky-Korsakov Concerto so that I may get a chance to be featured on it this summer at WT Band Camp. Anyway, I have a couple of questions about this piece, and I think I can get most of them answered from you all. The piece I am playing is the one edited by Davis Shuman, and I do know for a fact that many, if not all, of the 8va markings were not originally supposed to be in the song. So, I guess I was wondering, are any of the markings correct, even in the "8va down" section? If none are original, and only added by Shuman, then I will ignore all of them. I want to try to play this piece the original way that Rimsky-Korsakov wanted it. I also understand that the cadenzas are incorrect, and that they were simply thrown out and new ones written so that the piece would be more flashy and showy. Searching through the list archives, I saw a post that said that someone had some sort of file with the original cadenzas on it. I believe that this was Mr. Phil Brink who was the sender of the file, if my memory from the post serves. Mr. Brink, if you are still on the list, would you be so kind as to send these files to me, or tell me where I can find a transcript of the original cadenzas for the piece? I would be very greatful. Thank you very much. Also, any additional information about the piece would be appreciated. I really want to try and present the meaning of the piece that Korsakov meant it to be, but also with a touch of myself in it as well. If anyone has any suggestions or any comments about the piece, then please let me know. Thank you very much! --Josh Grisham <>< j.grisham@pmail.net From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 09:52:01 -0600 From: "R Miller" To: "listserv posting address" Subject: Antique King FS Message-ID: <001701bf7edf$1723eb60$f0e41d18@ce.mediaone.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0014_01BF7EAC.CC358F00"
Silver King from around 1917. Silverplated. Good slide, plays well. Be worked on by Wayne Tanabe. Modern case. reserve is $200.
 
 
 
 From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 07:01:30 EST From: Zemry@aol.com To: weslanke@worldnet.att.net, trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: scholarships Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Have you talked to your guidance counselor yet? Filled out any financial aid applications? Most high schools, at least mine in the dark ages of 1974, are not really on the ball as far as financial aid is concerned. I think that most colleges offer band scholarships, especially marching bands, that cover tuition. Contact the financial aid departments of the schools that you are interested in and their music departments and find out what they have to offer. If you can use the computer then you should have no problem finding out who to contact. Have them send you financial aid applications. Talk to the trombone instructors and music department heads. The key is to be aggressive in seeking out financial aid. Don't concentrate on just "trombone" scholarships. Seek out academic scholarships, if you qualify. Seek out work-study programs. I would also recommend at least three universities in Louisiana that would definitely interested in a player of your ability. 1. Southern University in Baton Rouge. 2. Grambling University in Grambling. 3. University of Louisiana in Monroe(formerly called Northeast Louisiana University). They are all public schools and prices are not outrageous. Of course, there is no harm in trying places like Eastman, Berklee or Julliard.....you never know. Good luck. I will assist you in any manner that you need. Feel free to e-mail me either on list or off list. Richard Z. Johnson, Jr. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 11:49:26 -0600 From: "Guion, David" <8guion@jmls.edu> To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: RE: Rimsky-Korsakov Concerto Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain Josh Grisham wrote, > The piece I am playing is the one edited by Davis Shuman, and I do > know for a fact that many, if not all, of the 8va markings were not > originally supposed to be in the song. So, I guess I was wondering, are > any > of the markings correct, even in the "8va down" section? If none are > original, and only added by Shuman, then I will ignore all of them. I > want > to try to play this piece the original way that Rimsky-Korsakov wanted it. > I also understand that the cadenzas are incorrect, and that they > were simply thrown out and new ones written so that the piece would be > more > flashy and showy. Searching through the list archives, I saw a post that > said that someone had some sort of file with the original cadenzas on it. > This question has come up more than once, so if you look in the archives, you should find plenty of information. Briefly, the original cadenza was printed several years ago in the ITA Journal. I think the archives will tell you exactly which issue. As for the other problems, I think you can safely ignore all of Shuman's 8vas, but that will not necessarily get you the original. If you are within reasonable commuting distance of a university music library that has Rimsky-Korsakov's complete works, you can look at that. A reference librarian will be happy to help you find the right volume. If you cannot get to the complete works set, the next best thing would be to lose the Shuman edition and buy something else. I'm sure the list will have all sorts of advice on the strengths and weaknesses of the various editions. Something else to look for (besides RK's own notes, rhythms, dynamics and articulations) is how playable the piano reduction is. Even if you have a chance to play it with a band, it is good to work out the ensemble problems, counting, staying together, etc. with a pianist first. The reduction that comes with the International Music edition (Gibson?) is nearly unplayable. > ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ David Guion, Cataloger John Marshall Law School 315 S. Plymouth Ct. Chicago, IL 60604 Voice: (312) 427-2737 x 552 Fax; (312) 427-8307 "Outside of a dog, books are a man's best friend; inside of a dog, it's too dark to read"--Groucho Marx ^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^*^ From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 22:52:29 +0800 From: Philip Brink To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: RING?!?!?!?!? Message-ID: <38B545AD.EDD35DEA@attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Hey there! What is new about the Ring this summer? I called Ron Simon, but all I got was his phone message and don't expect a return call. Should I send an email message? What is his address? Other than that bit of urgency, what's up whese days? We are fighting for our lives against management who are seriously trying to [excuse my French] fuck us over completely. If I sign my contract [for ONE year!] I will lose in salary and retirement contributions US$1265.16 PER MONTH, as well as a season-end bonus of US$3077.41..... I haven't mentioned working conditions..... Phil From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 10:09:30 PST From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Mouthpiece Buzzing Message-ID: <20000224180930.55118.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed After attending a master class with Bill Watros (sp?), I started buzzing WITHOUT a mouthpiece. Iām not convinced thatās its better than buzzing with a mouthpiece, but it has several major advantages. It warms my lips up, so that when I do pick up the trombone Iām closer to ready to play. Most important for me, though, is that I donāt drool all over yourself, when I buzz without a mouthpiece. I buzz in the car and getting to work covered with drool is a bit of a shortcoming. I also donāt have this conversation going through my head about what would happen if I were in an accident with a mouthpiece in front of my face. DanP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 13:36:32 -0500 From: sabutin@mindspring.com To: campora@peabody.jhu.edu Cc: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: <200002241836.NAA09400@fb01.eng00.mindspring.net> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" At 12:50 AM 2/24/00 -0500, you wrote: >Seems like to get full benefit out of tuning in the slide, you would need >to go back and eliminate the tuning slide in the bell. ========================== Exactly. That's the ONLY reason to have a slide tuning system. The bell tuning slides are cylindrical interruptions of the continuous taper of the bell; slide tuning instruments play "better" (different, at any rate) because the bell taper is uninterrupted. I thought that was a given; that's why I didn't mention it. In addition, many (most?) of ther old slide tuning horns were dual bore, and some...my 76H...even had a taper in the hand slide crook. Thus, the greatest possible amount of taper while still having cylindrical handslides. =========================== The Edwards tuning >in the slide was available as of a year ago, it was 100.00USD more than the >normal slide, as I recall. It is a tempting idea, but if you are going to >plop it on a horn that still has the other tuning slide it seems like you >don't gain much. > >I was talking (more like dreaming out loud) with Todd Clontz recently about >a sort of half measure: tuning would still be in the bell, but it would be >two pieces, not three as it comes out of the valves, i.e. one piece would >start at the neck pipe and go all the way to the start of the bell flare >with a constant taper, where the ferrule (sp?) would be, then the bell >flare would be the second piece. You eliminate the first ferrule but keep >the second one, and the tuning mechanism would be made by moving the bell >in or out along slotted, screwed-down braces attached to the main bell >braces running parallel to the bell. So you have more tapered tubing and >less straight ferrules, but you still have one ferrule. > ======================= Not a bad idea...only one way to find out.... Only question I would have would be how it would affect the player's conception of "positions". I regularly play a number of different trombones, and even a couple of different bells on the same slide. I have noticed, on one varying setup particularly (a Conn 32H "Burkle" slide that I play w/both the 32H bell that belongs to it and an old 78H 7 1/2" rose brass bell) that the different lengths of bell can be quite subconsciously quite confusing if I'm playing w/my eyes open. (Us jazz players can get away w/closing our eyes a lot.) The 32H appears to me to have been designed by Burkle as an attempt (mostly successful, in my opinion) to get the attributes of a slide tuning horn in one w/bell tuning. He made it dual bore, tapered the hand slide crook, made the slides a little shorter and the bell correspondingly longer, and actually went so far as to taper the inner tuning slides. Plays great...but I don't like the yellow brass of which all of the bells I've seen are made. I tried the Burkle slide w/my 78H red brass bell, and LOVED the sound. (Doesn't quite play as easily or evenly as the Burkle bell, but at volume it holds together much better, and at all volumes it's a darker, fuller sound.) As a result, I use the 78H bell for most solo and some lead work, and the Burkle bell for more commercial lead. The Burkle bell is substantially longer,and if I'm not careful when I switch from one to the other, my 2cd, 3rd, and 4th positions get subtly deformed I wonder how much of an issue that would be on a horn w/a moveable bell. I also wonder..how would you not interrupt the taper in the bell and still have the flare moveable? Also...wouldn't that take a lot of fancy hardware, what w/braces and all? Slide tuning seems so elegantly simple, by comparison. ============================== > >I betcha a horn would play better if you could find somebody to make tuning >in the bottom crook of the slide (and find a way not to make it too bottom >heavy in terms of balance) and make a one piece like the old Conns. If I >could get a Bach 50 version of that with a couple of Thayers, I might never >miss a note for the rest of my life...and I might play so musically that >young grandmothers would fling themselves onto the stage from the terrace >just to be near me, or at least to inspect my tuning-in-the-slide >contraption... > >Oh, a brass player's lot is quite a thing... > > -Randy Campora > ==================== MAN !!! You're scoring w/the young GRANDMAS ??? (Ain't being a trombone player strange ???) Later... S. From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 10:42:18 PST From: "Daniel Pliskin" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Trombone-elbow update Message-ID: <20000224184218.95726.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Although most trombones come with whatās called a counterweight, it generally doesnāt do the job that a counterweight should do. Check it out. Hold your horn up as if you were going to play it. Now relax your hand a bit. Does the horn want to fall forward or roll out, away from your head? Thatās because the counterweight isnāt doing the job. When the counterweight isnāt doing its job, you need to hold that weight up with your hand. Iā for one, wouldnāt have kept playing if I hadnāt come up with a better counterweight. Counterweighing the horn can be complicated, but there are things that you can do that are easy. Initially, I removed my tuning slide and put a piece of pipe over the gooseneck side (Yes, then I replaced the tuning slide). That can help counterbalance the weight of the slide. If you want to eliminate the rolling action, caused by the bell being out beyond where your hand is, you can either hold the horn with the crotch of your thumb out further towards the bell or you can move the counterweight out further behind your head. I made a simple counterweight that attaches a stack of fender washers to the horn, up at the tuning slide, so that they cantilever out behind my head. I can play for hours at a time, with no pain and no stiffness in my hand. Contact me privately if you want more of an explanation of this gasmo. Itās hard to explain, so unless a lot of you want information about it, Iāll deal with it off line. DanP ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 13:42:22 EST From: BassBonist@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: F attachment Bass Trombone for sale Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Selling this for a friend. The instrument is at my home and I am familiar with it, so any questions can be directed to me. Yamaha YBL-621 bass trombone, serial number 10,xxx. Red brass bell, 9.5", with F attachment. (Single rotor.) Slide is like new, lacquer is 98% perfect, just some minor scratches on the gooseneck. This horn plays dark and EVEN in all registers. It is very similar to my Conn 60H in sound and feel. Good horn in an orchestra setting or for a tenor doubler who doesn't want to spend a ton of money. Another plus is that the seller is a brass repair tech and can accept a credit card for payment if needed. Price: $800 US firm, plus shipping and insurance. Matt From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 15:41:09 -0500 From: "Jeffrey Diehl" To: , Subject: Re: Slide tuning design questions Message-ID: Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=US-ASCII Content-Disposition: inline Content-Transfer-Encoding: 8bit Randy Campora wrote: >>>If I could get a Bach 50 version of that with a couple of Thayers, I might never miss a note for the rest of my life...and I might play so musically that young grandmothers would fling themselves onto the stage from the terrace just to be near me, or at least to inspect my tuning-in-the-slide contraption... And the next thing you know, Randy, you'd be into jazz improvisation! :-) All the best, Jeff Diehl From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 19:28:24 EST From: Trmbman@aol.com To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Euph ? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII" Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit I have a quick question. Are the grime gutters they sell at Woodwinds and Brasswinds the covers to put over the bottom of the valve casings. I would like to keep the valve oil of my clothes Trombone and Euphonium Player Visit my Webpage at Http://Wactrm.tripod.com or contact me at Trmbman@aol.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 08:32:12 +0800 From: Philip Brink To: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: RING?!?!?!?!? Message-ID: <38B5CD8C.90E7EDC3@attglobal.net> MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Philip Brink wrote: > Hey there! What is new about the Ring this summer? I called Ron Simon, but all > I got was his phone message and don't expect a return call. Should I send an > email message? What is his address? I am very sorry about this - and very embarrassed! I THOUGHT I sent this privately. Please accept my humblest apologies for this error! Phil Brink From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 17:54:53 PST From: "Aaron Roth" To: trombone-l@lists.missouri.edu Subject: Re: Doug Yeo Signature Mouthpiece Message-ID: <20000225015453.87423.qmail@hotmail.com> Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed Doug Yeo wrote: ><<...The original model in gold is rather expensive - may >people have purchased it and like it. However, the cost is more than >a little stretch for many people who otherwise might buy a Schilke 60 or >Bach 1G instead. By offering the mouthpiece in silverplate at a >lower price, Yamaha is making the mouthpiece available to a whole >different marketplace. For those wanting all the benefits of the >original design, that will still be available. For those whom price >is a significant deciding factor, the new all silverplate model is an >option which I think will still compare favorably with other >mouthpieces of similar sizes. >> Good call, I daresay. Were I to take an interest in purchasing one of the gold variety, either I'd have to wait until someone put one up for sale below market price (which doesn't happen often) or I'd have to do a payment plan for one. :P I'm getting unhappy with my mouthpiece. It passed the grace period with nary a hitch, but I feel that I'm starting to work too hard now. My playing situation has changed from during the first semester; I'm playing more hours a day and I'm constantly switching between bass trombone and oboe. The strain on my chops may be aggravated by the large, unruly mouthpiece I'm using, a Schilke 60. I like the size okay, and except for the tendency to go flat up high, it does fairly well throughout the range, for me. I'm starting to look at the Yamaha Doug Yeo mouthpiece. I played a Stork 1S for a while, a Bach 1.5 G, a Marcinkiewicz George Roberts, and I've tried a Wick 0AL and a Bach 1G. Nothing has worked particularly better than anything else, and each mouthpiece presented me with its own specific disadvantages. Here's one more that I'm going to try pretty soon, and if I don't like it, well, the market for Yamaha signature mouthpieces is pretty healthy. Now that they're affordable, I think I'm going to try one out soon. And hey: let's say I buy a silver Yamaha Doug Yeo Signature mouthpiece at suggested retail price: $59.50 (quoting Mr. De Paolo). Presently, I send it to Anderson Silver Plating Co. to have it plated in gold for, say, $40 (including buffing, if I understand the process appropriately). I spent about $100 total, which is $40 under the going rate for the double-plated model. Add shipping, a few dollars extra. Most likely, the silver model will be sold at something below suggested retail, bringing the total cost down even more. Incidentally, the Mouthpiece Express offers the lowest price I've yet seen on the gold-plated model: $124.95. Good Day, Aaron Roth ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com From ???@??? Fri Feb 25 07:54:37 2000 Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 21:49:38 -0600 (Central Standard Time) From: "Talley, Brian Lee" To: Trmbman@aol.com Cc: "Trombones and related issues forum." Subject: Re: Euph ? Message-ID: MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; CHARSET=US-ASCII Yes, the grime gutters they sell at Brasswind are the little sleave-like things that fit over the bottom of your valves. I don't know what kind of horn you have but I discovered a good alternative to that that works well on my horn (a Sterling). I was attending a concert given by the Colonial Brassband from Melbourne, Australia and saw that one of their euphonium player there had these tentacle-like things hanging from his horn. After the concert I took a closer inspection and all they were were plastic tubes from a hardware store fitted onto the bottom nipples of the valves. Incidentally he was playing on a Hirsbruner. It was a quick at cheap alternative to Brasswinds product. I just found the right diameter tubing and cut it to a length so that it would empty down just past my leg. They do look a bit silly but I always took them off during a performance. If you need anymore insight feel free to write back. Brian Talley Bass-bone at the Blair School of Music/Vanderbilt University On Thu, 24 Feb 2000 19:28:24 EST Trmbman@aol.com wrote: > I have a quick question. Are the grime gutters they sell at Woodwinds and > Brasswinds the covers to put over the bottom of the valve casings. I would > like to keep the valve oil of my clothes > > Trombone and Euphonium Player > Visit my Webpage at > Http://Wactrm.tripod.com > or contact me at Trmbman@aol.com ----------------------------------------------------------------- Talley, Brian Lee Vanderbilt University Email: brian.l.talley@Vanderbilt.Edu